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Sparko
11-06-2014, 07:10 AM
This is for Christians only.

So if marijuana was legal where you live would you use it recreationally? I am not talking about abusing it and becoming a pot head, but in the same manner as many Christians drink alcohol occasionally but not to the point of becoming a drunkard.

Vote in the poll then explain your answer below.

KingsGambit
11-06-2014, 07:22 AM
I would not. I'm uncomfortable with the idea of what it can do to your brain (no matter how stridently legalization advocates on social media dispute this), and I really hate the smell. I wouldn't judge people who made a different choice but it's not for me.

Sparko
11-06-2014, 07:26 AM
I would not. I'm uncomfortable with the idea of what it can do to your brain (no matter how stridently legalization advocates on social media dispute this), and I really hate the smell. I wouldn't judge people who made a different choice but it's not for me.

I remember smoking it as a teenager (long before I was a Christian) and the effects seemed to linger for days.

--

Oh and also, I am not only asking about smoking pot, there are edible forms as well.

Chaotic Void
11-06-2014, 07:30 AM
Not really... for a few reasons

-I may be allergic (there is family precedent... my brother took a toke in his younger years and wound up in the hospital. It wasn't laced... the doc in the ER even said so after a few 'samples' of course. ).
-I hate the smell (Most variants leave you smelling like you showered in skunk spray, and it gives me a headache and burns my nostrils... )
-I'm already filling my pipe with pipe tobacco, thank you very much (smells nicer and likely tastes better). :smug:

Cow Poke
11-06-2014, 07:34 AM
I see no reason for it whatsoever. :shrug:

Sparko
11-06-2014, 07:39 AM
I see no reason for it whatsoever. :shrug:
Well a pastor partaking in pot (or alcohol) might not be the best public example for his congregation anyway. My pastor told me once that he had no problem with a Christian drinking a beer now and then, or a glass of wine with dinner, but he said he doesn't use alcohol at all because if someone saw him in public drinking a beer, it might cause them to doubt, or start rumors, so it is his choice to abstain.

mossrose
11-06-2014, 07:39 AM
Just because something is legal does not make it right. Even with the freedom we have in Christ we don't HAVE to do whatever the world tells us is okay.

I don't drink because my brother became an alcoholic, and I know in his younger days he smoked pot and took who knows what other drugs. There could be addictive genetic makeup in my family and I am not willing to risk becoming addicted to anything (chocolate excepted).

I like the idea of having my brain degenerate naturally without giving it any help along the way.

Cow Poke
11-06-2014, 07:40 AM
Well a pastor partaking in pot (or alcohol) might not be the best public example for his congregation anyway. My pastor told me once that he had no problem with a Christian drinking a beer now and then, or a glass of wine with dinner, but he said he doesn't use alcohol at all because if someone saw him in public drinking a beer, it might cause them to doubt, or start rumors, so it is his choice to abstain.

Yeah, pretty much.

Cow Poke
11-06-2014, 07:41 AM
Just because something is legal does not make it right. Even with the freedom we have in Christ we don't HAVE to do whatever the world tells us is okay.

That which is lawful may not be expedient. :smile:

"I have the right to do anything," you say--but not everything is beneficial. "I have the right to do anything"--but I will not be mastered by anything.

mossrose
11-06-2014, 07:41 AM
That which is lawful may not be expedient. :smile:

Exactly.

Bill the Cat
11-06-2014, 08:00 AM
Not just no... hell no!

Sparko
11-06-2014, 08:05 AM
Not just no... hell no!

Yeah!! We should hold out for legalized crack and meth!


:outtie:

hamster
11-06-2014, 08:37 AM
I have enough problems without adding another burden to the load, especially one that smells bad

jordanriver
11-06-2014, 09:38 AM
This is for Christians only.

So if marijuana was legal where you live would you use it recreationally? I am not talking about abusing it and becoming a pot head, but in the same manner as many Christians drink alcohol occasionally but not to the point of becoming a drunkard.

Vote in the poll then explain your answer below.

yeah, if its Christian pot, like Christian beer, Christian cigarettes, and Christian Rock

Cerebrum123
11-06-2014, 09:59 AM
Recreationally, no. I've had people suggest it for my RSD though. Still would never smoke it though.

Zymologist
11-06-2014, 10:15 AM
Nah, not interested.

KingsGambit
11-06-2014, 10:20 AM
yeah, if its Christian pot, like Christian beer, Christian cigarettes, and Christian Rock

This is a nonsensical comparison. Rock music is nothing like any of the others, and legitimately can contain religious lyrical content.

jordanriver
11-06-2014, 10:27 AM
This is a nonsensical comparison. Rock music is nothing like any of the others, and legitimately can contain religious lyrical content.ok. Sorry.

But for me, give me that ole time religion

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 10:41 AM
This is for Christians only.

So if marijuana was legal where you live would you use it recreationally? I am not talking about abusing it and becoming a pot head, but in the same manner as many Christians drink alcohol occasionally but not to the point of becoming a drunkard.

Vote in the poll then explain your answer below.

I have never partaken, not sure why I'd start now.

I could give a hoot about it. I think the answer is legalize it for avoiding hypocrisy's sake, and then tax the hell out of it.

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 10:42 AM
yeah, if its Christian pot, like Christian beer, Christian cigarettes, and Christian Rock

Old time religion, read Col 2 about people with their man made rules on what to touch, say, eat, etc... and how it's a shadow of the real thing, and not a positive shadow at that. It's a NO NO for you to impose those rules on people, and even on yourself.

Where the spirit of the Lord is there is freedom. Who are you to strip another man's freedom away, whether by preaching or passive aggressive insinuations? It's wrong and Anti Christ behavior.

Sparko
11-06-2014, 10:43 AM
I have never partaken, not sure why I'd start now.

I could give a hoot about it. I think the answer is legalize it for avoiding hypocrisy's sake, and then tax the hell out of it.

pretty much what they are doing in Colorado from what I understand.

jordanriver
11-06-2014, 10:58 AM
Old time religion, read Col 2 about people with their man made rules on what to touch, say, eat, etc... and how it's a shadow of the real thing, and not a positive shadow at that. It's a NO NO for you to impose those rules on people, and even on yourself.

