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View Full Version : Is the idea that Pre-tribulationalism before Darby existed false?



setsurinvich
05-11-2017, 06:00 PM
Many evangelicals believe that they will be taken to heaven before the start of a 7 year tribulation, from what I can tell it was basically invented by John Nelson Darby, but there are now evangelicals claiming that early Christians taught the same thing! Is that just really bad citiations out of context by people disperate to validate their belief?

http://beginningandend.com/what-did-ancient-church-fathers-believe-about-the-rapture/

setsurinvich
05-11-2017, 06:13 PM
If any Christian can show me the proper context of his work it would be nice too thanks

Faber
05-12-2017, 09:09 AM
My understanding is that a Scottish teenager named Margaret McDonald would occasionally go into so-called prophetic trances. In 1830, during an illness, she went into a trance and proclaimed the "secret rapture". It then went on from her to Edward Irving of the Catholic Apostolic Church, then from him to Darby and the Plymouth Brethren. From there it eventually found its way into the Schofield Reference Bible.

KingsGambit
05-12-2017, 09:19 AM
My understanding is that a Scottish teenager named Margaret McDonald would occasionally go into so-called prophetic trances. In 1830, during an illness, she went into a trance and proclaimed the "secret rapture". It then went on from her to Edward Irving of the Catholic Apostolic Church, then from him to Darby and the Plymouth Brethren. From there it eventually found its way into the Schofield Reference Bible.

That is also my understanding, based on The Rapture Plot by Dave MacPherson. I will have to take a look at the passages from the ECF, but it's really difficult to figure out their contexts at first glance.

setsurinvich
05-12-2017, 11:03 AM
Well take a look at some of this guy's interpretations especially in the comments crazy...

37818
05-12-2017, 01:54 PM
The Apostle Paul made it clear that the rapture (1 Thessalonians 4:15-17) would not take place in any way before the dead in Christ were raised (Revelation 20:4-6).

Jedidiah
05-12-2017, 02:32 PM
If any Christian can show me the proper context of his work it would be nice too thanks

He includes links for Irenaeus and Cyprian. Did you check those out?

setsurinvich
05-12-2017, 07:00 PM
Yes I think he took them out of context want to know and confirm if you guys are seeing the same thing

Jedidiah
05-12-2017, 07:49 PM
Okay, I think he did not take them out of context. Just so you have someone to take pot shots at.

setsurinvich
05-12-2017, 09:46 PM
Cyprian used the word departed to refer to martyrs which means its not what he thinks "leaving" meant and also if this bloggers interpretation is correct then cyprian already believed he was in the tribulation as he said the disasters have already begun. As for ireanous he said that the ressecutection is at the end of the tribulation and that the anti Christ will attack the church before he claimed the church will be caught up.