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Terraceth
01-06-2019, 06:19 PM
Anyone (possibly one of the Orthodox Christians here) able to explain to me what all the hubbub is between the Russian Orthodox Church and the Greek Orthodox Church that apparently led to one of them forbidding communion to the other? I've tried reading up on it but it's kind of confusing to an outsider. All I've really got is that the dispute seems to be over the status of the Ukraine Orthodox Church.

One Bad Pig
01-08-2019, 02:10 PM
There have been three Ukrainian Orthodox Churches for the past couple decades; two had been in schism, and the other has been under the effective control of Moscow for 3 1/2 centuries. Given the quasi-war between Ukraine and Russia, that puts them in a bit of a tough spot. The Patriarch of Constantinople decided that he would revoke what he saw as temporary permission for Moscow to control Kiev, reunite the three Ukrainian churches, and grant the reunified church autocephaly (similar to autonomy). The Patriarch of Moscow didn't like that, and broke communion with Constantinople in protest. Moscow has withdrawn from pan-Orthodox organizations, forbidden its clergy to assist in services with clergy under Constantinople (and vice versa), and forbidden its laymen to receive communion from clergy under Constantinople.

I'm not convinced that either side is entirely in the right; it will likely take a pan-Orthodox council to straighten out. I'm just a layman, though, so it's all way above my paygrade. :sigh:

Terraceth
01-09-2019, 08:09 PM
There have been three Ukrainian Orthodox Churches for the past couple decades; two had been in schism, and the other has been under the effective control of Moscow for 3 1/2 centuries. Given the quasi-war between Ukraine and Russia, that puts them in a bit of a tough spot. The Patriarch of Constantinople decided that he would revoke what he saw as temporary permission for Moscow to control Kiev, reunite the three Ukrainian churches, and grant the reunified church autocephaly (similar to autonomy). The Patriarch of Moscow didn't like that, and broke communion with Constantinople in protest. Moscow has withdrawn from pan-Orthodox organizations, forbidden its clergy to assist in services with clergy under Constantinople (and vice versa), and forbidden its laymen to receive communion from clergy under Constantinople.

I'm not convinced that either side is entirely in the right; it will likely take a pan-Orthodox council to straighten out. I'm just a layman, though, so it's all way above my paygrade. :sigh:That's a good explanation. Thanks!

Dante
02-19-2019, 02:54 AM
Addendum: it's not only Moscow that thinks Constantinople was overreaching in revoking an earlier ban on the Ukrainian schismatics. Almost the rest of Orthodoxy believes that Constantinople should at least hold a council before they can decide on such matters.

One Bad Pig
02-23-2019, 09:39 AM
Addendum: it's not only Moscow that thinks Constantinople was overreaching in revoking an earlier ban on the Ukrainian schismatics. Almost the rest of Orthodoxy believes that Constantinople should at least hold a council before they can decide on such matters.
Autocephaly has never been a smooth process; what's unusual about this time is that Constantinople granted it rather than it being arrogated by the church involved (though this more or less happened with the OCA as well; even half a century on, I don't know that any other body has acknowledged its autocephaly).