Where the spirit of the Lord is there is freedom. Who are you to strip another man's freedom away, whether by preaching or passive aggressive insinuations? It's wrong and Anti Christ behavior.

the same Paul also said be not conformed to this world (Romans 12)

everybody is different, and everybody has their personal association with different customs .

I believe we are judged by our motives (IOW, the same act by one person may be motivated by a desire to please Jesus, while the same act by some other person may be motivated to lead others astray)

I make no rule for you.

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 11:20 AM
the same Paul also said be not conformed to this world (Romans 12)


It also says JESUS wept and to BE LIKE JESUS, so since you aren't crying you are christian.
(Just demonstrating what jerking a stray verse with no application can do to the message...)

How do you think be not conformed to this world applies to the topic, and how do you reconcile your view on this verse, with the Where the Spirit of the lord is there is freedom and the col 2 verses??????

You made no effort to.

So you just evaded them.

Which means you don't try to reconcile, you just try to argue.
AND THAT means speaking with you may hold little value other than a study in eisegetics.


I believe we are judged by our motives (IOW, the same act by one person may be motivated by a desire to please Jesus, while the same act by some other person may be motivated to lead others astray)

When you say things like, smoking, drinking, etc... which aren't exactly issues in the BIBLE they are just rules men make up that they suspect might be issues most likely because of their guilt, which means they are immature in Godly Proper Love 1 john 4 :16-19, then those issues become red herring issues where you think you do something for God and aren't. They distract you from the purpose.

A focus on rules like that literally leads you away from GOD not to Him. THis can be explained in many examples....

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 11:22 AM
pretty much what they are doing in Colorado from what I understand.

Yeah, I have no issue with it. IN FACT, if the church stands up and makes a big deal out of it, they are being ANTI Christ. :) That's a great phrase and argument to piss off the evangelical right.

Sparko
11-06-2014, 11:27 AM
I have no problem at all with medical marijuana. To me that is just like any other medicine. And as far as recreational use by Christians, as long as they are responsible in their use (don't be drunken basically) or allow it to affect their relationship with church and family (say, like an alcoholic might do) - then I really don't have a problem with that either.

I don't think I would use it personally, I don't even drink. And smoking it probably is bad for your health, since it is probably like smoking unfiltered cigarettes.

jordanriver
11-06-2014, 11:27 AM
It also says JESUS wept and to BE LIKE JESUS, so since you aren't crying you are christian.
(Just demonstrating what jerking a stray verse with no application can do to the message...)

How do you think be not conformed to this world applies to the topic, and how do you reconcile your view on this verse, with the Where the Spirit of the lord is there is freedom and the col 2 verses??????

You made no effort to.

So you just evaded them.

Which means you don't try to reconcile, you just try to argue.
AND THAT means speaking with you may hold little value other than a study in eisegetics.



When you say things like, smoking, drinking, etc... which aren't exactly issues in the BIBLE they are just rules men make up that they suspect might be issues most likely because of their guilt, which means they are immature in Godly Proper Love 1 john 4 :16-19, then those issues become red herring issues where you think you do something for God and aren't. They distract you from the purpose.

A focus on rules like that literally leads you away from GOD not to Him. THis can be explained in many examples....

ok, I surrender

Bill the Cat
11-06-2014, 11:30 AM
Old time religion, read Col 2 about people with their man made rules on what to touch, say, eat, etc... and how it's a shadow of the real thing, and not a positive shadow at that. It's a NO NO for you to impose those rules on people, and even on yourself.

Sorry, but religious holiday observation and dietary choices that Paul is talking about are in no way related to drug use. I would say this verse can apply here:

1 Corinthians 10:23 All things are lawful for me, but all things are not helpful; all things are lawful for me, but all things do not edify.

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 11:33 AM
I have no problem at all with medical marijuana. To me that is just like any other medicine. And as far as recreational use by Christians, as long as they are responsible in their use (don't be drunken basically) or allow it to affect their relationship with church and family (say, like an alcoholic might do) - then I really don't have a problem with that either.

I don't think I would use it personally, I don't even drink. And smoking it probably is bad for your health, since it is probably like smoking unfiltered cigarettes.

Man, when I use quotes I get double print in my box.... so I cant' even see how to selective quote your comments as the first [--quote--xyz} part is buried... annoying.

But we re mostly on the same page there.

Bill the Cat
11-06-2014, 11:34 AM
Yeah, I have no issue with it. IN FACT, if the church stands up and makes a big deal out of it, they are being ANTI Christ. :)

2555

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 11:34 AM
ok, I surrender

???? WHAT?

if you appear to have to change your views, you just roll up in a ball and run away?

Armadillo theology...

How scary to have a faith so weak any challenge sent you running. :(

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 11:35 AM
2555

This furthers a conversation>

Great intellectual contribution to the discussion. I think it's cute that you are going to barf so you send us a picture of yourself posing at the throne.

Any other dumb comments you wish to make while we are dealing with them?

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 11:37 AM
Sorry, but religious holiday observation and dietary choices that Paul is talking about are in no way related to drug use. I would say this verse can apply here:





1 Corinthians 10:23 All things are lawful for me, but all things are not helpful; all things are lawful for me, but all things do not edify.

Do you always expect people to just accept your bs claims as prima facie fact?

How about some reasoning, thinking or logic, or do you have none?

The col 2 verses deal with a principle with examples, the examples are NOT THE SUM TOTAL of the discussion.

Live is dismal when you view it from behind your navel. Must be rough.

Bill the Cat
11-06-2014, 11:38 AM
This furthers a conversation

It is an appropriate response to bull crap. Your post qualified. QED


Great intellectual contribution to the discussion.

:ahem: And your comment that it would "piss off the evangelical right" was a sterling example of the level of benefit you bring.


