I yanked her OUT!

[Rubia Warren]

I pulled my daughter out of public school kindergarten this morning.
I like phonics- they don't. They also have some tramsportation issues that they refuse to deal with, not to mention that they've put her on the wrong bus once, and she ended up at some little girl's house that I didn't even know, they let her go home with a male neighbor of mine who was there to pick up his son- who had no written permission from me, and they DIDN'T EVEN ASK HIM WHO HE WAS- they just let her go!
So, I got my wish and I get to homeschool now. :D
I have a rough plan made up, and it's not much different than what we are doing now. Although she was going to kindergarten, I was also working with her at home on reading, math, and writing, among other things. Because she's just in kindergarten, I'm not doing anything real serious, I'm going to keep it light because of her age.
If anyone has any suggestions, comments, or advice, PLEASE post it here! Especially all of you experienced homeschoolers out there! I would love to hear from all of you, as I'm going into uncharted territory! LOL I would love to know what kinds of things you did with your kids at this age, what worked, what didn't, etc.

[graceinme]

Thats great La rubia! Look into the homeschooling programs in your area. We found a great one that pays for everything. We even send our son to Karate for free as a P.E. You see, the schools get so much money for each child in school. If you find the right program, they get the money and let you have it to buy book and supplies to teach your child at home. Don't think you have to join some pricey Home school organization. Go to store like the Creative apple or Learning Tree. Those stores usually have info on the home schooling programs in your area. That how we found out about ours.

[GrayPilgrim]

I hope and pray that the Lord gives you special grace at this time to communicate to and to mold your daughter as He would have her to be!

[Rubia Warren]

Thank you, everybody!
Grace-
I have never heard of those programs before! I will check it out and see if Indiana does that sort of thing.
GP-
Thank YOU! I always appreciate being lifted up in prayer. It is priceless.
And Nori-
Ya know, I was on a site this morning that talked a little about "unschooling". Thank you for all of your advice! And if you or anybody else have any more suggestions, experiences, or advice, please post them here!
I'll be emailing ya soon, nori.

[Patroclus]

If I were you, I would do what's called unschooling. Another name for it is child-led learning. At her age, it won't do any harm to let her learn what she's interested in learning. I would do that for the rest of the school year. She can learn from life if you worried about that. She'll learn from helping you shop and cook (math and science). If you're already teaching her reading, that's good.

I am sorry Nori, I am going to have to disagree with you on this one. Five years is one of the most mentally fertile years of her life. This will be the easiest time to teach her the basics. While it can be relaxed and integrated with life experience, the foundations in math, reading, etc. need to be reinforced.

I recommend a group called Accelerated Christian Education (A.C.E.). They are a bit heavy on the Christian aspect (making some of the work seem like sunday school), but they are excellent for the formative grades.

-Rob

[Rubia Warren]

Oh, Rob,- my little pet! I thought of you earlier today, and I wondered what you were going to say about my decision!(since you have had experience being homeschooled).
I will certainly check out A.C.E.- I hadn't covered the christian part of it yet, but it's been one of my concerns... weaving it all in together, I mean. If you have any suggestions about anything, let me know.(LOL I already know about the yellow teeth thing, but I mean if you have any other ones, I wanna know!) LOL Just kidding. I love ya, Patroclus, you're the bomb!

[Em7add11]

My dad is the president of the main homeschooling organization here in Kansas. I'm not sure how much assistance he can offer on legal issues, that would be better suited for HSLDA (http://www.hslda.org), since he mainly only deals with Kansas homeschooling laws..

He teaches a class once a month on how to get started homeschooling and has tons of great advice from having taught me for 15 years :) I could ask him if he has any sort of helpful information to send you if you would like, cause I'll bet he would love to help out.

Just drop me a PM.

[Rubia Warren]

Aw, I would love that, Em! Thank you so much!
Btw- how did you like being homeschooled?

[Jade]

la rubia,

I'm glad for you. :cheers:
I rejoiced greatly that I found of thy children walking in truth, as we have received a commandment from the Father. --2 John 1:4

recommend a group called Accelerated Christian Education (A.C.E.). They are a bit heavy on the Christian aspect (making some of the work seem like sunday school), but they are excellent for the formative grades.

I also recommend the A.C.E. curriculum. I was taught via this method for 5 years of my formal education. Here is their website:

http://www.schooloftomorrow.com/homeschool/index.asp

[Em7add11]

It really was great. I don't have a lot else to compare it too though. I never set foot in a class in a public or private school, ever.

We were sort of the test case at my church. My sister and I were the oldest kids being homeschooled so we got a lot of comments like, "How are you gonna be prepared for real life." So far, only one of my church friends has beaten my ACT score. And I'm by no means a smart guy like Jaltus or GreyPilgrim.

I'm probably the only person at my college who thinks that college life is restricting, haha. I was used to so much freedom when it came to studying. This getting up at 8am everyday for a place that takes all my money is crazy. :yipee:

[Em7add11]

Oh, what's your email address? I'll see if my dad has anything to send you.

[Rubia Warren]

My address is: raulamy@bnin.net.
Did you ever wish that you could go to school like other kids (when you were younger)?
Hey, thanks, Jade!

[Em7add11]

Nah. Well maybe, but only for the girls. :rofl:

[Rubia Warren]

LOL. But, of course!

[Em7add11]

Ok, I asked my dad if he had anything for ya. He does, but he'd have to use snail-mail instead of email.

