View Full Version : Naming the name of Lord = death penalty
Maxell
November 7th 2004, 08:14 PM
http://www.ccel.org/bible/brenton/Leviticus/24.html
LXX
Lev 24:16 And he that names the name of the Lord, let him die the death: let all the congregation of Israel stone him with stones; whether he be a stranger or a native, let him die for naming the name of the Lord.
Is there any notes, how first Christian take this text, because what i know they read LXX.
Masoretic text translate different, anyone knows how Qumran or other versions translate?
FreeBrightMind
November 7th 2004, 08:28 PM
'No one is to stone anyone until I blow this whistlehttp://www.mwscomp.com/movies/brian/jpgs/whistle.jpg
Best Python Movie ever.
Please do not post in theist-only areas.
kofh2u
November 10th 2004, 02:18 AM
http://www.ccel.org/bible/brenton/Leviticus/24.html
LXX
Lev 24:16 And he that names the name of the Lord, let him die the death: let all the congregation of Israel stone him with stones; whether he be a stranger or a native, let him die for naming the name of the Lord.
Is there any notes, how first Christian take this text, because what i know they read LXX.
Masoretic text translate different, anyone knows how Qumran or other versions translate?
Im not sure what you mean...
"Is there any notes, how first Christian take this text, because what i know they read LXX."
But this prohibition against pronouncing the name of the Lord suggests that the Great Tetragrammation, a monogram of four letters, is not a name It is not to be said, though Moses was told to say it as the participle it might be construed to represent, "Iam what I turn out to be."
It is a set of Kabbalahistic letters which are subject to mathematical permutation.
The reason for this is that the permutations of YHVH set a pattern of order, a mathematical analogy for symbolic thinking, or a pattern to the temple of our mind which is the means by which we communicate with the Lord, and the means by which we make sense from data input from our senses.
Gen. 1:27 So God, (The Universal Force), created man (as a conscious mind enabled to image The Universal Reality, abstractly and mathematically),...
Koph, since you think you are the messiah, it is apparent that are out side of the bounds of orthodox Christianity. This means that you are not allowed to posti n Christianity. Thanks for understanding. If I have misunderstood your statmenet and belief that youa re the messiah, please contact me via emial. Pilgrim
porter
November 10th 2004, 12:07 PM
The reason for this is that the permutations of YHVH set a pattern of order, a mathematical analogy for symbolic thinking, or a pattern to the temple of our mind which is the means by which we communicate with the Lord, and the means by which we make sense from data input from our senses.
I like what you have written.
Jews for millenia have not pronounced YHVH.
Instead they substitute ADNI and put YY in the text.
You and I do not pronounce YHVH either.
We don't know how to pronounce that name.
Herbert Brichto in his book , "The Names of God" asks some penetrating questions about why "source criticism" has not resolved the questions surrounding the names YHVH and elohim.
1. Which name is older, which is younger?
2. Why was one preserved in speech while the other was preserved only in writing, with it's vocalization prohibited and a substitute epithet (Adonai) for sovereignty substituted?
3. Why was the name "lost"? When? How?
4. Exactly when were the vocables "adonay" and "elohim" substituted for it?
5. Why was the substitution made?
6. How did a commonplace name become wiped from universal memory?
7. In viw of religious denominations failure to achieve unanimous agreement on even minor points of doctrine, how could this prohibition be achieved?
8. In view of religious disagreement over every point of doctrine, how could this be achieved without a trace of disagreement or struggle?
9. Why would the name be revealed to Moses while being denied to the Patriarchs?
10. Was it "lost" between Noah and Abraham?
11. Why have multiple "proper" names for one God?
12. Why have an explanation or introduction of a "new" name (Ex. 6:3) while showing the pre-existence of the name?
YHVH was never until recent times pronounced by knowledgeable students of the Bible.
This grapheme was generally rendered as "the Lord".
Unique in the history of religions is this loss in speech and preservation in writing of the name of a people's god.
When, in search of a clue, we seek for a written source about this tradition of holy ineffability, we find there is none, none whatsoever.
Brichto goes on to say:
"Our solution will involve a radical suggestion: that there never existed a pronunciation proper to the name transcribed by the letters Y-H-W-H."
The vocalization for YHVH need never have been forgotten if, for example, it was never known.
"For in the sense of a name as a phenomenon of speech, an oral or auditory phenomenon, the name reflected in the written characters YHWH was never made known to anyone."