I think it's cute that you are going to barf so you send us a picture of yourself posing at the throne.

And the content of your post is about to come out of the rear end of the bull


Any other dumb comments you wish to make while we are dealing with them?

I call 'em like I see them.

mossrose
11-06-2014, 11:38 AM
???? WHAT?

if you appear to have to change your views, you just roll up in a ball and run away?

Armadillo theology...

How scary to have a faith so weak any challenge sent you running. :(


You are going to be trouble, aren't you.

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 11:45 AM
You are going to be trouble, aren't you.

I dunno, do you like to make accusations and claims you cant' back up then run from the conversation on a "CONVERSATIONBOARD"????? If so, then probably. Peole who think they say it so it must be true, and haven't the humility nor respect to value another's views, consider and address them, should be locked up in elementary school prison, not allowed in adult chats.

So, if I'm trouble or not is entiredly up to you and how you approach conversation. I stand on the high ground. I attempt to stick to the arguments, stay off the personal, and address the issues so the chat can further itself and we all learn.


YOU make an attack, ONLY. That's not beneficial.

Your butty up there, made some empty claims they couldn't defend and fled... I'm not too keen on that either.

Bill the Cat
11-06-2014, 11:45 AM
Do you always expect people to just accept your bs claims as prima facie fact?

No. I expect a certain level of attempt at rebuttal, not weak hand waves indicative of incompetent debate skills.


How about some reasoning, thinking or logic, or do you have none?

It's there, asshat. While you CAN smoke weed, the biblical question is evident. Does it edify you and glorify God, or does it turn you into a mindless drone capable of nothing more than a puerile snicker and a hankering for Doritos?


The col 2 verses deal with a principle with examples, the examples are NOT THE SUM TOTAL of the discussion.

Yes. The examples were religious prohibitions for gentiles of engaging in things that were forbidden by the Torah. The sum total of Paul's belief is that while He was free to do whatever he chose to do, not all of those things were helpful to him, and therefore not worth doing. It applies completely to the issue of whether a Christian should take drugs.


Live is dismal when you view it from behind your navel. Must be rough.

Live? You mean Li"F"e? And it's nice to see that this is all you have. You are incapable of refuting what I have provided, so you wave your petty little hand and act like you have said a masterpiece. It's pathetic.

Bill the Cat
11-06-2014, 11:47 AM
... I stand on the high ground. I attempt to stick to the arguments, stay off the personal, and address the issues so the chat can further itself and we all learn.

2556

Sure ya do, Skippy! :duh:

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 11:49 AM
It is an appropriate response to bull crap. Your post qualified. QED
-------------
Which in itself is not a fact but an opinion your arrogant self presumes people will accept as fact. Most real men, before they levy a conclusion will take the time to make an argument and win their case. WHICH you avoid attempting, most likely because of incompetence. It's a nice way for you to posture though. Posturing always makes the incompetent feel relevant.
====================
And your comment that it would "piss off the evangelical right" was a sterling example of the level of benefit you bring.
---------------
It was also accurate, as it goes against all of their fundamental beliefs. YOUR COMMENT was like a third grade cat fight over the chair at the lunch table... Do you ever contribute or is it all just inane bs?
===========================
And the content of your post is about to come out of the rear end of the bull
-------
Which is exactly what you expect the evangelical right to say when they don't like the comments, can't argue against them, can't prove them wrong, or don't understand them. The more you run your trap the more you prove my case.
=========================
I call 'em like I see them.
--------------
I bet it's hard to see the world when your head is lodghed behind your navel. I gotta give you points for trying. :)

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 11:50 AM
Sure ya do, Skippy!
----------------
Sniffles.. waaaa? Need a tissue?

Is lacking an actual RESPONSE and just having juvenile derogatory comments embarassing you yet?

Sparko
11-06-2014, 11:52 AM
Man, when I use quotes I get double print in my box.... so I cant' even see how to selective quote your comments as the first [--quote--xyz} part is buried... annoying.

But we re mostly on the same page there.

If you want to do quotes, you can use the cartoon icon in the tool bar on selected text, or you can type in the quote bbcodes

[quote*]text text[/quote*]

*leave out the asterisks, that is just so the tags appear in the post.

jordanriver
11-06-2014, 11:54 AM
???? WHAT?

if you appear to have to change your views, you just roll up in a ball and run away?

Armadillo theology...

How scary to have a faith so weak any challenge sent you running. :(

I don't want to fight Christians.

sheesh

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 11:57 AM
I don't want to fight Christians.

sheesh

It was a discusion. How insecure is your faith that you take ANY DISAGREEMENT as a fight?

That must make for a rough life in the real world... no wonder you make up so many fake rules and try to impose them on other Xians... you seek the masses.

mossrose
11-06-2014, 11:59 AM
It was a discusion. How insecure is your faith that you take ANY DISAGREEMENT as a fight?

That must make for a rough life in the real world... no wonder you make up so many fake rules and try to impose them on other Xians... you seek the masses.

You may view it as discussion, but others might see it as you being very combative. If you are interested in actual discussion, then take off the boxing gloves and let's have a reasonable talk.

Bill the Cat
11-06-2014, 12:02 PM
Please learn how to use the quote function, clown...


-------------
Which in itself is not a fact but an opinion your arrogant self presumes people will accept as fact.

And you are continuing to provide AMPLE evidence to support my claim. I offer it as a claim, not a fact. But, you have to have at least the IQ to grunt in order to understand the difference.


Most real men, before they levy a conclusion will take the time to make an argument and win their case.

I've made my argument a dozen times here and elsewhere. I tire of stupidity that you and those like you continue to offer. When you make a fallacious comment, I will continue to call it what it is.


WHICH you avoid attempting, most likely because of incompetence. It's a nice way for you to posture though. Posturing always makes the incompetent feel relevant.

Sorry, Skippy. YOU started the first cockfight with your moronic statement "if the church stands up and makes a big deal out of it, they are being ANTI Christ". This is an absolute bald assertion full of posturing and bullying words.


