7thangel
September 10th 2004, 12:11 PM
GB,
I'm glad you posted this, and I wholeheartedly agree. I think that a lot of times many of us don't often meet up with people who share our interest in having heady discussions about theological issues that we either enjoy or need, so we turn to a place like this for a different sort of fellowship. But, by the same token, it seems like we're just personas in this place, and we can't reveal ourselves easily as we would like to be able to do. Sometimes our personas are hard-edged, and as debaters we distort our public images, hardly ever letting go or exposing our own personal vulnerabilities, and consequently, never really being personally known to much of an extent. This isn't satisfying on a personal level, IMHO, because most of us aren't rock-faced intellectuals at heart who have no personal needs except to pummel one another with polemics. The whole thing isn't exactly in keeping with the spirit of the gospel, which requires us to cultivate an attitude of humility and sharing instead of one of prideful oneupmanship and isolation. If more of us could instead move in the direction of real friendship, as some have done here, we'd be all the richer. Thanks for a much-needed corrective!
I got this post of Pereynol on GB's thread. Thinking it is inappropriate to make GB's thread into a discussion, I, instead, have this thread to further discuss the above post. Specifically, the truth of us(excluding me, i guess:tongue: ) being just personas on this place.
It is striking that much, if not all, of us believe that we are behaving as mere personas in this place. On my own observation, the very core of us behaving as mere personas relates heavily to the rationality, or either the certainty itself, of what we believe, stand for, and defend. Let us take for instance Calvinism and Arminianism. I must admit that both of these(Calvinism & Arminianism) were founded on Scripture verses; I guess most of us agree. And what happens is that both sides build their own rational defenses and clinging to the verses that promote their position while ignoring the verses provided by their opponents. Instead of acknowledging that Calvinism and Arminianism were founded on Scripture verses, and of then trying to resolve the reasons why both exist in the Scripture, both sides take their own positions highly defending on their personal opinions/understandings without the crucial understanding why both(Calvinism & Arminianism) exist in the Bible. In reality, most debated topics culminate in the same scenario; neglecting that the basis of each belief are supported by Scriptures, but the arguments on each positions are based on one's opinion/understanding of his position. In the end, they are presenting a conflicting Scripture messages and then chosing what messages they adhere to, and then build their faith on those messages.
Now, it is important to note that knowledge has something to do with how the way we feel on things. Calvinists and Arminians easily indulge themselves emotionally during debates because of their belief, not on the person they debate to(I guess this is a fair way of describing the misbehaviour of posters). Now this leads me to believe the importance of knowledge in one's salvation. Unless we come to same knowledge and understanding, we will always end up emotionally stressed. Imagine a carpenter mingling with a group of scientists, and he then try to think if he really belongs to the group. Unless the carpenter understands the discussion, even if he cannot interact, he would be content. But if he cannot understand, what a feeling it is! Curiosity makes our feelings lively, and if we don't come to knowing what we are curious about we become frustrated. Still, many things to say.......but..
What say thou of these?
I'm glad you posted this, and I wholeheartedly agree. I think that a lot of times many of us don't often meet up with people who share our interest in having heady discussions about theological issues that we either enjoy or need, so we turn to a place like this for a different sort of fellowship. But, by the same token, it seems like we're just personas in this place, and we can't reveal ourselves easily as we would like to be able to do. Sometimes our personas are hard-edged, and as debaters we distort our public images, hardly ever letting go or exposing our own personal vulnerabilities, and consequently, never really being personally known to much of an extent. This isn't satisfying on a personal level, IMHO, because most of us aren't rock-faced intellectuals at heart who have no personal needs except to pummel one another with polemics. The whole thing isn't exactly in keeping with the spirit of the gospel, which requires us to cultivate an attitude of humility and sharing instead of one of prideful oneupmanship and isolation. If more of us could instead move in the direction of real friendship, as some have done here, we'd be all the richer. Thanks for a much-needed corrective!
I got this post of Pereynol on GB's thread. Thinking it is inappropriate to make GB's thread into a discussion, I, instead, have this thread to further discuss the above post. Specifically, the truth of us(excluding me, i guess:tongue: ) being just personas on this place.
It is striking that much, if not all, of us believe that we are behaving as mere personas in this place. On my own observation, the very core of us behaving as mere personas relates heavily to the rationality, or either the certainty itself, of what we believe, stand for, and defend. Let us take for instance Calvinism and Arminianism. I must admit that both of these(Calvinism & Arminianism) were founded on Scripture verses; I guess most of us agree. And what happens is that both sides build their own rational defenses and clinging to the verses that promote their position while ignoring the verses provided by their opponents. Instead of acknowledging that Calvinism and Arminianism were founded on Scripture verses, and of then trying to resolve the reasons why both exist in the Scripture, both sides take their own positions highly defending on their personal opinions/understandings without the crucial understanding why both(Calvinism & Arminianism) exist in the Bible. In reality, most debated topics culminate in the same scenario; neglecting that the basis of each belief are supported by Scriptures, but the arguments on each positions are based on one's opinion/understanding of his position. In the end, they are presenting a conflicting Scripture messages and then chosing what messages they adhere to, and then build their faith on those messages.
Now, it is important to note that knowledge has something to do with how the way we feel on things. Calvinists and Arminians easily indulge themselves emotionally during debates because of their belief, not on the person they debate to(I guess this is a fair way of describing the misbehaviour of posters). Now this leads me to believe the importance of knowledge in one's salvation. Unless we come to same knowledge and understanding, we will always end up emotionally stressed. Imagine a carpenter mingling with a group of scientists, and he then try to think if he really belongs to the group. Unless the carpenter understands the discussion, even if he cannot interact, he would be content. But if he cannot understand, what a feeling it is! Curiosity makes our feelings lively, and if we don't come to knowing what we are curious about we become frustrated. Still, many things to say.......but..
What say thou of these?