We already got ourselves a bona fide terrorist...what was HE dong here, I wonder...

[Epoetker]

http://www.nationalreview.com/ledeen/ledeen032003b.asp

"According to UPI, the Palestine Liberation Front said Thursday one of its guerrillas was killed during the U.S. missile strikes on Iraq. A PLF statement released in the southern city of Sidon (Syrian-occupied Lebanon) identified the slain guerrilla as 1st Lieutenant Ahmed Walid Raguib al-Baz who was killed early Thursday "while confronting the treacherous U.S. air bombardment on Iraq."

I don't know anything about the late Mr. Al-Baz, but I know all too much about the PLF and its evil leader, Abu Abbas. This was the group that organized the hijacking of the Italian cruise ship, the Achille Lauro back in the mid-1980s. They segregated the American passengers from the rest, and then courageously pushed an American Jewish paraplegic in his wheelchair, Leon Klinghoffer, into the Mediterranean. We tried to have Abu Abbas arrested in Italy, but he escaped through Yugoslavia to Yemen.

The PLF has long been one of the most lethal Palestinian terrorist groups, and achieved notoriety for its high-tech killings. Recently, Abu Abbas had come to live in the Palestinian Authority, but when Israel moved against the terrorists there he ran away — to Baghdad. The PLF has been one of the main conduits for Iraqi money to Palestinian suicide bombers.

So, in a single stroke, we have demonstrated the rightness of our cause and the wisdom of President Bush. It makes no sense to distinguish between the terrorists and the regimes that support them, for they are one and the same. We targeted a high-level meeting of top Iraqi officials, and willy-nilly eliminated a member of the terror network. Time will tell just how good and how lucky we were in the opening salvo of the Second Gulf War. But there is already cause for satisfaction."

But...but...I thought our enlightened media policy people said Saddam would NEVER cooperate with terrorist groups! Guess Vorkosigan must've been working for them:wink:

[Eyeheart Pumpkin]

Today @ 02:10 AM here (http://www.theologyweb.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=42296#post42296)
Epoetker:So, in a single stroke, we have demonstrated the rightness of our cause and the wisdom of President Bush.
No. But keep trying, you might eventually get it right.

[kiwimac]

Oh Yes, God Forfend that someone might feel called to defend their fellow-arabs. **** will they never learn!

Kiwimac

[Vorkosigan]

[bBut...but...I thought our enlightened media policy people said Saddam would NEVER cooperate with terrorist groups! Guess Vorkosigan must've been working for them:wink: [/b]

Nobody in the media has ever made that claim. In fact, the media reported terrorist organizations operating in the corners of Iraq. And of course, Pakistan hosts them too, and Al Qaeda and the Pakistani intelligence services have close connections, and then there is the whole Kashmir thing, which Pakistan is knee-deep in. By your logic, we're bombing the wrong country. But since it isn't about terrorism anyway, it's not really important.

I suppose, with a reading problem like yours, that you should have logic problems too. According to you, a terrorist is in Iraq so that means Hussein is working with terrorists. The IRA has men in Boston, so that must mean Bush supports terrorism :duh:

Where was he killed? You didn't catch the part about the strikes against many different parts of Iraq, did you, including areas under Kurdish control where Islamic extremists operate. Did the PLF mention what he was doing there and where he was killed?

Vorkosigan

Besides, if it is a connection to "terror" you want, then check out Hussein's payments to the families of suicide bombers in Palestine. IDF intelligence even has the canceled checks, from what I've heard. He began in March of 2002. Long after Bush and the NeoCons decided to attack Iraq, though.

Vorkosigan

[Alden]

Today @ 05:07 AM here (http://www.theologyweb.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=42330#post42330)
Vorkosigan:


Besides, if it is a connection to "terror" you want, then check out Hussein's payments to the families of suicide bombers in Palestine. IDF intelligence even has the canceled checks, from what I've heard. He began in March of 2002. Long after Bush and the NeoCons decided to attack Iraq, though.