It was also accurate,

As have my comments been. And you continue to verify them. You are a petulant child with very little understanding of biblical morality.


as it goes against all of their fundamental beliefs.

But it is NOT "antichrist", no matter how many times you try to sling that crap around trying to fool people into thinking it is a diamond.


YOUR COMMENT was like a third grade cat fight over the chair at the lunch table

:nsm: I didn't want to talk over your head.


... Do you ever contribute or is it all just inane bs?

I give whatever level of attention is required. Your contribution was asinine, and called for a good shaming.



Which is exactly what you expect the evangelical right to say when they don't like the comments, can't argue against them, can't prove them wrong, or don't understand them.

Bald assertion.


The more you run your trap the more you prove my case.

That you are an asshat? I agree.


I bet it's hard to see the world when your head is lodghed behind your navel.

I was looking for your piss poor arguments in the most logical place I could think of, and the place where they were the most at home.


I gotta give you points for trying. :)

You are losing miserably. You better keep them.

Bill the Cat
11-06-2014, 12:06 PM
Sniffles.. waaaa? Need a tissue?

Nope. I haven't laughed at you hard enough to bring tears just yet. But I predict it will be soon.


Is lacking an actual RESPONSE and just having juvenile derogatory comments embarassing you yet?

A response to your bald assertions and kindergarten level insults? You get what you deserve, Skippy.

Bill the Cat
11-06-2014, 12:07 PM
I don't want to fight Christians.

sheesh

He's admittedly heterodox. I'd love to know on what...

Zymologist
11-06-2014, 12:08 PM
I feel like I'm missing something.... HeteroDoxic, have you posted on Tweb before?

Jedidiah
11-06-2014, 12:46 PM
???? WHAT?

if you appear to have to change your views, you just roll up in a ball and run away?

Armadillo theology...

How scary to have a faith so weak any challenge sent you running. :(

Or he just does not want to argue with a loony.

Jedidiah
11-06-2014, 12:52 PM
It was a discusion. How insecure is your faith that you take ANY DISAGREEMENT as a fight?

That must make for a rough life in the real world... no wonder you make up so many fake rules and try to impose them on other Xians... you seek the masses.

Do you support the Apostle's Creed? If that does not describe you your username does describe you and you are not an orthodox Christian and should not be posting here.

Do you believe the Apostle's Creed?

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 12:52 PM
Or he just does not want to argue with a loony.

man, is that all this joint is about?

When someone disagrees with you sling personal attacks rather than address the issues?

There must b ea lott mama's that needed to love their kids better for all that retarded angst.


There were points given behind everything I said.
If they are crazy or stupid, it should have been NO ISSUE for people like you two braniacs to put me in my place and show me my errors.

Lacking that, just asserting your silliness and "nearly insults but not quite good enough to be one" it appears you just flap your jaw for self important posturing.

stick to the issues, look less a fool.

Jedidiah
11-06-2014, 12:53 PM
I have already smoked pot in my hippy youth. Don't need it or want it now.

Sparko
11-06-2014, 12:57 PM
I have already smoked pot in my hippy youth. Don't need it or want it now.

Yeah. You still have the hippie moustache though. Looks awesome.

mossrose
11-06-2014, 12:57 PM
man, is that all this joint is about?

When someone disagrees with you sling personal attacks rather than address the issues?

There must b ea lott mama's that needed to love their kids better for all that retarded angst.


There were points given behind everything I said.
If they are crazy or stupid, it should have been NO ISSUE for people like you two braniacs to put me in my place and show me my errors.

Lacking that, just asserting your silliness and "nearly insults but not quite good enough to be one" it appears you just flap your jaw for self important posturing.

stick to the issues, look less a fool.

Perhaps you would do well to look to yourself first. You seem to be name-calling with the best, and seem intent on provoking a reaction instead of contributing to civilized debate.

Around here, you get the respect you deserve, and if you give none, then you shouldn't be surprised when you get none in return.

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 01:00 PM
Do you support the Apostle's Creed?
-------------------
Jup, although we may argue of some terms and find we differ some.
======================



If that does not describe you your username does describe you and you are not an orthodox Christian and should not be posting here.
--------------------
Cry me a river. Show me something I posted that you can prove doesn't go by ANY of the Creeds, not just the oldest.... And show me how my interpretation of scripture was wrong, because I'm sticking to scripture over your interpretation of the creed.

When you go to immediately trying to get me banned just so you can avoid the conversation points, you don't present as a very intelligent guy. I"m sorry I intimidate you so much that you need to lash out as you did here.

We can work on that if you are willing.

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 01:06 PM
Perhaps you would do well to look to yourself first. You seem to be name-calling with the best, and seem intent on provoking a reaction instead of contributing to civilized debate.
-------------
REally?

So I have 6 people in a row, attack ME not the arguments, and I AM THE ONE NOT CAPABLE of civilized debate? REALLY? ARE YOU KIDDING ME? I've asked in nearly every post for you guys to get off my personal butt with your attacks and address the arguments.

The fact you went personal and avoided the arguments and I called you on it is NOT AD HOMINEM or NAME CALLING. IF you LIE and are told you are a liar it's NOT NAME CALLING it's a character behavior you have demonstrated. If you don't like that name, don't do the behavior and I can't call you on it.

When you avoid the points and address my person ONLY, you are attacking the person.

You can attack the arguments,
or the Person.
Or both.
It's only a logical offense when you attack the PERSON to avoid the arguments.
That's speech 1010. It's logic 1000.

You are outta line. You want to debate civilly? Bring me civil responses to the arguments I presented. When someone avoids the arguments and attacks the person speak out against that even if you know them better than the other person.

BE CONSISTENT in your judgments.

Stop being a whiner.

=============

Around here, you get the respect you deserve, and if you give none, then you shouldn't be surprised when you get none in return.
---------------------
Around here, your arguments are ignored, your comments pretended to not exist, and your person is chastised. I've given MUCH MORE respect than I've received.

So, you can sit there and posture, or you can shut up and enter a conversation and discuss the points. Don't jump me personally then complain when I return the volley and try to get you back on the points.

I mean, that's about as fair as you can get, isn't it?

mossrose
11-06-2014, 01:12 PM
I have not attacked you at all. I have merely made some observations about your behaviour.

fm93
11-06-2014, 01:48 PM
Can't you people just smoke some pot together and calm down? :teeth:

Zymologist
11-06-2014, 01:52 PM
Can't you people just smoke some pot together and calm down? :teeth:

I was gonna debate on tweb...but then I got high.

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 01:57 PM
I have not attacked you at all. I have merely made some observations about your behaviour.

You addressed ME THE PERSON, not my comments.

That's attacking the person.

JohnnyP
11-06-2014, 02:01 PM
Pot usually makes me paranoid and reflect morbidly on bad things in my life, don't really like it.

mossrose
11-06-2014, 02:05 PM
You addressed ME THE PERSON, not my comments.

That's attacking the person.
Your comments reflect your behaviour.

That is the way this particular mode of communication works. What you type is all we know about you. So that is the ONLY way we can address you.

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 02:14 PM
Mossrose,

If my comemnts stand as given, the behavior is one of revelatory comments.

The fact you don't like WHAT I SAID or HOW I SAID IT is irrelevant, if the arguments hold up.

Also, I can't control the amount of TONE you read into what I type. That's on you. If you choose, as you DID, to judge the tone before you have a clue about the person, why the heck would I waste time investing in getting to know someone so immature? It's doomed to fail.

In other words Moss, I responded to you out of courtesy, I really don't care what you think about me the person. HOWEVER, when you come at me the person, and ignore the arguments, the reasoning etc.. I will point out, every time you attack the person not the arguments.

ANy other questions?

mossrose
11-06-2014, 02:18 PM
I don't know anything about you. I only know what I have observed as you post. You entered this thread like gangbusters, as if you have an ax to grind with other believers.

You don't know any of us, either, you only joined today! But you have made personal comments as if you do know us all and can't stand us.

All I am asking is that you take a step back, take a deep breath, and get off the offensive.

Cow Poke
11-06-2014, 02:22 PM
Old time religion, read Col 2 about people with their man made rules on what to touch, say, eat, etc... and how it's a shadow of the real thing, and not a positive shadow at that. It's a NO NO for you to impose those rules on people, and even on yourself.

Where the spirit of the Lord is there is freedom. Who are you to strip another man's freedom away, whether by preaching or passive aggressive insinuations? It's wrong and Anti Christ behavior.

wow

I thinks we haz us another holier-than-everybody. :shrug:

Christianbookworm
11-06-2014, 02:23 PM
Don't take stuff on the internet personally! I'd ask how old you were, HO, but your profile indicates(job as a chemist) that you should be old enough to realize that.

Cow Poke
11-06-2014, 02:32 PM
I don't want to fight Christians.

sheesh

You're wise --- not worth the trouble when somebody is that "knowed up" and looking for a fight. :thumb:

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 02:37 PM
You're wise --- not worth the trouble when somebody is that "knowed up" and looking for a fight.
--------------
omg, REALLY? SERIOUSLY???

He made a claim. I brought scripture to discuss, POINTS to reason over. COME LET US REASON... IRON SHARPENS IRON, etc.. etc...

He ran off.

I followed up.

You want to imply I was "knowed up?"

If you want a chat forum where no one thinks they have something worth saying, what are you going to do, pet your dog all day??? There won't be any chat.

I gave reasons for my disagreement. I didn't give them in a jerky way.

He left I asked a legitimate question>

You want to rag on me?

Grow up, please.

AND NOTE< you first words were insulting about me, so don't cry I'm a big fat meanie when I tell you to grow up. YOU REALLY NEED TO GROW UP!

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 02:38 PM
wow

I thinks we haz us another holier-than-everybody.
-----------
Do you always denigrate the person when they present scriptural reasoning you can't answer?

Why say I have the attitude then?

Cow Poke
11-06-2014, 02:41 PM
Do you always denigrate the person when they present scriptural reasoning you can't answer?

Scriptural reasoning? You are a bull in a china shop - and are about as reasonable as a hungry 2 year old.


Why say I have the attitude then?

Years of experience and discernment.

Christianbookworm
11-06-2014, 02:41 PM
wow

I thinks we haz us another holier-than-everybody.
-----------
Do you always denigrate the person when they present scriptural reasoning you can't answer?

Why say I have the attitude then?

Who peed in your cereal??? Someone explain why HO is having interpersonal issues with other twebbers!

Cow Poke
11-06-2014, 02:44 PM
AND NOTE< you first words were insulting about me, so don't cry I'm a big fat meanie when I tell you to grow up. YOU REALLY NEED TO GROW UP!

:lolo:

HeteroDoxic
11-06-2014, 02:45 PM
more personal attacks.

hard to pose on the high ground when you commit the sins you accuse folks of.

Hypocrite.

Cow Poke
11-06-2014, 02:46 PM
more personal attacks.

hard to pose on the high ground when you commit the sins you accuse folks of.

Hypocrite.

:lolo:

Cerebrum123
11-06-2014, 02:54 PM
more personal attacks.

hard to pose on the high ground when you commit the sins you accuse folks of.

Hypocrite.

Like your personal attacks on jpholding? Or is only okay when you are the one attacking? Yeah, they're the hypocrites here. :ahem:

Christianbookworm
11-06-2014, 02:55 PM
more personal attacks.

hard to pose on the high ground when you commit the sins you accuse folks of.

Hypocrite.

You can only say hypocrite if you don't insult others while taking offense to insults. Or you can insult others as long as you don't take personal offense. Be glad we don't use cuss words here. There are areas of the internet(e.g. Youtube comments) where people will be even worse. You can't take anything on the internet personally.

fm93
11-06-2014, 02:58 PM
:lolo:
Texans are so weird, am I right? :tongue:

Cow Poke
11-06-2014, 03:02 PM
Texans are so weird,

Mostly in Austin

2559


am I right? :tongue:

Not usually, but this time you are. :thumb:

Christianbookworm
11-06-2014, 03:08 PM
Do we need a page split? Because we :offtopic:!

mossrose
11-06-2014, 03:11 PM
We are working on it.

Christianbookworm
11-06-2014, 03:14 PM
So, I wouldn't take marijuana because I'd rather not have dulled mental processes. Same reason I don't drink alcohol.

Cow Poke
11-06-2014, 03:18 PM
So, I wouldn't take marijuana because I'd rather not have dulled mental processes. Same reason I don't drink alcohol.

Exactly -- I have enough damaged brain cells as it is! :smile:

One Bad Pig
11-06-2014, 05:31 PM
I wouldn't use it recreationally. I might use it for pain management, if necessary. I hear that it is less addictive than some pain medications.

Jedidiah
11-06-2014, 05:52 PM
Do you support the Apostle's Creed?
-------------------
Jup, although we may argue of some terms and find we differ some.
======================



If that does not describe you your username does describe you and you are not an orthodox Christian and should not be posting here.
--------------------
Cry me a river. Show me something I posted that you can prove doesn't go by ANY of the Creeds, not just the oldest.... And show me how my interpretation of scripture was wrong, because I'm sticking to scripture over your interpretation of the creed.

When you go to immediately trying to get me banned just so you can avoid the conversation points, you don't present as a very intelligent guy. I"m sorry I intimidate you so much that you need to lash out as you did here.

We can work on that if you are willing.Oh my, I simply asked the question to find out if you were eligible to be posting in this thread. If you are a Christian you are welcome in this thread. Simple as that. You seemed to me to be a bit looney so I felt I had the right to ask the question.

Jesse
11-06-2014, 08:48 PM
Pot was just made legal here in Oregon. I have no plans on using it for two reasons.

1. I hate even when I have to take Excedrin.

2. I'm dumb enough without it.

Sparko
11-07-2014, 06:20 AM
wow. This thread has gone wonky for sure.

Christianbookworm
11-07-2014, 06:27 AM
It would be even worse if we were actually on drugs... which is why we don't! Caffeine and sugar doesn't count.

Paprika
11-07-2014, 09:01 AM
It would be even worse if we were actually on drugs... which is why we don't! Caffeine and sugar doesn't count.
Caffeine is a psychoactive drug.

Sparko
11-07-2014, 09:04 AM
Caffeine is a psychoactive drug.

My doctor told me to drink more coffee.

True.

So it is is medical coffee and not recreational. :smug:

Christianbookworm
11-07-2014, 09:05 AM
Caffeine is a psychoactive drug.

Presumably the only psychoactive recreational drug we might use. That's why I made it an exception to the not using recreational drugs!

Cow Poke
11-07-2014, 09:06 AM
My doctor told me to drink more coffee.

True.

So it is is medical coffee and not recreational. :smug:

And dark chocolate is my heart medicine! :yes:

KingsGambit
11-07-2014, 09:07 AM
Alcohol is a psychoactive drug as well, and obviously it is not inherently sinful.

This is why I'm not as willing to make blanket judgments about marijuana for everybody. I think the jury is still out as to what exactly its health effects are. But even if it does... would we have to conclude that eating candy is inherently sinful because it's bad for you?

Marijuana is definitely the wrong choice for me. But I'm not willing to make that choice for everybody.

Paprika
11-07-2014, 09:07 AM
Presumably the only psychoactive recreational drug we might use. That's why I made it an exception to the not using recreational drugs!
Druggie!

Christianbookworm
11-07-2014, 09:09 AM
Druggie!

I don't drink coffee! Chocolate is yummy, though! :tongue:

KingsGambit
11-07-2014, 09:15 AM
I don't drink coffee! Chocolate is yummy, though! :tongue:

Cerebrum and I had a "heated" discussion on coffee the other day. :outtie:

Christianbookworm
11-07-2014, 09:16 AM
Cerebrum and I had a "heated" discussion on coffee the other day. :outtie:

:huh: Didn't think anyone had a problem with drinking coffee...

fm93
11-07-2014, 09:17 AM
Cerebrum and I had a "heated" discussion on coffee the other day. :outtie:
Who won? Did you cream him, or was it half-and-half?

Sparko
11-07-2014, 09:17 AM
I just voted "yes" in my own poll, just because nobody else did! :smug:

Cow Poke
11-07-2014, 09:18 AM
Cerebrum and I had a "heated" discussion on coffee the other day. :outtie:

I kinda thought something was brewing between you two!

fm93
11-07-2014, 09:32 AM
I kinda thought something was brewing between you two!
If only he'd just spill the beans already.

Cerebrum123
11-07-2014, 10:06 AM
:huh: Didn't think anyone had a problem with drinking coffee...

I just think it's disgusting, and I don't understand why anyone would willingly subject themselves to it. :shrug:

fm93
11-07-2014, 10:11 AM
I just think it's disgusting, and I don't understand why anyone would willingly subject themselves to it. :shrug:
I personally can't stand the taste either, but I'll occasionally have a cup if I need to keep myself awake on a long drive after barely getting any sleep.

Sparko
11-07-2014, 10:15 AM
I just think it's disgusting, and I don't understand why anyone would willingly subject themselves to it. :shrug:Did you only try black coffee? Might want to try it with cream and sugar

Cerebrum123
11-07-2014, 10:17 AM
Did you only try black coffee? Might want to try it with cream and sugar

I put in quite a bit of sugar, started to taste like water that had dissolved oyster crackers in it. The "caffe latte" thing just tasted bitter, regardless how much sugar you put in.

Sparko
11-07-2014, 10:24 AM
I put in quite a bit of sugar, started to taste like water that had dissolved oyster crackers in it. The "caffe latte" thing just tasted bitter, regardless how much sugar you put in.
cream helps.

One Bad Pig
11-07-2014, 10:25 AM
I just think it's disgusting, and I don't understand why anyone would willingly subject themselves to it. :shrug:
I've acquired a taste for it, but I still almost never drink it if I'm not trying to stay awake. I usually drink it black & bitter, though I'll add some sugar if I need to wake up immediately (since the effect of caffeine takes a little while to hit).

Cerebrum123
11-07-2014, 10:29 AM
cream helps.

I think some was put in the cafe latte, and it certainly didn't. Of course, now that I have RSD, I can't have caffeine anyway(the small amounts in chocolate are okay in moderation though).

KingsGambit
11-07-2014, 11:55 AM
I see a change in the poll. We have a brave soul who has voted "yes". I wonder who?

mossrose
11-07-2014, 11:59 AM
I see a change in the poll. We have a brave soul who has voted "yes". I wonder who?


I just voted "yes" in my own poll, just because nobody else did!

:smile:

Sparko
11-07-2014, 12:01 PM
:smile:

To be fair, I was high at the time and didn't know what I was doing.

Zymologist
11-07-2014, 12:02 PM
To be fair, I was high at the time and didn't know what I was doing.

I was gonna vote yes on the poll, but then I got high.

Christianbookworm
11-07-2014, 12:02 PM
To be fair, I was high at the time and didn't know what I was doing.

:shock: I hope you be kidding!

Christianbookworm
11-07-2014, 12:03 PM
Great, more drug jokes...

KingsGambit
11-07-2014, 12:09 PM
I was gonna vote yes on the poll, but then I got high.

Great. Now I'm going to have that stuck in my head for the rest of the day.

fm93
11-07-2014, 12:20 PM
angels we have heard are high

Cow Poke
11-07-2014, 12:23 PM
If only he'd just spill the beans already.

On what grounds do you make such a claim?

thewriteranon
11-07-2014, 12:23 PM
I think some was put in the cafe latte, and it certIainly didn't. Ofcourse, now that I have RSD, I can't have caffeine anyway(the small amounts in chocolate are okay in moderation though).

A latte is mostly milk with a shot of espresso. for whatever reason Starbucks espresso tastes over roasted in the states.It was much creamier in France. If I get a hot latte I typically get it flavored to compensate for the bitter taste.The iced coffee is much smoother. You can also take the edge off bitter coffee with salt. /professional barista

Zymologist
11-07-2014, 12:24 PM
Great. Now I'm going to have that stuck in my head for the rest of the day.

You're welcome. :smug:

fm93
11-07-2014, 12:32 PM
On what grounds do you make such a claim?
I look through information filters every morning. You know what they say: "The best part of waking up is folders in your CPU!"

HeteroDoxic
11-07-2014, 02:29 PM
I look through information filters every morning. You know what they say: "The best part of waking up is folders in your CPU!"

And Ascii s=tupid question get a stupid ansi.

Jedidiah
11-07-2014, 02:43 PM
Caffeine is a psychoactive drug.

That does not respond to the fact that it does not count in Christianbookworm's post.

In addition I have tried psychoactive drugs and caffeine does not seem to have any effect of that sort. What ever psychoactive quality it has is lost on me.

Jedidiah
11-07-2014, 02:50 PM
Did you only try black coffee? Might want to try it with cream and sugar

I do not like coffee with sugar. Cream is okay, but not sugar. Sweet coffee and coffee candies are unpleasant for me. I have a large cup most mornings, but if I miss it I do not get any noticeable effects.

Paprika
11-07-2014, 09:50 PM
That does not respond to the fact that it does not count in Christianbookworm's post.
I believe she got my intended point that she was doing special pleading.



In addition I have tried psychoactive drugs and caffeine does not seem to have any effect of that sort. What ever psychoactive quality it has is lost on me.
It doesn't take much time for you to google caffeine and find out its classification.

RumTumTugger
11-07-2014, 09:57 PM
I just think it's disgusting, and I don't understand why anyone would willingly subject themselves to it. :shrug:

Cerebrum it's an aquired taste if you haven't aquired it you will never understand. lets just leave it at that. ok?

RumTumTugger
11-07-2014, 09:58 PM
:shock: I hope you be kidding!

CBW he is don't worry

rogue06
11-07-2014, 10:47 PM
Used to smoke my share of pot back in "the day." It might even be fair to say I might even smoked someone else's share as well a couple times.

Now... If it were legal and didn't cost an arm and a leg I would probably indulge about the same way as I do with alcohol. About a dozen or less times a year.

Christianbookworm
11-08-2014, 05:12 AM
I believe she got my intended point that she was doing special pleading.


It doesn't take much time for you to google caffeine and find out its classification.
I wasn't being serious...

Paprika
11-08-2014, 09:47 AM
I wasn't being serious...
Neither was I.

Christianbookworm
11-08-2014, 10:55 AM
Neither was I.

I thought you were Mr. Philosophy and Logic?

Paprika
11-08-2014, 11:08 AM
I thought you were Mr. Philosophy and Logic?
The best jokes are philosophical.

Jedidiah
11-08-2014, 11:34 AM
I believe she got my intended point that she was doing special pleading.


It doesn't take much time for you to google caffeine and find out its classification.

'What ever psychoactive quality it has is lost on me. " This argues any classification how?

Jedidiah
11-08-2014, 11:36 AM
Used to smoke my share of pot back in "the day." It might even be fair to say I might even smoked someone else's share as well a couple times.

Now... If it were legal and didn't cost an arm and a leg I would probably indulge about the same way as I do with alcohol. About a dozen or less times a year.

I smoked well more than my share, back in the day. It allowed me to escape from my troubles - mental ones. I don't need that today so not interested. A beer or two, a shot or two does not have a great impact on me, but pot has a much larger one.

Jesse
11-09-2014, 02:01 AM
Used to smoke my share of pot back in "the day." It might even be fair to say I might even smoked someone else's share as well a couple times.

Now... If it were legal and didn't cost an arm and a leg I would probably indulge about the same way as I do with alcohol. About a dozen or less times a year.

I'm saving myself for cocaine.

seanD
11-10-2014, 06:46 PM
No, because I'm a prude about such things; not for moral reasons but health reasons. But I support legalization.

Jedidiah
11-11-2014, 12:00 AM
But I support legalization.

I have mixed feelings about legalization. It would have been best never to have been outlawed. But with the sad state our culture is in we might be in a world of hurt if the gate was just opened.

seanD
11-11-2014, 07:42 AM
I have mixed feelings about legalization. It would have been best never to have been outlawed. But with the sad state our culture is in we might be in a world of hurt if the gate was just opened.

It's the lesser of evils.

KingsGambit
11-11-2014, 08:18 AM
For that matter, society would probably be better off if tobacco smoking had never become a major legal industry. I have no doubt it's more dangerous than marijuana. But that cat has long been out of the bag.

Cow Poke
11-11-2014, 08:21 AM
For that matter, society would probably be better off if tobacco smoking had never become a major legal industry. I have no doubt it's more dangerous than marijuana. But that cat has long been out of the bag.

But cigarette smokers are becoming more and more "second class citizens", with many municipalities outlawing smoking in any public buildings - even privately owned restaurants.

KingsGambit
11-11-2014, 08:27 AM
But cigarette smokers are becoming more and more "second class citizens", with many municipalities outlawing smoking in any public buildings - even privately owned restaurants.

I do think privately owned businesses should have the right to allow it. I just won't go there.

Cow Poke
11-11-2014, 08:33 AM
I do think privately owned businesses should have the right to allow it. I just won't go there.

I guess I'm a libertarian in that regard -- a private business, say a bar or bowling alley, should be allowed to make a business decision that they can make more money by allowing OR disallowing smoking. Customers have a choice of coming in or not. Personally, I wouldn't eat in a restaurant where smoking was permitted, and I could smell it. If they had a separate smoking section that TRULY was separate, that'd be different.

We had an IHOP that allowed smoking in one of their dining sections on weekends, but they weren't able to "contain" that smoke smell to just that section. Eventually, they just banned smoking altogether, because they got enough complaints from nonsmoking customers. But it was their choice.

rogue06
11-11-2014, 08:37 AM
I do think privately owned businesses should have the right to allow it. I just won't go there.
Which would be your absolute right. Business owners should be given latitude to make decisions like that with the consumers/public being the final arbitrator on those decisions -- if they don't like them the owners of the business will lose revenue

37818
11-27-2014, 11:27 AM
No. Like tobacco I see it as a work of the flesh as spoken of in Galatians, ". . . Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are [these]; . . . witchcraft{φαρμακεια, pharmakeia}, . . . and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told [you] in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God." -- Galatians 5:20, 21.

KingsGambit
11-27-2014, 06:12 PM
No. Like tobacco I see it as a work of the flesh as spoken of in Galatians, ". . . Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are [these]; . . . witchcraft{φαρμακεια, pharmakeia}, . . . and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told [you] in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God." -- Galatians 5:20, 21.

Alcohol is just as much of a drug as these, if we're going to go by this particular etymology.

37818
11-29-2014, 05:56 PM
Alcohol is just as much of a drug as these, if we're going to go by this particular etymology.Then why the distinction ". . . witchcraft, . . . drunkenness, . . ?" The first one is being brought under the control of the substance, and the latter one has lost control of one's judgment. Addiction to alcohol would also would apply to the former, and loss of control where it applies to the latter, μέθη methe. Is this true or not true?

TimelessTheist
11-30-2014, 12:21 PM
Nah. I can't really see any theological problem with it, but I still don't want to use it.

KingsGambit
11-30-2014, 01:34 PM
Then why the distinction ". . . witchcraft, . . . drunkenness, . . ?" The first one is being brought under the control of the substance, and the latter one has lost control of one's judgment. Addiction to alcohol would also would apply to the former, and loss of control where it applies to the latter, μέθη methe. Is this true or not true?

"Witchcraft" is probably much more in the spirit of the context. I think tobacco smoking is a bad idea but I don't think it falls in line with what Paul had in mind there. This verse has also been used to argue against Christians taking medicine, and if we're going to take it that literally, it could support that idea too. I think we should stick with the likely context of pagan rituals.

37818
12-01-2014, 05:57 PM
"Witchcraft" is probably much more in the spirit of the context. I think tobacco smoking is a bad idea but I don't think it falls in line with what Paul had in mind there. This verse has also been used to argue against Christians taking medicine, and if we're going to take it that literally, it could support that idea too. I think we should stick with the likely context of pagan rituals.Believe what you want.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_tobacco#Early_history

One Bad Pig
12-01-2014, 06:14 PM
Believe what you want.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_tobacco#Early_history
I believe nothing on wikipedia that's in any way controversial.

KingsGambit
12-02-2014, 09:14 PM
At most, this establishes that Christians shouldn't be using tobacco as a part of pagan religious rituals.

37818
12-04-2014, 12:15 PM
I believe nothing on wikipedia that's in any way controversial.

Not just wikipedia . . .

(CNN) -- Tobacco was first used by the peoples of the pre-Columbian Americas. Native Americans apparently cultivated the plant and smoked it in pipes for medicinal and ceremonial purposes. (http://http://edition.cnn.com/US/9705/tobacco/history/)

seanD
12-06-2014, 09:48 PM
If we're dealing strictly in terms of theology, with politics and societal practicality aside, I wouldn't be at all quick to disassociate drugs with sorcery considering the human devastation (physically, mentally and spirtually) the former leaves in its wake. It might be bit more of a grey area for legal drugs, though probably not by much.

Andius
12-06-2014, 09:59 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPG8iBqz8us

KingsGambit
12-08-2014, 08:52 PM
Andius... isn't that from the episode where a casino owner tries to commit insurance fraud by baiting the Joker into destroying his casino?

Andius
12-09-2014, 08:46 AM
Andius... isn't that from the episode where a casino owner tries to commit insurance fraud by baiting the Joker into destroying his casino?

Jahvol! :wink:

Mmhh, I think it is, in that prison scene he flipped out when he saw it, heheheheheh.