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Nashville Statement

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  • Nashville Statement

    After hearing all the media coverage which has spilled outside the evangelical world (the mayor of Nashville has even stepped in to denounce it), I read through the Nashville Statement just now. I don't see anything I disagree with.

    https://cbmw.org/nashville-statement/
    "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

  • #2
    I have mixed views about it. The fact that it is a product of CBMW impels me to a bit of concern about what the wording says and does not say.

    Still contemplating.
    Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

    Beige Federalist.

    Nationalist Christian.

    "Everybody is somebody's heretic."

    Social Justice is usually the opposite of actual justice.

    Proud member of the this space left blank community.

    Would-be Grand Vizier of the Padishah Maxi-Super-Ultra-Hyper-Mega-MAGA King Trumpius Rex.

    Justice for Ashli Babbitt!

    Justice for Matthew Perna!

    Arrest Ray Epps and his Fed bosses!

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by NorrinRadd View Post
      I have mixed views about it. The fact that it is a product of CBMW impels me to a bit of concern about what the wording says and does not say.

      Still contemplating.
      One of the initial signatories, Robert Gagnon, is an egalitarian. He posted yesterday that he believes the wording is not intended to take a side on complementarianism/egalitarianism.
      "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

      Comment


      • #4
        Scot McKnight just criticized it because a lot of the CMBW crowd holds to an unorthodox view of the Trinity. To me, this is a cop-out. The statement should be considered on its own merits.
        "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

        Comment


        • #5
          I do not see anything I disagree with, unless I misread something it looks good to me.
          Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

          Comment


          • #6
            Intro says:

            This secular spirit of our age presents a great challenge to the Christian church. Will the church of the Lord Jesus Christ lose her biblical conviction, clarity, and courage, and blend into the spirit of the age? Or will she hold fast to the word of life, draw courage from Jesus, and unashamedly proclaim his way as the way of life? Will she maintain her clear, counter-cultural witness to a world that seems bent on ruin?

            We are persuaded that faithfulness in our generation means declaring once again the true story of the world and of our place in it—particularly as male and female
            Talks about male and female, but nothing about hierarchy in marriage or church

            Talks about marriage, but nothing about divorce

            Pretty much a joke, because of what is not there, also what they don't want to talk about!! Wants to talk 'truth, whole truth, and nothing bout truth' about male and female, but is something that both complementarians and egalitarians can sign.
            Last edited by demi-conservative; 08-31-2017, 02:58 AM.
            Remember that you are dust and to dust you shall return.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Jedidiah View Post
              I do not see anything I disagree with, unless I misread something it looks good to me.
              This.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by demi-conservative View Post

                Talks about marriage, but nothing about divorce
                Article 1 says "lifelong union". That automatically eliminates divorce.
                That's what
                - She

                Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
                - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

                I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
                - Stephen R. Donaldson

                Comment


                • #9
                  I downloaded the text:


                  Preamble
                  Evangelical Christians at the dawn of the twenty-first century find themselves living in a period
                  of historic transition. As Western culture has become increasingly post-Christian, it has
                  embarked upon a massive revision of what it means to be a human being. By and large the spirit
                  of our age no longer discerns or delights in the beauty of God’s design for human life. Many
                  deny that God created human beings for his glory, and that his good purposes for us include our
                  personal and physical design as male and female. It is common to think that human identity as
                  male and female is not part of God’s beautiful plan, but is, rather, an expression of an
                  individual’s autonomous preferences. The pathway to full and lasting joy through God’s good
                  design for his creatures is thus replaced by the path of shortsighted alternatives that, sooner or
                  later, ruin human life and dishonor God.

                  This secular spirit of our age presents a great challenge to the Christian church. Will the church
                  of the Lord Jesus Christ lose her biblical conviction, clarity, and courage, and blend into the
                  spirit of the age? Or will she hold fast to the word of life, draw courage from Jesus, and
                  unashamedly proclaim his way as the way of life? Will she maintain her clear, counter-cultural
                  witness to a world that seems bent on ruin?

                  We are persuaded that faithfulness in our generation means declaring once again the true story of
                  the world and of our place in it—particularly as male and female. Christian Scripture teaches that
                  there is but one God who alone is Creator and Lord of all. To him alone, every person owes gladhearted
                  thanksgiving, heart-felt praise, and total allegiance. This is the path not only of glorifying
                  God, but of knowing ourselves. To forget our Creator is to forget who we are, for he made us for
                  himself. And we cannot know ourselves truly without truly knowing him who made us. We did
                  not make ourselves. We are not our own. Our true identity, as male and female persons, is given
                  by God. It is not only foolish, but hopeless, to try to make ourselves what God did not create us
                  to be.