There are three events recorded, in which God is asked about his name.
Jacob, who is answered only with a question (Gen 32:29)
Moses, who is answered almost cryptically with a verb (Ex 6:3)
The parents of Samson, who are answered with a question (Jud. 13:17-18) but it includes an adjective "secret" (or "wonderful") which is used elsewhere as a proper name (Isa 9:6).
I don't know if Brichto's solution is correct.
But he sure does asks some poignant questions.
Perhaps YHVH was meant to be symbolic from the start.
Porter
kofh2u
November 10th 2004, 12:58 PM
I like what you have written.
Jews for millenia have not pronounced YHVH.
Instead they substitute ADNI and put YY in the text.
You and I do not pronounce YHVH either.
We don't know how to pronounce that name.
Herbert Brichto in his book , "The Names of God" asks some penetrating questions about why "source criticism" has not resolved the questions surrounding the names YHVH and elohim.
1. Which name is older, which is younger?
2. Why was one preserved in speech while the other was preserved only in writing, with it's vocalization prohibited and a substitute epithet (Adonai) for sovereignty substituted?
3. Why was the name "lost"? When? How?
4. Exactly when were the vocables "adonay" and "elohim" substituted for it?
5. Why was the substitution made?
6. How did a commonplace name become wiped from universal memory?
7. In viw of religious denominations failure to achieve unanimous agreement on even minor points of doctrine, how could this prohibition be achieved?
8. In view of religious disagreement over every point of doctrine, how could this be achieved without a trace of disagreement or struggle?
9. Why would the name be revealed to Moses while being denied to the Patriarchs?
10. Was it "lost" between Noah and Abraham?
11. Why have multiple "proper" names for one God?
12. Why have an explanation or introduction of a "new" name (Ex. 6:3) while showing the pre-existence of the name?
YHVH was never until recent times pronounced by knowledgeable students of the Bible.
This grapheme was generally rendered as "the Lord".
Unique in the history of religions is this loss in speech and preservation in writing of the name of a people's god.
When, in search of a clue, we seek for a written source about this tradition of holy ineffability, we find there is none, none whatsoever.
Brichto goes on to say:
"Our solution will involve a radical suggestion: that there never existed a pronunciation proper to the name transcribed by the letters Y-H-W-H."
The vocalization for YHVH need never have been forgotten if, for example, it was never known.
"For in the sense of a name as a phenomenon of speech, an oral or auditory phenomenon, the name reflected in the written characters YHWH was never made known to anyone."
There are three events recorded, in which God is asked about his name.
Jacob, who is answered only with a question (Gen 32:29)
Moses, who is answered almost cryptically with a verb (Ex 6:3)
The parents of Samson, who are answered with a question (Jud. 13:17-18) but it includes an adjective "secret" (or "wonderful") which is used elsewhere as a proper name (Isa 9:6).
I don't know if Brichto's solution is correct.
But he sure does asks some poignant questions.
Perhaps YHVH was meant to be symbolic from the start.
Porter
I like your open-minded puzzlement and apparent readiness for rational answers to these good questions.
Consider that, if there was a simple, easily expressed reason for this Tetragrammation, and an equally rational relationship between the concept of God and the utility of this grapheme who would listen and who would care 3300 years ago?
Let me try again, for surely I failed to express myself properly.
I suggest that Y-H-V-H is a key to certzin things. It is a key to Torah symbolism and a literary contrivance of order in the written Torah. But, it is also a key to our perception of the creation, if not the Creator, himself. It is a key to what in analogy to the computer would be the software "program" or operating system for our mind.
No more certain that I have made myself clear, I end by suggesting that if this is a monumental insight into the last frontier of man's scientific endeavors, an insight into how we actually think, then who before now, in this age, the 21st Century would have cared to hear or who would have been able to appreciate the enormity of such a thing?
Zech4:10
For who hath despised the day of small things? for they shall rejoice, and see the plummet in the hand of Zerubbabel with those seven; they are tge eyes of the Lord, which run to and fro through the whole earth.
Rev. 1:16 And he had in his right hand seven stars, (the sevenfold
spirit of the psyche: Id, Libido, Ego, Anima, Self, Harmony, Superego):
Koph, since you think you are the messiah, it is apparent that are out side of the bounds of orthodox Christianity. This means that you are not allowed to post in Christianity. Thanks for understanding. If I have misunderstood your statmenet and belief that youa re the messiah, please contact me via emial. Pilgrim
Sparko
November 10th 2004, 04:06 PM
http://www.ccel.org/bible/brenton/Leviticus/24.html
LXX
Lev 24:16 And he that names the name of the Lord, let him die the death: let all the congregation of Israel stone him with stones; whether he be a stranger or a native, let him die for naming the name of the Lord.
