Describe God

[KyleX0rz]

I was listening to an old debate from infidelguy.com with gene cook vs reggie anyways a question came up which I thought was interesting

Describe God, and you cant describe God by using an action or a result.

[shunyadragon]

I was listening to an old debate from infidelguy.com with gene cook vs reggie anyways a question came up which I thought was interesting

Describe God, and you cant describe God by using an action or a result.
God is unknowable, and cannot be defined by the doctrine or orthodoxy of any religion, church or belief. We know the essence of God through the nature of existence and revelation which is universal with humanity and existence itself.

This describes God based on what we can and cannot know and not cause and effect.

God is not a chessplayer with the white pieces.
God is the sea and we are the fishes.

[Zxcv Bnm]

I was listening to an old debate from infidelguy.com with gene cook vs reggie anyways a question came up which I thought was interesting

Describe God, and you cant describe God by using an action or a result.There are as many descriptions of God as there are worldviews, so the answer to the question really will depend on who is answering the question.

God is incomprehensible, but can at least be known as the Son has revealed Him (if you want a Christian view). Typically, analogical language would be needed to describe God.

God is infinite: He is omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent, eternal, unique, and self-sufficient.

God is transcendent (distinct from His creation).

God is personal: He has emotion (compassion, anger, jealousy); shows love (patience, kindness, forgiveness, long-suffering, mercy, grace, faithfulness); and has a will (to create, and to desire a loving relationship with His creatures).

God is Holy: He is perfect in all His ways, has an unchanging nature, is just, and does not sin.

God is triune (three persons in one God): there is one God; the Father is God; the Son is God; the Holy Spirit is God; the three persons are eternally distinct.

[yxboom]

Describe God, and you cant describe God by using an action or a result.
About 6'11 280 lbs.

[Raptor]

About 6'11 280 lbs.
He's unstoppable in the post, and he can shoot the 3 too.

[yxboom]

He's unstoppable in the post, and he can shoot the 3 too.
violation. those are actions

[Heathen Dawn]

Describe God, and you cant describe God by using an action or a result.

God is an Infinite Spirit, occupying all of space and all of time. God is made of Uncreated Light. God is Love. God is the Life-Force behind every atom (immanence). God is the Will and Intelligence who created the universe (transcendence). God is a Person who loves and wishes to be loved. God is both male and female. God is personified, made known through His/Her anthropomorphic images, the many Gods and Goddesses. God is the Father of Light, who inseminated the universe from outside. God is the Mother of the Universe, the universe is all inside Her, growing inside Her womb. God is He (Father of Light) and She (Mother of the Universe) and It (Life-Force behind everything) and They (many persons, ie Gods and Goddesses) all at the same time.

[exile]

Just a quick comment - for an unknowable being, people seem to know a lot about God.

As an atheist this question is extremely difficult to answer other than "a being that either doesn't exist or that we cannot know the properties of" but since I take the Argument from Design as the best theist argument, God is most likely to be a cosmic designer who created a universe without necessarily knowing the full consequences. That is, a deity that is not omnipotent (He created a flawed universe), not omniscient (He could not foresee the future in detail) and not omnibenevolent (such a concept as "good" could not apply meaningfully to a being powerful enough to create a universe). Specifically, all we know is that he was capable of designing a universe, and everything else is speculation. I would not consider such a being worthy of worship, and His existence would be of little interest other than as a metaphysical concept.

[shunyadragon]

Just a quick comment - for an unknowable being, people seem to know a lot about God.
Just like Famous actors, actresses, powerful politians, Mafia and other influentials it is common to claim to know them on a first name basis whether you do or not. Fear and desire generate a lot knowing.

As an atheist this question is extremely difficult to answer other than "a being that either doesn't exist or that we cannot know the properties of" but since I take the Argument from Design as the best theist argument, God is most likely to be a cosmic designer who created a universe without necessarily knowing the full consequences. That is, a deity that is not omnipotent (He created a flawed universe), not omniscient (He could not foresee the future in detail) and not omnibenevolent (such a concept as "good" could not apply meaningfully to a being powerful enough to create a universe). Specifically, all we know is that he was capable of designing a universe, and everything else is speculation. I would not consider such a being worthy of worship, and His existence would be of little interest other than as a metaphysical concept.
The universe is not necessarily flawed just because it may appear flawed from one of many possible points of view. Their may be many universe that appear equally flawed, but also equally beautiful and magnificent.

"Good" from our humble egocentric point of view may not be good at all. Are you sure the one you do not believe in is a 'He'.

It is very possible that our universe just happens as it naturally should in a granded scheme of a vaste Divine river. Our overblown sense of self-importance of trying to define, describe or limit the capability of the Divine is foolish whether God exists or not.

[Heathen Dawn]

Just a quick comment - for an unknowable being, people seem to know a lot about God.

Not all theists say God is unknowable. In the tradition of Islam and religions that branched from it (like Sikhism and Baha’ism) God is held to be unknowable. But in most Christian and most pagan traditions it is believed that God can be known. Anthropomorphism is especially a valuable property enabling mankind to know God (through Jesus, whom the Christians call the living image of God, or through the anthropomorphic Gods and Goddesses pagans believe in).

