Dumbing down the church?

[BeJoyous]

Lately, I have been receiving different cirriculm for Sunday school and VBS. I am getting disappointed.

It seems that there is little Bible in the Bible lesson. Most of the lesson invovles games, crafts, and a cutesy story.

What happened to the day when kids brought their Bible to church. Seems todays kids can't find where the New Testament is without having to look at the table of context (if they can even figure out where that is)

And what about the days of "Bible Bowl"? Do they even exist? There is a poor excuse for one that I know of. They give you a sheet of the questions that will be asked at the next quizzing and then you have to answer exactly as it is written. In other words, if you are asked a question about Jesus letting down the nets, and respond that, "Jesus told Simon Peter to let down the nets for a catch" and the sheets says, "Jesus said to Simon to let down the nets for a catch." you got it wrong.

Back when I was a kid and a non-Christian, I knew more Bible truths than some of the Christians kids today.

I am so worried that kids are gonna grow up and not be strong in their knowledge and thus be week in their faith.

EVERY Christian has trying times. In those times you need to be able to know your Bible and know your faith is strong. (not how to play red rover)

So please tell me that there are Christians out there that know more than John 3:16. Tell me that there are Christians out there that care more about what the Bible says than if the powerpoint presentation is broke.

[mossrose]

I absolutely agree with you! This has been an issue with me for a long time, but you have put my frustration into words, and very well, too!

Do you think part of the problem is the "we don't want to offend anyone, so we will keep it all light and fluffy and not get into the real truth" attitude that is so prevalent in many of our churches these days?

And don't even get me started on powerpoint!!!

:mossrose:

[spiritmech]

Yes, that is very disappointing. I plan on having Bible studies with my daughter. As she is only two, I read some Psalms to her (if she will sit still long enough) and sing her Christian songs.

Steve

[learning]

I have found that our church is pretty good with things like this, they do have games etc., but they also have Bible stories, and when I taught Children's Church last, some of the kids wanted to know where the story of Paul and the ship wreck on the sea was in the Bible, so we looked it up there as well as heard the dramatization on the CD. We also acted it out, which is I think a good way of helping the message stick.

My kids have memory verses they have to learn each week, but I have found that some homeschool catalogues have good things that help in teaching about the Bible. They also have some good things about teaching character from the Bible, from Proverbs, etc. Here'a a few web sites that show this, but the best thing is to try and teach your children through reading the Bible or Bible stories

www.pearables.com
www.doorposts.net/index.htm

[Lizard]

Don't get me started on my :soapbox: !!!!!!

It's not just the Kid's that get the dumbed down material. It is the adults!!!!!

I am not certain, but I guess that the most widely taught book in churches in the US is Purpose Driven Life. :sigh:

I was really excited when my church announced they were going to use this (not having read it, but having heard how good it was :bugeyes: ). I read the first 7 chapters, and it was turning my brain into mush. :barf: I could read no more.

[learning]

We went through "The Purpose Driven Life" and a lady in our church said it is written at a grade four level (probably to be able to reach the 60% of people that are said to be low in literacy) and that they say in the book that they have put in things in there so one can go deeper if one wishes. I found that even though it was 'dumbed down' that some of the Biblical promises still are wonderful to go over again.

[truthman]

When I was in 4th grade Sunday School, we were expected to know the 66 books in order, the 12 disciples and many other factoids, such as book authors. These many factoids were cool, and made me good at Bible trivia, but even back then (early 1980s) they didn't teach us the basic church doctrines (Southern Baptist) to the point where we could defend them.

This is very different than some catechisms from yesteryear where the children not only memorized (and hopefully internalized) church doctrine but much of the catechism would be phrased "And how do we know this?".

So, unfortunately eckleymom and others, it's not necessarily a new problem, but definitely a worse problem.

[Meta4]

This is a multi-faceted issue and can't be blamed entirely upon our churches. Education begins with (and is ultimately the responsibility of) the parents.

To take it a step further, all Christian education begins at home. That which is learned in church (for children *and* adults) should simply be the foundation and pattern for our own learning.

Far too many parents have an expectation that Christian education should come solely from the church. How wrong they are! These days, most of our Sunday School children have been raised with little to no "God Time" at home, so they must learn the most basic elements of their faith at church. If these foundations were set at home, their church time could be spent expanding upon that foundation instead of starting from scratch every week.

To compare this to traditional education, it'd be tantamount to sending your child to school once per week for an hour or two. We can't reasonably expect our children to learn the three R's in any respectable period of time by studyin one day per week, so why do we expect our children to learn the most important life lessons in the same period of time?

Parents that fail to teach their children about God outside of the church walls are impairing not only their own children, but also the other children in the church. If one child in a class of ten can't comprehend the basics of Christianity, the teacher must elect to either "leave them behind" to move on to more complex issues or pull the rest of the class down to reteach the basics. Furthermore, it is impossible to tell how many "missed opportunities" that child will face because they can't intelligently expound on their beliefs because they simply don't know how to. I'd imagine the repercussions of such a "domino effect" could be quite severe.

Ultimately, once our childrens' generation comes of age, the church will face untold doctrinal hardships because of these "dumbed down" lessons. Even now, many (most?) Christians can't defend their beliefs because they don't know how to. Most Christians consider themselves well-versed if they can pick up a bible and point out the basics of salvation, let alone more intricate doctrinal issues such as baptism, tongues (or the lack thereof), prayer, communion, and so forth.

Bible apologetics is seriously lacking, and it has already started to catch up with us. We need to make sure that our children not only know what they believe, but know how to support those beliefs with scripture. Moreover, they need to be able to intelligently articulate those thoughts. Knowledge is only useful if iti s known and can be shared.

Sorry for the slightly off-topic rant, but I hope it sheds some light on my perspective of the "dumbing down" of Christianity today.

-Bro. James R. Rogers

[Ulmo]

This is a multi-faceted issue and can't be blamed entirely upon our churches. Education begins with (and is ultimately the responsibility of) the parents.

To take it a step further, all Christian education begins at home. That which is learned in church (for children *and* adults) should simply be the foundation and pattern for our own learning.

Far too many parents have an expectation that Christian education should come solely from the church. How wrong they are! These days, most of our Sunday School children have been raised with little to no "God Time" at home, so they must learn the most basic elements of their faith at church. If these foundations were set at home, their church time could be spent expanding upon that foundation instead of starting from scratch every week.

To compare this to traditional education, it'd be tantamount to sending your child to school once per week for an hour or two. We can't reasonably expect our children to learn the three R's in any respectable period of time by studyin one day per week, so why do we expect our children to learn the most important life lessons in the same period of time?

Parents that fail to teach their children about God outside of the church walls are impairing not only their own children, but also the other children in the church. If one child in a class of ten can't comprehend the basics of Christianity, the teacher must elect to either "leave them behind" to move on to more complex issues or pull the rest of the class down to reteach the basics. Furthermore, it is impossible to tell how many "missed opportunities" that child will face because they can't intelligently expound on their beliefs because they simply don't know how to. I'd imagine the repercussions of such a "domino effect" could be quite severe.

Ultimately, once our childrens' generation comes of age, the church will face untold doctrinal hardships because of these "dumbed down" lessons. Even now, many (most?) Christians can't defend their beliefs because they don't know how to. Most Christians consider themselves well-versed if they can pick up a bible and point out the basics of salvation, let alone more intricate doctrinal issues such as baptism, tongues (or the lack thereof), prayer, communion, and so forth.

Bible apologetics is seriously lacking, and it has already started to catch up with us. We need to make sure that our children not only know what they believe, but know how to support those beliefs with scripture. Moreover, they need to be able to intelligently articulate those thoughts. Knowledge is only useful if iti s known and can be shared.

Sorry for the slightly off-topic rant, but I hope it sheds some light on my perspective of the "dumbing down" of Christianity today.

-Bro. James R. Rogers


Very well said :yes:

[BeJoyous]

This is a multi-faceted issue and can't be blamed entirely upon our churches. Education begins with (and is ultimately the responsibility of) the parents.

To take it a step further, all Christian education begins at home. That which is learned in church (for children *and* adults) should simply be the foundation and pattern for our own learning.

Far too many parents have an expectation that Christian education should come solely from the church. How wrong they are! These days, most of our Sunday School children have been raised with little to no "God Time" at home, so they must learn the most basic elements of their faith at church. If these foundations were set at home, their church time could be spent expanding upon that foundation instead of starting from scratch every week.

To compare this to traditional education, it'd be tantamount to sending your child to school once per week for an hour or two. We can't reasonably expect our children to learn the three R's in any respectable period of time by studyin one day per week, so why do we expect our children to learn the most important life lessons in the same period of time?

Parents that fail to teach their children about God outside of the church walls are impairing not only their own children, but also the other children in the church. If one child in a class of ten can't comprehend the basics of Christianity, the teacher must elect to either "leave them behind" to move on to more complex issues or pull the rest of the class down to reteach the basics. Furthermore, it is impossible to tell how many "missed opportunities" that child will face because they can't intelligently expound on their beliefs because they simply don't know how to. I'd imagine the repercussions of such a "domino effect" could be quite severe.

Ultimately, once our childrens' generation comes of age, the church will face untold doctrinal hardships because of these "dumbed down" lessons. Even now, many (most?) Christians can't defend their beliefs because they don't know how to. Most Christians consider themselves well-versed if they can pick up a bible and point out the basics of salvation, let alone more intricate doctrinal issues such as baptism, tongues (or the lack thereof), prayer, communion, and so forth.

Bible apologetics is seriously lacking, and it has already started to catch up with us. We need to make sure that our children not only know what they believe, but know how to support those beliefs with scripture. Moreover, they need to be able to intelligently articulate those thoughts. Knowledge is only useful if iti s known and can be shared.

Sorry for the slightly off-topic rant, but I hope it sheds some light on my perspective of the "dumbing down" of Christianity today.

-Bro. James R. Rogers


My point exactly!! :thumb:

(I just don't always make sense when I'm on a rant)

[Vitae]

While I agree with everyone here, I would like to point out a few things.

First your right about the dumbing down of the church. I didn't even know there were 66 books, and i doubt I could tell you half. When I want to look at a verse I have to flip through to find the book it's in.

Ive never liked how simple things are, and I usualy push my fellow youth members to think, and ive been pushing my youth minister to push them some. We (youth minister and I) have deep discussions often, but very rarely do any of the other members get in depth with our discussions.

I would like to point one thing out. I myself am christian, a pathetic one, but one trying none the less, my mother is an ordained minister and has a masters degree in divinity.

However, I cannot remember her once sitting down with me and teaching me things, or giving me instruction. I can't honestly say why she did this, could have been she was just so busy, or didn't know how, but I like to think that she was giving me a choice.... a choice to find christ and accept him into my life. Now granted I grew up going to church, so someone could argue thats not much of a choice, but none the less.

So while I will always remember her singing Jacobs ladder to me whenever I had a nightmare, she never forced christanity and jesus upon me, church yes, but not belief. However now that I am forming my beliefs and dissecting the christian religion, faith, and spirituality, she helps me, we sit and have discussions, and she piles books on me.

Honestly this is how I think it should be........ give the choice, and back them, get behind them and drown them with knowledge.

As for the dumbing down..... hold your own Sunday Schools, start your own studies and invite the kids, make it for kids. Offer them food, if, and only if they meet criteria.

[skyward]

Lately, I have been receiving different cirriculm for Sunday school and VBS. I am getting disappointed.

It seems that there is little Bible in the Bible lesson. Most of the lesson invovles games, crafts, and a cutesy story.

What happened to the day when kids brought their Bible to church. Seems todays kids can't find where the New Testament is without having to look at the table of context (if they can even figure out where that is)

And what about the days of "Bible Bowl"? Do they even exist? There is a poor excuse for one that I know of. They give you a sheet of the questions that will be asked at the next quizzing and then you have to answer exactly as it is written. In other words, if you are asked a question about Jesus letting down the nets, and respond that, "Jesus told Simon Peter to let down the nets for a catch" and the sheets says, "Jesus said to Simon to let down the nets for a catch." you got it wrong.

Back when I was a kid and a non-Christian, I knew more Bible truths than some of the Christians kids today.

I am so worried that kids are gonna grow up and not be strong in their knowledge and thus be week in their faith.

EVERY Christian has trying times. In those times you need to be able to know your Bible and know your faith is strong. (not how to play red rover)

So please tell me that there are Christians out there that know more than John 3:16. Tell me that there are Christians out there that care more about what the Bible says than if the powerpoint presentation is broke.




I agree too. Were is the fire the zeal. I just waiting to see x box and playstation in the sunday school rooms. I cant beleave waht our youth dont know. i have kida that learn they numbers rather than the Bible.

hey I remember have to memerize bible verses to even go to the bathroom
they all need a good dose of bible