Free will and forgiveness .

[Slayer-2004]

Does forgiveness interfere with free will ? I have heard many theists making the argument that people choose by their own free will to go to hell because by not accepting gods forgiveness , they are damning themselves to hell .

I find this very bizzare because it uses the logic that forgiving someone without them apologizing first would be interfering with someones free will . That doesnt make any sense to me at all , I have forgiven people for things they have not apologized for many times . Why cant an omnipotent god ?

[seer]

I find this very bizzare because it uses the logic that forgiving someone without them apologizing first would be interfering with someones free will . That doesnt make any sense to me at all , I have forgiven people for things they have not apologized for many times . Why cant an omnipotent god ?

It is more than simple forgivness. I could forgive someone who harmed me but he still may hate me and refuse to to be in relationship with me. Asking for God's forgivness is in reality is only coming into right relation with Him. You see who you are and you begin to see what what He is - Holy - and the only natural response in that situation is to beg for mercy...

[Slayer-2004]

in that case , he should just ask everyone whether or not they want to be with them personally when they die . He can forgive them enough so they are pure enough to be in his presence without asking . The idea any god would make it so it was too late by the time you die on believing his specific religion is unjust . You see who you are and you begin to see what what He is - Holy - and the only natural response in that situation is to beg for mercy...
actually , Im an apostate . I once saw his "love" and later learned why it didnt fly or make sense .

[Pereynol of Sheer Dread]

in that case , he should just ask everyone whether or not they want to be with them personally when they die .

Perhaps that's exactly what he does do---in a way....


He can forgive them enough so they are pure enough to be in his presence without asking .

In some cases, he might do this , too.


The idea any god would make it so it was too late by the time you die on believing his specific religion is unjust .

Why? How do we determine what justice is? But, then again, it may be that in some cases death isn't the barrier of "too late" for everyone, and it may be that believing specific doctrines isn't always the criterion for a relationship with God (particularly when those doctrines have not been encountered or have been misrepresented); these are questions that have provoked a good bit of debate. There's a spectrum of beliefs with Christianity concerning these things, and there are people who share your concerns and yet believe.


actually , Im an apostate . I once saw his "love" and later learned why it didnt fly or make sense .

Maybe his love is deeper than you thought it was. But, if you go elsewhere---away from him---what options are you left with? In an atheistic universe, where will you find justice or love or anything beyond death? In a life filled with hedonism or any alternate value system, it'll be your own personal judgment as to what justice is and your own small hope and conception of love that will try to rise to the occasion, but all these things will only die with you. I'm not trying to be critical here---but where else will you find the kind of "love" or "sense" with the kind of ultimate significance you seem to want? As I've said, Maybe God gives us these things, after all. Maybe his parameters are wider than you think....

[seer]

in that case , he should just ask everyone whether or not they want to be with them personally when they die .

He has - Romans 1:19,20


He can forgive them enough so they are pure enough to be in his presence without asking . The idea any god would make it so it was too late by the time you die on believing his specific religion is unjust .

First, who are you to decide what is just or unjust? Second, I believe that ANYONE who sincerely desires to find God will. The problem is - you do not... Anymore than a bank robber wants to find a cop.