Is there any notes, how first Christian take this text, because what i know they read LXX.
Masoretic text translate different, anyone knows how Qumran or other versions translate?
Well all of my bible translations have the word "blaspheme" in place of "names" and "naming"
I think that blaspheme is the proper translation (coming directly from the hebrew) - going from the LXX you are translating a translation, Hebrew to Greek to English.
And the first Christians were Jews so they would have had the Hebrew available to them too.
kofh2u
November 10th 2004, 05:41 PM
Well all of my bible translations have the word "blaspheme" in place of "names" and "naming"
I think that blaspheme is the proper translation (coming directly from the hebrew) - going from the LXX you are translating a translation, Hebrew to Greek to English.
And the first Christians were Jews so they would have had the Hebrew available to them too.
Since our eternal souls weigh in the balance, I would certainly side conservatively with you.
Blasphemy against the God, especially one that says it warrants death, seems very important. That one is guilty who "names the name" should still hold true for Jews today.
And, if not a tittle of the law has been removed for Christians, you suggest that some form of blasphemy exists not to include "names the name." What does the passage mean to you, then? What exactly is this blaspemy according to exegesis of the text?
Of course, the Jehovah Witnesses will remind us that the actual name of our God is YHVH. The passages says they are guilty then of naming the name if we go with this translation. Yet, their original claim to fame, back in the 1900's, was that they had "discovered" the actual name of God. Glory be to God, they mispronounced the name as Jehovah. The letter J was not in the original Hebrew, so God rest their eternal souls, they DIDN'T blasphemy by naming if that is the actual Hebrew translation.
Rev. 13:6 And he opened his mouth in the blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name,...
Rev. 1:16 And he had in his right hand seven stars, (the sevenfold
spirit of the psyche: Id, Libido, Ego, Anima, Self, Harmony, Superego):
Sparko
November 10th 2004, 08:07 PM
Since our eternal souls weigh in the balance, I would certainly side conservatively with you.
In the OT there were lots of crimes that were punished by stoning. Including Adultery, and so on.
Blaspheme simply means to take the Lord's name in vain. The first commandment. To curse God, or to make fun of God was a crime punishable by death. It does not mean that to even say the name of God would get you stoned. The reason the Jews did not say the name of God was they were afraid to even make a slip of the tongue that would be construed as blaspheming God's name. So they avoided that by not saying it. They were very legalistic.
The scripture says nothing about your eternal soul being in the balance. Your soul belongs to God if you believe in Jesus as your Lord and Savior. That is the only thing that holds your soul in the balance.
kofh2u
November 10th 2004, 09:27 PM
In the OT there were lots of crimes that were punished by stoning. Including Adultery, and so on.
Blaspheme simply means to take the Lord's name in vain. The first commandment. To curse God, or to make fun of God was a crime punishable by death. It does not mean that to even say the name of God would get you stoned. The reason the Jews did not say the name of God was they were afraid to even make a slip of the tongue that would be construed as blaspheming God's name. So they avoided that by not saying it. They were very legalistic.
The scripture says nothing about your eternal soul being in the balance. Your soul belongs to God if you believe in Jesus as your Lord and Savior. That is the only thing that holds your soul in the balance.
John, hi...
I look blasphemy up in Webster dictionary ... it specifically noted that saying the name was considered blasphemy. Note, webster isn't a religious resource.
Sparko
November 10th 2004, 09:36 PM
That's what you get for getting your religion from a dictionary.
How can saying God's name be blasphemy? If he did not want anyone even saying his name, then why did he tell us what it was?
"Hi, my name is John! Now never say my name or you I will kill you."
What kind of God would do such a thing?
kofh2u
November 10th 2004, 10:07 PM
That's what you get for getting your religion from a dictionary.
How can saying God's name be blasphemy? If he did not want anyone even saying his name, then why did he tell us what it was?
"Hi, my name is John! Now never say my name or you I will kill you."
What kind of God would do such a thing?
Yeah. It makes you stop and think, doesn't it?
Either the scriptures read out wrong, or God;s ways are not the same wave length as Modern Homo sapiens.
Or...
...its a hint to us that Y-H-V-H is initials or a four letter monogram. God doesn't want anyone to argue that is a name...
God figures that after 3300 years of people assuming a tetra- gram is a name like Jehovah,... no way could people come to change their mind.
If ot is way more than just four letters... who would believe it? Especially if God had NEVER said, "Don't say this as if it is a word, a name like, say, David, It is NOT a word! Its a four letter monogram for something very important.
Or, you could be right too. Just ignor the whole issue and ridicule any discussion on this.
Luke 24:45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,
Sparko
November 10th 2004, 10:17 PM
Er, God did not write down YHWH for the isrealites and say "thats my name, dont wear it out, or pronounce it"
He TOLD Moses his name. Verbally. The Jews wrote it down, but they didn't use to use vowels when they wrote down words. Just the consonents. So that is why we dont know how to pronounce it today. We have lost the vowel sounds. It wasnt some big secret puzzle left by God on a stone tablet.
kofh2u
November 11th 2004, 12:02 AM
Er, God did not write down YHWH for the isrealites and say "thats my name, dont wear it out, or pronounce it"
He TOLD Moses his name. Verbally. The Jews wrote it down, but they didn't use to use vowels when they wrote down words. Just the consonents. So that is why we dont know how to pronounce it today. We have lost the vowel sounds. It wasnt some big secret puzzle left by God on a stone tablet.
I always say that Jesus died for many reasons, and one important one was for freedom of speech in religion. He was killed essential for what he said, since he did no one ill, and many, many good.
You seem set in your understanding of this verse, and I will not oppose you as you are free, set free by Jesus to freely will your own understanding.
LXX
Lev 24:16 And he that names the name of the Lord, let him die the death: let all the congregation of Israel stone him with stones; whether he be a stranger or a native, let him die for naming the name of the Lord.
Matt. 23:2 Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat:
Sparko
November 11th 2004, 12:10 PM
Don't forget, the name of the Lord is not just YHWH, but Jesus, too. Jesus is God and Lord.
So everytime you say the name Jesus, you are naming the name of the Lord.
porter
November 12th 2004, 01:47 AM
So everytime you say the name Jesus, you are naming the name of the Lord.
But does English count?
When we say Jesus or Jehovah are we really naming the name of the Lord?
Or must we say Yeshua or Yehoshua or Yahuwah?
Porter
kofh2u
November 12th 2004, 08:21 AM
Don't forget, the name of the Lord is not just YHWH, but Jesus, too. Jesus is God and Lord.
So everytime you say the name Jesus, you are naming the name of the Lord.
You raise an interesting point to the side of our conversation.
The prohibition from forming one particular word from the four letters H,V,Y,H, using that one word as representative for God, would be a vanity for a Jew, a violation of the first commandment. This is because each of the twelve represents a particular tribal form of the Tetragrammation.
This is way too deep a point to explain to you here, and way, way more than most believers can tolerate at first glance.
So, I will not irritate you with the details.
But, in general, the idea is that the Tetragrammation has twelve permutations or possible arrangements of the four letters. This is not mysticism, but it is mysterious in that it was a secret of the Aaronic priesthood, those men who first served in the Tabernacle of Shiloh.
The Jews call this stuff the sacred secret esoteric knowledge of Israel, or KaBbalah.
Cutting to the chase, when Christ was crucified the Romans placed a sign over his head with four letters INRI, meaning King of the Jews...
The Tetragramm analogy, YHVH with INRI, is fasinating to students of the Kabbalah, I am certain. They call these the Twelve Great Names:
1) HYHV IRIN
2) HYVH IRNI
3) HVHY INIR
4) HVYH INRI
5) HHVY IINR
6) HHYV IIRN
7) YHVH RINI
8) YVHH RNII
9) VHYH NIRI
10) VYHH NRII
11) YHHV RIIN
12) VHHY NIIR
Rev. 10:7 But in the days of (Christian Humanitarism) the voice of the seventh angel, (the spirit of human Harmony), when he, (that awakening subconscious apparatus of mind), shall begin to sound (consciously in the thoughts of men),...
... the MYSTERY of God (YHVH)...
... should be finished, as he hath informed his servants the prophets (as recorded in scripture).
porter
November 12th 2004, 10:27 AM
The prohibition from forming one particular word from the four letters H,V,Y,H, using that one word as representative for God, would be a vanity for a Jew, a violation of the first commandment. This is because each of the twelve represents a particular tribal form of the Tetragrammation.
This is way too deep a point to explain to you here, and way, way more than most believers can tolerate at first glance.
I think many people here can handle deep subjects.
When I studied Qabala I found just what you are talking about.
Paul Foster Case has a treatise on the divine name.
I do like your idea that YHVH was meant as a code or symbol rather than as a pronouncable name.
Porter
kofh2u
November 12th 2004, 01:44 PM
I think many people here can handle deep subjects.
When I studied Qabala I found just what you are talking about.
Paul Foster Case has a treatise on the divine name.
I do like your idea that YHVH was meant as a code or symbol rather than as a pronouncable name.
Porter
I am astounded by your agreement with me here, a place where different takes on scripture are rather unwelcome, and often angerly opposed.
To this, I am amazed further, that you correctly use the Arabic spelling of Qabbalah, absent the letter u that always follows Q in English.
There is so much more to support this initial hypothesis concerning YHVH. Even what the secular community might call theories.
That is, logical, scientific-like concepts can arise about this lost Hebrew spiritual interaction with the Torah.
Concepts can be built upon the first idea of my sole hypothesis, demonstrating applications which prove correct.
For instance, the permutations of the Great Name, taken another step further, find support for what I am saying in ancient Jewish traditions of their lost Qabbalah. Any research of the rabbinical writings on the subject of this Kabbalah immediately produces record of some order of the manipulations of the Hebrew Alphabet.
As you know, there are 22 letters in that alphabet, Research will confirm that very little is remembered about the details of Kabbalah in the present Jewish community. But, they are certain it had something to do with what they say are the Twelve Simple and the Seven Doubles. Fid you read that, am I not correct?
I have psted the 12 permutations of YHVH which I theorize to be the Twelve Simple names of God.
Empirically, I propose that seven Doubles ought logically follow as the possible number of permutations when using only two (doubles) of the four letters YHVH at a time. Doubling the letters ought result in seven distinct and unique sets.
Experimenting with the possible combinations proves that the theory is correct.
So, we can manipulate the Tetragramation and discover, indeed, that the two most mystical bible numbers arise out of the name not to be named!
Seven (7) Doubles and twelve (12) Simples!
Sort of an empirical (scientific) approach, is it not?
John 8:13 The Pharisees therefore said unto him, Thou bearest record of thyself; thy record is not true.
porter
November 13th 2004, 12:14 AM
Seven (7) Doubles and twelve (12) Simples!
And the twelve simple letters have been assigned to the edges of a cube.
The seven double letters have been assigned to the faces of a cube plus the center.
All of that makes for a nice intellectual exercise.
But how it corresponds to the world is speculative.
Porter
kofh2u
November 13th 2004, 01:00 AM
And the twelve simple letters have been assigned to the edges of a cube.
The seven double letters have been assigned to the faces of a cube plus the center.
All of that makes for a nice intellectual exercise.
But how it corresponds to the world is speculative.
Porter
Close, the geometry fits the way you do it, to an extent.
Different though, it turns out the way I see it.
As for the speculation concerning how it relates to the world, Hebrew tradition taught that the world was a cube.
This seems more than merely coincidental.
Nevertheless, the Urim and Thummim relates to the world as a schmata of the mind that sees that external phenomenom called the world.
The world actual is a figment of the mind which is, itself, internal, trapped in the black box of the skull. What ever we might know about the world comes to us by means of five senses.
Like the five stones David took from the brook as projectiles for his sling against the giant Goliath... my cube is a Buckminister Fuller cubic geometry formed by five separate pieces, there is an outside and an inside.
Rev. 22:2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.
Sparko
November 13th 2004, 09:47 PM
So Kophy, if you are worried that saying the name of God out loud is grounds for going to hell, do you think spelling it out in text is any better? I mean, by reading it, aren't you thinking the name of the Lord? And God can hear your thoughts.
What if you accidentallly think the correct pronunciation and go up in a puff of smoke? Better stop while you are ahead, huh?
kofh2u
November 14th 2004, 12:03 AM
So Kophy, if you are worried that saying the name of God out loud is grounds for going to hell, do you think spelling it out in text is any better? I mean, by reading it, aren't you thinking the name of the Lord? And God can hear your thoughts.
What if you accidentallly think the correct pronunciation and go up in a puff of smoke? Better stop while you are ahead, huh?
John, you are aware that the Jews do write G-d?
Are you aware of the tradition of elaborate detail the scribes applied to copying the name in manuscripts and in Old Testament reproductions made by hand over the centuries?
Can you explain why the letters are called The Great Tetragrammation?
What is a Tetra- gram?
Do none of these subjects seem relivant to discussion of our bible?
Do you wonder at the meaning of Zechariah?
Zech4:10
For who hath despised the day of small things? for they shall rejoice, and see the plummet in the hand of Zerubbabel with those seven...
Matt. 3:12 Whose fan is in his hand,...
Rev. 1:16 And he had in his right hand seven stars, (the sevenfold
spirit of the psyche: Id (YH), Libido (HY), Ego (VH), Anima (HV), Self (YV), Harmony (VY), Superego (HH):)
The K of H is like new wine and old wine...
Sparko
November 14th 2004, 09:18 PM
Kophy,
I am not a Jew. I do not worry about saying GOD, or Jehovah, or Yahweh, or Jesus. If I knew exactly how to pronounce YHWH, I would do so and praise God's name in worship. The God of the universe, the holy one of Israel, Jesus, YHWH, would not send someone to hell for saying his name in worship. Praising God is never in vain or blasphemy.
If your God would send you to hell for saying his name, then you don't worship the true God of the universe, but a vindictive childish God of your own imagination - The one who talks to you with psychobabble in parenthesis. Get rid of that freudian bible and read the plain truth of God without having it tainted with all that dross.
kofh2u
November 15th 2004, 12:23 AM
Kophy,
I am not a Jew. I do not worry about saying GOD, or Jehovah, or Yahweh, or Jesus. If I knew exactly how to pronounce YHWH, I would do so and praise God's name in worship. The God of the universe, the holy one of Israel, Jesus, YHWH, would not send someone to hell for saying his name in worship. Praising God is never in vain or blasphemy.
If your God would send you to hell for saying his name, then you don't worship the true God of the universe, but a vindictive childish God of your own imagination - The one who talks to you with psychobabble in parenthesis. Get rid of that freudian bible and read the plain truth of God without having it tainted with all that dross.
John, first let me tell you that whateve interpretation of scripture has been effective in bringing you to Christ it has served the ends.
Second, I caution you not to confuse Faith in doctrine with faith in Christ. If it were so, that we might be tested in such knowledge, many flat earth saints and Geocentricists would be barred from salvation.
I remind you that your charity vindicates you before the throne, not your particular "take" on the Jewish Scriptures, Old and New Testaments.
Matt. 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:
Matt. 25:32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
Matt. 25:35 For I was an hungered, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in:
Matt. 25:36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me
Mark 2:17 When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
porter
November 15th 2004, 01:34 AM
If I knew exactly how to pronounce YHWH, I would do so and praise God's name in worship.
But you do not know how to pronounce YHVH.
Therefore you do not praise God's name in worship.
I doubt you even use the English translation, Jehovah.
If God wanted you to know his name and praise it, then why don't you know it?
Porter
Pilgrim
November 15th 2004, 11:13 AM
Koph, since you think you are the messiah, it is apparent that are out side of the bounds of orthodox Christianity. This means that you are not allowed to post in Christianity. Thanks for understanding. If I have misunderstood your statment and belief that you are the messiah, please contact me via emial. Pilgrim
Sparko
November 15th 2004, 01:30 PM
If God wanted you to know his name and praise it, then why don't you know it?
Porter
He does and I do. The name of God is Jesus.
kofh2u
November 15th 2004, 06:13 PM
Koph, since you think you are the messiah, ...
...it is apparent that are out side of the bounds of orthodox Christianity.
This means that you are not allowed to post in Christianity. Thanks for understanding. If I have misunderstood your statment and belief that you are the messiah, please contact me via emial. Pilgrim
Matt. 27:14 And he answered him to never a word; insomuch that the governor marvelled greatly
porter
November 16th 2004, 12:20 AM
He does and I do. The name of God is Jesus.
That's a good answer.
But I will bet that you do not use the name, Jehovah.
That is the English translation of YHVH just as Jesus is the English translation of Yeshua (Yod-Shin-Vav-Ayin).
Porter
Sparko
November 16th 2004, 11:32 AM
Actually I do use the name Jehovah, and Yahweh from time to time.
porter
November 16th 2004, 12:06 PM
Actually I do use the name Jehovah, and Yahweh from time to time.
Good for you.
Most Christians shy away from using those names.
Porter
vBulletin® v3.6.12, Copyright ©2000-2009, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.