Vorkosigan


So because it is after, this makes it irrelevant?

[Vorkosigan]

Alden:
So because it is after, this makes it irrelevant?

Think about it Alden. If you're pro-war, then you could argue that Hussein has dealings with terrorists, so we should attack him (setting aside for the moment the question of the other governments we support that routinely have dealings with terrorists AND assuming you consider Palestinian suicide bombers to be terrorists). Hussein, as far as I know, has had such dealings since the 1980s, when was our ally. However, if you are anti-war, you might note that despite the fact that the pro-war crowd claims Hussein has huge heaps of WMDs which he is frothing at the mouth to sell to terrorists, he has not yet done so despite having contacts with them for more than twenty years. Apparently it has never entered their heads that it is not in Hussein's interest to provide WMDs to people he cannot control and who dislike him intensely...recalling of course the US experience with our support of Bin Laden. He may yet provide WMDs to terrorists out of desperation, but he appears so completely out of touch that he may well never reach that level of desperation.

Vorkosigan

[adam.naranjo]

Most Arab groups in the middle east who allow for and support terrorism are also supporting Saddam. Why? Becuase saddam supports terrorism, and supports the destruction of Israel, and america. In Jordan, Palestine, Iran, Turkey, etc,. there are radical muslim groups who are supporting Saddam in protest. Of course it must be said that MANY people in these areas (except Palestine) are NOT protesting against the war, because they know that Saddam is a MORAL madman, much like hitler. The governments are supporting the US becuase they know saddam needs to go. They have made this clear in recent statments.

The fact is, immoral leaders who partake in HUGE crimes against humanity, like saddam's killing of over 1.5 million people in his own country (including Muslim Scholors), need to be brought to justice. Along with the people who serve them. If this means that we need to go into those countries and take them out then we SHOULD.
BUT wait, I can hear someone say, "but what about all of the innocent people who will be killed?"
Guess what? There are hardly ANY innocent people being killed, because we have amazing weapons now -- weapons that can hit open windows right on target. I don't know if any of you have seen pictures, but I have, and Iraq looks great. The city is clean, the lights are on, and people are working during the day. We have the ability to wage war and free peole with VERY little civilian casualties -- thats good news.

The time in which we live offers us the ability to do one of the most MORAL and FREEDOM loving actions ever taken. The free world must unite and FREE the non-free world. (and by the free world, I do not mean just the US, I mean the WHOLE free world)

The free world must bring freedom to the rest of the world, and allow peace loving governments to form so that we dont see another Hitler. Saddam is another Hitler. Kim Chong-il is another Hitler. Ther are both in the top 5 countries who committ inhumane acts and civil rights violations. They and others like them must go, and the world must unite to act on behalf of ESLAVED people through out the world.

Adam Naranjo

[Epoetker]

And let me add the little footnote-now Abu Abbas is captured, and all of his Palestinian supporters (also by far the biggest Saddamites as well) are demanding his release. :lol:

[Sauron]

03-22-2003 @ 07:02 PM post located here (http://www.theologyweb.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=42744#post42744)
adam.naranjo:

Most Arab groups in the middle east who allow for and support terrorism are also supporting Saddam.


Wrong. In fact, Osama bin Laden (just to use an example) hated Saddam, because Saddam opposed the creation of an Islamist state. And because Saddam had extensive dealings with western govts.

Moreover, the Shi'ite paramilitary organizations in the Mideast also don't like Saddam. Why? Because Saddam (a Sunni) oppresses the Shi'ites in Iraq.

Finally, groups like the PDK (Kurdish resistance groups that Turkey calls "terrorists") also hate Saddam. Why? Because Saddam gassed the Kurds and oppressed them.

So before you go shooting off your mouth next time, and trying to neatly categorize everyone in the Mideast, how about actually reading something on the topic first, hmm?
:bonk:
:read: