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View Full Version : Mmm... China makes me feel a tad uneasy sometimes...



Rubia Warren
March 28th 2003, 12:39 AM
http://edition.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/asiapcf/east/03/24/willy.column/index.html

HONG KONG, China (CNN) -- The Iraqi war has convinced the Chinese Communist Party (CCP) leadership that some form of confrontation with the U.S. could come earlier than expected.

Beijing has also begun to fine-tune its domestic and security policies to counter the perceived threat of U.S. "neo-imperialism."

As more emphasis is being put on boosting national strength and cohesiveness, a big blow could be dealt to both economic and political reform.

That the new leadership has concluded China is coming up against formidable challenges in the short to medium term is evident from recent statements by President Hu Jintao and Premier Wen Jiabao.

Hu indicated earlier this year Beijing must pay more attention to global developments so that "China make good preparations before the rainstorm ... and be in a position to seize the initiative."

Wen also pointed out in the first meeting of the State Council, or cabinet, last Saturday the leadership "must keep a cool head."

"We must boost our consciousness about disasters and downturns -- and think about dangers in the midst of [apparent] safety," he said.

Alarm bells about a deteriorating international situation have been sounded by the CCP's secretive Leading Group on National Security (LGNS), which coordinates policies in areas including diplomacy, defense and energy.

The LGNS, which is headed by Hu, has since early this month called a series of meetings to discuss ways to handle the Iraqi crisis.

In the near term, of course, the focus is on the impact of rising oil prices -- and on the need to build up a strategic oil reserve that can last at least 30 days.

However, economic concerns are not the top priority. Given the likelihood oil prices will drop after the resolution of the conflict, some government economists are saying the war's impact on this year's economic performance will be insubstantial.

Officials even cite the safe haven theory to predict foreign direct investment flowing into China will exceed the record $52 billion last year.

Of more concern to the LGNS is the perceived expansion of American unilateralism if not neo-imperialism.

As People's Daily commentator Huang Peizhao pointed out last Saturday, U.S. moves in the Middle East "have served the goal of seeking world-wide domination."

State Council think-tank member Tong Gang saw the conflict as the first salvo in Washington's bid to "build a new world order under U.S. domination."

Chinese strategists think particularly if the U.S. can score a relatively quick victory over Baghdad, it will soon turn to Asia -- and begin efforts to "tame" China.

It is understood the LGNS believes the U.S. will take on North Korea -- still deemed a "lips-and-teeth" ally of China's -- as early as this summer.

These developments have prompted China to change its long-standing geopolitical strategy, which still held true as late as the 16th CCP Congress last November.

Until late last year, Beijing believed a confrontation with the U.S. could be delayed -- and China could through hewing to the late Deng Xiaoping's "keep a low profile" theory afford to concentrate almost exclusively on economic development.

"Now, many cadres and think-tank members think Beijing should adopt a more pro-active if not aggressive policy to thwart U.S. aggression," said a Chinese source close to the diplomatic establishment.

He added hard-line elements in the People's Liberation Army (PLA) had advocated providing weapons to North Korea to help Pyongyang defend itself against a possible U.S. missile strike at its nuclear facilities.

Forestalling the challenge

Hu was elected president of China by the NPC this month.
Even less hawkish experts are advocating beefing up the national security apparatus.

Chinese Academy of Social Sciences (CASS) economist Yang Fan pointed out the recent global flare-ups had alerted China to the imperative of improving national security and cohesiveness.

"Equal weight should be given to economic development and national security," Yang said. "As we become more prosperous, we must concentrate our forces [on safeguarding national safety]."

What is China doing to forestall the perceived U.S. challenge?

Firstly, the CCP leadership is fostering nationalistic sentiments, a sure-fire way to promote much-needed cohesiveness.

While not encouraging anti-U.S. demonstrations, Beijing has informed the people of what the media calls "increasingly treacherous international developments."

This explains what analysts including Beijing scholars considered the unexpectedly virulent official reaction to the start of the Iraq war.

Foreign Ministry spokesman Kong Quan said the U.S.-led military campaign had "trampled on the U.N. constitution and international law" and that it would lead to regional and global instability.

Equally tough statements were issued by the National People's Congress (NPC) and the advisory Chinese People's Political Consultative Conference.

Major official media such as Xinhua and People's Daily have run dozens of articles and analyses whose gist is that, in the words of commentator Li Xuejiang, the invasion of Iraq had "damaged the international order."

In an apparent departure from Beijing's cautious attitude at the beginning of the Iraqi crisis, authorities last weekend allowed a group of nationalist intellectuals to hold a conference condemning U.S. "hegemonism."

The corollary of boosting national cohesiveness could be the suppression of dissent, particularly politically incorrect views expressed by "pro-West" intellectuals.

The warning and punishment that party authorities recently meted out to several Beijing and provincial publications may augur a relatively prolonged period of ideological control in the interest of promoting "unity of thinking."

On the economic front, the authorities may play up the imperative of concentrating resources to boost China's "economic security" and "energy security."

"The Wen leadership is checking out why earlier plans to build up a strategic oil reserve failed to materialize last year, when prices were much lower," said a Beijing-based party source.

"It is possible that bucking the overall trend of market reforms, Beijing may bring back more government fiats to sectors deemed to have strategic and national-security implications."

It is instructive that in his 90-minute long interview with the international media last week, Wen was quite reticent about boosting economic reform such as the liberalization of state-owned enterprises.

In accordance with the theory of "the synthesis of [the needs of] war and peace," civilian economic projects in areas including infrastructure may be planned will the requirements of the defense forces in mind.

On the military front, the Iraqi conflict will kick start another season of accelerated modernization of weaponry.

Diplomatic analysts in Beijing said PLA officers and strategists had been scrutinizing the latest hardware used by American and British forces.

They pointed out the PLA's astonishment at the wizardry of American firearms used in the 1991 Gulf War was a major factor behind the Chinese army's aggressive modernization drive through the 1990s.

Academy of Military Sciences (AMS) expert Peng Guanqian pointed out that the Iraqi war would provide the Pentagon with "a testing ground for new military equipment and strategies."

The Liberation Army Daily last Friday quoted unnamed officers from the Army and the People's Armed Police as saying the PLA must "quicken the pace of military modernization."

Such developments could in turn hasten a possible showdown between the two countries that harbor deep-seated mistrust of each other even in relatively tranquil times.

GrayPilgrim
March 28th 2003, 01:16 AM
I read an article in the mid 90s that argued that by 2009 the US and China would be in a war instigated by the Chinese. So it appearsd that while the date may not be correct the Chinese policy towards the US has not changed. Did China have UN sanction to fight Vietnam in the late 70's?

GP

Ryokan
March 28th 2003, 09:45 AM
I am not hugely concerned about China. They are playing a long game. Their are just afraid that we will, in an act of hubris after winning in Iraq, invade North Korea or let Taiwan declare independence. I think both are unlikely, so we shouldn't have to fight China. And, if they want to try to match our military build up, we may break them, as we did the Soviets.

Rubia Warren
March 28th 2003, 09:50 AM
What if we end up having some kind of standoff with N. Korea, though?

Freak
March 28th 2003, 09:53 AM
China is 1 billion strong. They can easily place a million men in any conflict. China is a sleeping giant. We ought to be concerned and I believe we are. Notice how Bush was semi-forceful in dealing with China when they were holding a few of our military personnel a year or so ago when one of our aircraft crashed into the mainland. Bush and senior officals are aware of the enomorous power China wields.

Ryokan
March 28th 2003, 10:00 AM
I think it would cool relations, and maybe start a mini arms race, but so long as we don't do anything crazy with Taiwan, the Chinese won't sacrifice all they have built. If we do, the military would act with or without the Party's orders.

djnoz
April 15th 2003, 07:01 AM
I think people who say US is the "world's only superpower" are fooling themselves.

Ryokan
April 15th 2003, 07:52 AM
I don't know djnoz. China has a formidable army, but their airforce and navy are below what we have to offer, even after China played her bag of tricks. We are also more economically influential than China. If China was a superpower, then I'd feel sorry for Vorkosigan.

Vorkosigan
April 15th 2003, 08:30 AM
I don't know djnoz. China has a formidable army, but their airforce and navy are below what we have to offer, even after China played her bag of tricks. We are also more economically influential than China. If China was a superpower, then I'd feel sorry for Vorkosigan.

Thanks! Although you should feel sorry for me anyway, since we live next to that hopelessly ill-run country, which has sent us all kinds of diseases, smugglers and criminals and is now busily exporting SARS on a global basis.

The China situation has several flashpoints that I can see. First, India-China. Second, almost never discussed is the Himal -- Bhutan, Nepal and Sikkim that is itself a flashpoint of major proportions apart from other problems India and China have. Finally, there is Taiwan. Fourth is the problem of muslim fundamentalism, which China has controlled by the simple expedient of suppressing adherence through the usual measures. Fifth of course is the stew of rising unemployment, nationalism, expansionism, xenophobia, economic migration, massive wealth inequalities and other problems that may propel China onto the global stage in a very unhealthy way.

I do not expect Taiwan to be a problem because everyone is attempting to make money and because Taiwan will not fight. The population appears resigned to becoming part of China someday even though most are pro-independence, and large numbers of people, many in the military and politics, serve that ultimate goal. A minority of people are actively pro-independence. The majority of population would like things to chug along as they are, but change is the one certain thing in the future. I do not expect a confrontation over Taiwan,; instead, I expect the KMT-PFP coaliation to win the election in '04 and hand the nation over to China one way or another either then or in '08.

China will not collapse like Russia, the Chinese are ardent capitalists and have been at it since we were painting ourselves blue and runnign howling through the woods.

Vorkosigan

Butters
April 15th 2003, 08:31 AM
Don't discount the fact that the American and Chinese economies are becoming more tighly entwined, one of the surest deterrents to war.

Ryokan
April 15th 2003, 09:08 AM
I would imagine its hard to be too optimistic about your chances for independence when next to China.

I would like to think all those pressure you were talking about, Vorkosigan, combined with the debt crisis china seems to be pushing itself towards, might force the communist party to loosen its grip, but I am not betting on it.

And this SARS thing is a disaster. I very much feel sorry for you for that Vork. Although I have a feeling that SARS will get to the American Mid West shortly.

His the public in Taiwan freaking(not unresonably) out about this SARS thing?

Vorkosigan
April 15th 2003, 09:16 AM
I would imagine its hard to be too optimistic about your chances for independence when next to China.

LOL. The patient is in intensive care, but it is not dead yet!

I would like to think all those pressure you were talking about, Vorkosigan, combined with the debt crisis china seems to be pushing itself towards, might force the communist party to loosen its grip, but I am not betting on it.

I am not sure which I like better, the current Party, or the almost certain right-wing nightmare that will follow when it goes.

And this SARS thing is a disaster. I very much feel sorry for you for that Vork. Although I have a feeling that SARS will get to the American Mid West shortly.

Heck, you've had more cases than us. Not a single fatality here, and less than 30 suspected cases.

His the public in Taiwan freaking(not unresonably) out about this SARS thing?

A few individuals, but I haven't noticed any widespread reaction. The government has moved swiftly, and there have been no cases outside of Taipei, so people have reacted accordingly. Taiwan is trying to enter the WHO with observer status, so they are behaving with impeccable honesty and competence on SARS. The results have been excellent.

Vorkosigan

Ryokan
April 15th 2003, 09:21 AM
I am glad to hear SARS isn't bad in Taiwan.

I am not so glad to think about what sort of post communist gov. China could have. :doh:

Vorkosigan
April 16th 2003, 08:52 AM
Yesterday @ 02:21 PM post located here (http://www.theologyweb.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=67449#post67449)
Ryokan:

I am glad to hear SARS isn't bad in Taiwan.

I am not so glad to think about what sort of post communist gov. China could have. :doh:

Brrr...

A good reference article on the Taiwan situation is here in Parameters:

Taiwan and China political issues (http://carlisle-www.army.mil/usawc/Parameters/03spring/halloran.htm)

Enjoy, Rubia and Ryo

Vorkosigan

Ryokan
April 16th 2003, 09:02 AM
Thanks Vork!

Rubia Warren
April 16th 2003, 09:07 AM
Thanks Vorkosigan.
EEEK. This is the same information that this bible prophecy guy uses as a reference to prove his view of some scriptures claiming that there will be a US-China war over Taiwan (:no: Don't ask.... it's a long long story).:lol:
No, but for reals...this situation has made me uneasy for quite some time. You don't hear much about it, but every once in a while, I see something in the newspaper on, like, page 5 or something, about China's leader coming out and making a little warning about how they want Taiwan back... interesting situation, indeed.
The link was very informative, Vork, thank you. And hey... where's your self-pic avatar, anyway? And Ryokan... I am still waiting.:whip: :rubia:

Ryokan
April 16th 2003, 09:17 AM
Patience is a virtue La Rubia. I may put it up tonight or tommorrow. It depends on my friend Liz. Until they, I like my current Avatar.