I must add that, when I use that phrase, the “knowing” in “knowing God” does not refer to knowledge in the academic sense, the sense of acquisition of new information, but knowledge in the personal sense, in the sense that a man knows his wife.

As an atheist this question is extremely difficult to answer other than "a being that either doesn't exist or that we cannot know the properties of" but since I take the Argument from Design as the best theist argument, God is most likely to be a cosmic designer who created a universe without necessarily knowing the full consequences. That is, a deity that is not omnipotent (He created a flawed universe), not omniscient (He could not foresee the future in detail) and not omnibenevolent (such a concept as "good" could not apply meaningfully to a being powerful enough to create a universe). Specifically, all we know is that he was capable of designing a universe, and everything else is speculation. I would not consider such a being worthy of worship, and His existence would be of little interest other than as a metaphysical concept.

I agree omnimax is an unnecessary burden. But God is worthy of worship, and His/Her existence is more than an academic topic. If no Creator, then no creation—God supplies the life of every atom. And to know God, through whichever image it may be, is to achieve bliss. I would say our purpose in life is to enjoy God.

[shunyadragon]

Not all theists say God is unknowable. In the tradition of Islam and religions that branched from it (like Sikhism and Baha’ism) God is held to be unknowable. But in most Christian and most pagan traditions it is believed that God can be known. Anthropomorphism is especially a valuable property enabling mankind to know God (through Jesus, whom the Christians call the living image of God, or through the anthropomorphic Gods and Goddesses pagans believe in).

I must add that, when I use that phrase, the “knowing” in “knowing God” does not refer to knowledge in the academic sense, the sense of acquisition of new information, but knowledge in the personal sense, in the sense that a man knows his wife.



I agree omnimax is an unnecessary burden. But God is worthy of worship, and His/Her existence is more than an academic topic. If no Creator, then no creation—God supplies the life of every atom. And to know God, through whichever image it may be, is to achieve bliss. I would say our purpose in life is to enjoy God.
God being unknowable in Islam and the Baha'i Faith, does not mean that nothing is known about God. If that is the case than no religion would essentially exist. The nature of God is revealed through the attributes of existence, our innate divine nature, and the revealed word of God, but unfortunately our view of God is flawed by our weak faliable nature of being human. The knowable nature of God is limited simply by the fact that God's nature transends all existence, and it is foolishly feeble-minded and egocentric to think that humans can define and 'know' God as many Christians claim to know on a first name basis.

To reduce our purpose in existence to a statement that 'our purpose in life is to enjoy God.' is egocentric in the extreme.

[exile]

Perhaps the correct description of God is "not COMPLETELY knowable".

I'm unsure why if God exists I should worship Him (or Her) purely because he exists and created the universe. There has to be something else - love, respect,
thankfulness. If for example like Job I really am not enjoying my existence why should I thank God for it? Many of us have said "I wish I had never been born", which is equivalent to wishing for the universe never to have been created.

[kofh2u]

I was listening to an old debate from infidelguy.com with gene cook vs reggie anyways a question came up which I thought was interesting

Describe God, and you cant describe God by using an action or a result.

You ask the most important question to be put before all who post on Tweb.

Without a clear and useful form of defining what we are talking about only nonsense and debate will ensue.

To say God is unknowable does not define what one means when using the term. To say the form of God is non-material, is spirit does not define God.


Here are two ideas that avoid these short comings:

1) "Universe" is what monotheists call God, Buckminster Fuller agrues.

Buckminster Fuller describes two basic entities he terms Me and Not me.

Me is that entity you refer to when you say, "I."

"I" is a spirit-like electromagnetic form of energy. "I" has learned that of a physical entity, the body, which "I" recognizes as property belonging to "I."

But,"I" is not that body. "I" is what we call mind. The body (including the brain) is similar to hardware assessories that interact with the software program(s). The program is akin to "I."'

The second entity is everything that is not "I." That is, the world beyond the mind. This even includes "my" own physical body.

Fuller calls one entity "You," and the other entity "Universe."

Universe is what monotheists call God, Fuller might agrue. It is everything that is not You.

2) God is a Concept.

God might be defined as that concept which saves you from destruction, even after the unavoidable natural death that observably comes to all.

The judeo-christian term, God, is a distinction between the monotheistic claim of one, Almighty God, and other Gods which are false. These other Gods are false in that they can not "save" you from destruction.

This implies that the Judeo-christian God can save you from destruction. mHenceGod is that Concept.

Consequently, God is defined as a concept serving as a survival mechanism.

Each God claims to be able to save those who behave in accord with the particular God's rites, accompanied by a ritualized recognition of service to that God's code for behavior called Worship.

[NeilUnreal]

If you are a Christian, Jesus Christ is God. Also if you are a Christian, go out the door and walk down the street. The first person you meet must become Christ to you. Therefore, God looks like the people you meet every day.

-Neil

[Heathen Dawn]

Perhaps the correct description of God is "not COMPLETELY knowable".

Yes, that’s more like it. Since God is transcendent as well as immanent, He/She is not completely knowable. But this is a far cry from what Muslims say, that only the attributes and will of God can be known. This is to know God on paper, while I believe in knowing God in person.

I'm unsure why if God exists I should worship Him (or Her) purely because he exists and created the universe. There has to be something else - love, respect,
thankfulness.

I agree with you. I don’t worship God because of His/Her power and creatorhood, I worship out of love—to love and to be loved, to be the Theophilos, or both lover and beloved, of my Goddess and God.

[Heathen Dawn]

God being unknowable in Islam and the Baha'i Faith, does not mean that nothing is known about God.

That’s right, and I never said so. But there is a difference between Islam’s knowledge of God, which is informational only, and Christianity’s knowledge, which is personal, emotional, intimate. The Pagan-Christian tradition regarding God holds that one should have a personal relationship with Him in the same way a husband has a relationship with his wife. It’s about intimacy. I elaborated on it in my article Allahu Mahabbah (http://eclecticsatyr.hostultra.com/mahabbah.htm). And see also an example in Henry Francis Lyte’s famous song, Abide With Me:

Thou on my head in early youth didst smile;
And, though rebellious and perverse meanwhile,
Thou hast not left me, oft as I left thee;
On to the close, O Lord, abide with me!

it is foolishly feeble-minded and egocentric to think that humans can define and 'know' God as many Christians claim to know on a first name basis.

No, it is foolish to settle for little or no relationship with God. It is foolish to settle for knowing God on paper rather than in person. You wouldn’t settle for knowing your parents through correspondence, and you wouldn’t settle for knowing William Shakespeare through reading his plays; why, then, do so many people settle for knowing God through His attributes and through scriptures? The Christians’ knowing God on a first name basis is how things should be.

To reduce our purpose in existence to a statement that 'our purpose in life is to enjoy God.' is egocentric in the extreme.

What is our purpose, then? And I don’t know if my statement is egocentric; I say it because I believe in its truth.

[kofh2u]

If you are a Christian, Jesus Christ is God. Also if you are a Christian, go out the door and walk down the street. The first person you meet must become Christ to you. Therefore, God looks like the people you meet every day.

-Neil


All true.

-Neil
"If you are a Christian, Jesus Christ is God."

KOFHY:
But, is He in your mind, part of your thinking, when you ask youself, "What would Jesus do?"

-Neil:
Also if you are a Christian, go out the door and walk down the street. The first person you meet must become Christ to you.

KOFHY:
God is the Son, every person yoj meet. The Father, everythi not you and not the Son.
God is the Holy Spirit who you, in your head ask, "What would Jesus do?"

-Neil:
Therefore, God...

KOFHY:
...the Son....?

-Neil:
... looks like the people....

KOFHY:
Out there? People not You, people, part of the universe "out there," which is not you?

-Neil:
... you meet every day....people...

KOFHY:
You describe the second commandment of the God who truly saves.

[pljames]

:sigh: Strange you should ask that question. No one has ever seen the face of GOD. Moses saw his backside. To me at first he was a feeling, now I see his creation in nature everywhere. Jesus was human and GOD incarnate. I see his, GODS spirit in nature, but I am having problems with seeing his nature in people. Its rare these days. pljames

[shunyadragon]

:sigh: Strange you should ask that question. No one has ever seen the face of GOD. Moses saw his backside. To me at first he was a feeling, now I see his creation in nature everywhere. Jesus was human and GOD incarnate. I see his, GODS spirit in nature, but I am having problems with seeing his nature in people. Its rare these days. pljames

Why should it be any more rare today than any other time in history. Nothing is much has changed considering the claims of people to be doing the will of God, knowing God, and talking to God personally. Humans throughout history performed acts of attrocity against their fellow humans and nature in the name of God, and claiming that their doing it on God's orders, at least just as frequently in the past as today.

[gharfish]

He was born in an obscure village, the child of a peasant woman. He grew up in another village. He worked in a carpenter shop until he was thirty, and then for three years He was an itinerant preacher. He never owned a home. He never wrote a book. He never held an office. He never had a family. He never went to college. He never put His foot inside a big city. He never traveled two hundred miles from the place that He was born. He never did one of the things that usually accompany greatness. He had no credentials but Himself.......While still a young man, the tide of popular opinion turned against Him. His friends ran away. One of them denied Him. He was turned over to His enemies. He went through the mockery of a trial. He was nailed upon a cross between two thieves. While He was dying His executioners gambled for the only piece of property He had on earth -His coat. When He was dead, He was taken down and laid in a borrowed grave through the pity of a friend.

Nineteen long centuries have come and gone, and today He is the centerpiece of the human race and the leader in the column of progress. I am far within the mark when I say that all the armies that ever marched, all the navies that were ever built, all the parliaments that ever sat and all the kings that ever reigned, put together, have not affected the life of man upon this earth as powerfully as has that one solitary life.

(anonymous)