                  We believe that God’s design for his creation and his way of salvation serve to bring him the
                  greatest glory and bring us the greatest good. God’s good plan provides us with the greatest
                  freedom. Jesus said he came that we might have life and have it in overflowing measure. He is
                  for us and not against us. Therefore, in the hope of serving Christ’s church and witnessing
                  publicly to the good purposes of God for human sexuality revealed in Christian Scripture, we
                  offer the following affirmations and denials.

                  Article 1
                  WE AFFIRM that God has designed marriage to be a covenantal, sexual, procreative, lifelong
                  union of one man and one woman, as husband and wife, and is meant to signify the covenant
                  love between Christ and his bride the church.
                  WE DENY that God has designed marriage to be a homosexual, polygamous, or polyamorous
                  relationship. We also deny that marriage is a mere human contract rather than a covenant made
                  before God.

                  Article 2
                  WE AFFIRM that God’s revealed will for all people is chastity outside of marriage and fidelity
                  within marriage.
                  WE DENY that any affections, desires, or commitments ever justify sexual intercourse before or
                  outside marriage; nor do they justify any form of sexual immorality.

                  Article 3
                  WE AFFIRM that God created Adam and Eve, the first human beings, in his own image, equal
                  before God as persons, and distinct as male and female.
                  WE DENY that the divinely ordained differences between male and female render them unequal
                  in dignity or worth.

                  Article 4
                  WE AFFIRM that divinely ordained differences between male and female reflect God’s original
                  creation design and are meant for human good and human flourishing.
                  WE DENY that such differences are a result of the Fall or are a tragedy to be overcome.

                  Article 5
                  WE AFFIRM that the differences between male and female reproductive structures are integral
                  to God’s design for self-conception as male or female.
                  WE DENY that physical anomalies or psychological conditions nullify the God-appointed link
                  between biological sex and self-conception as male or female.

                  Article 6
                  WE AFFIRM that those born with a physical disorder of sex development are created in the
                  image of God and have dignity and worth equal to all other image-bearers. They are
                  acknowledged by our Lord Jesus in his words about “eunuchs who were born that way from their
                  mother's womb.” With all others they are welcome as faithful followers of Jesus Christ and
                  should embrace their biological sex insofar as it may be known.
                  WE DENY that ambiguities related to a person’s biological sex render one incapable of living a
                  fruitful life in joyful obedience to Christ.

                  Article 7
                  WE AFFIRM that self-conception as male or female should be defined by God’s holy purposes
                  in creation and redemption as revealed in Scripture.
                  WE DENY that adopting a homosexual or transgender self-conception is consistent with God’s
                  holy purposes in creation and redemption.

                  Article 8
                  WE AFFIRM that people who experience sexual attraction for the same sex may live a rich and
                  fruitful life pleasing to God through faith in Jesus Christ, as they, like all Christians, walk in
                  purity of life.
                  WE DENY that sexual attraction for the same sex is part of the natural goodness of God’s
                  original creation, or that it puts a person outside the hope of the gospel.

                  Article 9
                  WE AFFIRM that sin distorts sexual desires by directing them away from the marriage covenant
                  and toward sexual immorality— a distortion that includes both heterosexual and homosexual
                  immorality.
                  WE DENY that an enduring pattern of desire for sexual immorality justifies sexually immoral
                  behavior.

                  Article 10
                  WE AFFIRM that it is sinful to approve of homosexual immorality or transgenderism and that
                  such approval constitutes an essential departure from Christian faithfulness and witness.
                  WE DENY that the approval of homosexual immorality or transgenderism is a matter of moral
                  indifference about which otherwise faithful Christians should agree to disagree.

                  Article 11
                  WE AFFIRM our duty to speak the truth in love at all times, including when we speak to or
                  about one another as male or female.
                  WE DENY any obligation to speak in such ways that dishonor God’s design of his imagebearers
                  as male and female.

                  Article 12
                  WE AFFIRM that the grace of God in Christ gives both merciful pardon and transforming
                  power, and that this pardon and power enable a follower of Jesus to put to death sinful desires
                  and to walk in a manner worthy of the Lord.
                  WE DENY that the grace of God in Christ is insufficient to forgive all sexual sins and to give
                  power for holiness to every believer who feels drawn into sexual sin.

                  Article 13
                  WE AFFIRM that the grace of God in Christ enables sinners to forsake transgender selfconceptions
                  and by divine forbearance to accept the God-ordained link between one’s biological
                  sex and one’s self-conception as male or female.
                  WE DENY that the grace of God in Christ sanctions self-conceptions that are at odds with God’s
                  revealed will.

                  Article 14
                  WE AFFIRM that Christ Jesus has come into the world to save sinners and that through Christ’s
                  death and resurrection forgiveness of sins and eternal life are available to every person who
                  repents of sin and trusts in Christ alone as Savior, Lord, and supreme treasure.
                  WE DENY that the Lord’s arm is too short to save or that any sinner is beyond his reach.
                  Last edited by Sparko; 08-31-2017, 09:04 AM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    You missed the beginning of Article 1
                    That's what
                    - She

                    Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
                    - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

                    I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
                    - Stephen R. Donaldson

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Never heard of the CBMW, so I have no idea what their views on the trinity are or why they're considered controversial. I think I mostly agree with the statement. The only point I'm just a bit iffy on is Article 8,

                      "WE AFFIRM that people who experience sexual attraction for the same sex may live a rich and fruitful life pleasing to God through faith in Jesus Christ, as they, like all Christians, walk in purity of life."

                      While I think it's probably true that one can hold non-normative attractions, and still live a life that demonstrates fruit and can be in many ways still pleasing to God, I question whether or not that it's all that God desires for us. If we were talking about, say, those who hold non-normative desires for children, could they too live a rich and fruitful life pleasing to God as long as they walk in purity of life? Well, maybe yes, and maybe no. Is it purity of life to hold such a base attraction in the first place? I think a lot of Christians are now convinced that holding certain non-normative attractions are just the way of life for some people. That, like a physical deformity, they're just stuck with it like a curse, and I don't know if I agree with that, or that it's God's will and desire for that to be the case. We all struggle with sin, but as we mature as Christians it seems to me that we should desire to end certain of those struggles, if at all possible. That it is possible, and that we ought to seek transformation by the renewing of our minds, even it it takes divine intervention to get us there. I hurt for people who hurt, and the language I see in Article 8 is language I see among a lot of great Christian thinkers on the subject (William Lane Craig, for instance, would very much agree with this Article), but part of me feels like we give up on people who are struggling if we just tell them to (in so many words) "live with it". I don't know. I don't have all the answers, and maybe I'm wrong. I've discussed some of my thoughts on this subject here before, particularly here, where I feel I made the point better: http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/sh...l=1#post345830

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post
                        You missed the beginning of Article 1
                        fixed.

                        I had to download the pdf file and then OCR it to get the text. I am attaching the PDF here
                        Attached Files

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                          After hearing all the media coverage which has spilled outside the evangelical world (the mayor of Nashville has even stepped in to denounce it), I read through the Nashville Statement just now. I don't see anything I disagree with.

                          https://cbmw.org/nashville-statement/
                          News flash for the mayor of Nashville: do people think that the Chicago Statement is reflective of the views of Chicagoans generally? Do people think that the Manhattan Declaration is reflective of the views of the denizens of Manhattan? Er, no.
                          Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

                          Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
                          sigpic
                          I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Adrift View Post
                            Never heard of the CBMW, so I have no idea what their views on the trinity are or why they're considered controversial. ...
                            They are the "Council on Biblical Manhood and Womanhood." They are, IMO, the primary advocates of "complementarianism" (which is essentially a way of putting lipstick on the pig of "patriarchialism"). At least some of them hold to "eternal subordination" of the Son, a view often considered heterodox. (There is some speculation they arrived at this view in the course of trying to find ways to justify their view of the relative authority-status of men and women.)
                            Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

                            Beige Federalist.

                            Nationalist Christian.

                            "Everybody is somebody's heretic."

                            Social Justice is usually the opposite of actual justice.

                            Proud member of the this space left blank community.

                            Would-be Grand Vizier of the Padishah Maxi-Super-Ultra-Hyper-Mega-MAGA King Trumpius Rex.

                            Justice for Ashli Babbitt!

                            Justice for Matthew Perna!

                            Arrest Ray Epps and his Fed bosses!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post
                              Article 1 says "lifelong union". That automatically eliminates divorce.
                              It says God 'designed' it to be lifelong. I agree divorce is eliminated by text of article!

                              But many Christians will argue, also give excuse about how in this special special case design should be ignored??? They need stronger statement about divorce, since so many divorces happen!!!!
                              Remember that you are dust and to dust you shall return.

                              Comment

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