So I guess it depends on how comfortable you are giving your address to a complete stranger on an internet message board. :yipee:

[Patroclus]

La Rubia:
Did you ever wish that you could go to school like other kids (when you were younger)?


Yes, I often did. But I am very glad that I was homeschooled in my formative years. As I think I have told you, I am not a big proponent of home schooling during secondary education, but it is wonderful for primary education.

Other excellent curriculum (mostly for 4th-6th grades) are the Rod And Staff company. They are a Mennonite group, and they are rather strenuous in their material coverage. However, it is a good program. I was not taught on Rod and Staff, but my sister was.

-Rob

P.S. Make sure that you become a part of Home School Legal Defense (HSLDA). I cannot stress it enough. If you want to do this for the long haul, that group is esential.

[Ryokan]

Well, I am happy you got your wish La Rubia. :rockon: I know a lot of people who were homeschooled, and here is my advice.

1. Try to give her some sort of schedule. If you don't, it will be harder for her to adapt to college.
2. Try to encourage her to read, especially secular stuff. many home schooled people aren't cultured very much, and non homeschooled people are stuck explaining every little thing they say. You want your daughter to be aware of the modern world, I suspect.
3. Make sure she has non supervised activities with non-homeschooled kids from an early age. Otherwise she might be a little socially ackward.

If you can do that, I am sure she will be happier and healthier than any public or private school kid, especially since she doesn't have to deal with bullies, dumb teachers, or being late. :cool: :rockon:

[Rubia Warren]

Thank you, Ryokan. I think that it's really good advice. :yipee:

[Patroclus]

Ryokan:
Well, I am happy you got your wish La Rubia. :rockon: I know a lot of people who were homeschooled, and here is my advice.

1. Try to give her some sort of schedule. If you don't, it will be harder for her to adapt to college.
2. Try to encourage her to read, especially secular stuff. many home schooled people aren't cultured very much, and non homeschooled people are stuck explaining every little thing they say. You want your daughter to be aware of the modern world, I suspect.
3. Make sure she has non supervised activities with non-homeschooled kids from an early age. Otherwise she might be a little socially ackward.

If you can do that, I am sure she will be happier and healthier than any public or private school kid, especially since she doesn't have to deal with bullies, dumb teachers, or being late. :cool: :rockon:


I agree

[Reba]

http://www.robinsoncurriculum.com/


Above is the addy for what my daughter in law uses for her 4 kids.




Rob you said
"I recommend a group called Accelerated Christian Education (A.C.E.). They are a bit heavy on the Christian aspect (making some of the work seem like sunday school), but they are excellent for the formative grades."


hey i say great the more like Sunday School the better

[Susan]

La Rubia:
I pulled my daughter out of public school kindergarten this morning.

Congratulations!!!!!!!

My advice...find out what your state laws are concerning homeschooling. Where I live, if a child has attended school (including kindergarten) for even 1 day, you must begin to keep records as proof that your child is in a school situation.

You can turn anything into a learning experience! The world is your classroom.

I have two children, 10 yo boy and 5 yo girl. We have been homeschooling for 4 years and we follow a year round schedule.

My son uses the Alpha and Omega curriculum. My 5 yo is also using Alpha and Omega (Math and Phonics) and I supplement with other things such as a children's Bible story book, various Scholastic maze and dot-to-dot books (hand/eye coordination), and she "writes" in her diary everyday telling something special she did that day.

I allow her to set the pace, somedays she will sit there for hours, other days she does the work assigned for that day and nothing more. I find this works for us.

I am not required to keep records until she is 7, according to our state law, however, I do keep a file box with examples of her work just in case.

[Alden]

La Rubia-

I admire what you are doing. I'm sure it takes a great deal to commit to something like this. My fiance is a first-grade teacher who had an experience with teachers who didn't like phonics. Her dad's a pastor, so she changed schools more than a few times when she was a kid. She was taught primarily phonics until she was in the third grade. At that point she got to a school where phonics wasn't the favored method. She was having no problems reading at that point, that is, until her teacher told her that she was doing everything wrong and began to cram whole-language down her throat. Her mom and the teacher had major issues that year. Lacey (my fiance) is by no means a dumb person. She nearly has a masters in ed at 22, but she has me proof her papers because my grammer and spelling are better than hers. Her whole-language experience set her back some.

All this is to say good for you. As a soon to be teacher, and soon to be husband of a teacher, I can say I wish all parents were as actively involved in the educating of their children.

[Sozo]

La Rubia... before we started homeschooling, we taught each of our kids to read by age 5, and I highly recommend this book to make it easy for you to accomplish this. (If she isn't reading already).

BTW I applaud your decision :yipee:

I would send my kids to Michael Jackson's house before I would send them to public school.

Here is the book...

[Rubia Warren]

I am exremely grateful for these 2 last posts by Alden and Sozo. This is the problem I am having- reading.
Mali is a very smart girl, last year, she went to Head Start, which tends to have a bad rep. but this one, I could tell, was different. She had a very good teacher whom she fell completely in love with, and "Miss Iris" taught her so many things that I didn't even learn at that age. But the majority was phonics-based, and Mali even learned how to write. She can now almost write in cursive.
Since she began kindergarten, she's liked going to school, but I've noticed that the learning has come to a screeching halt. I have continued to read to her, and work with her with little workbooks and the like, but it never ocurred to me until recently that she was guessing at what words on a page said, instead of sounding them out. I started getting her to sound out the letters, and she was like, "huh?" she was memorizing things, instead of figuring out what new things said. This is a quote from the last newsletter I got from her teacher, to show you how stupid this program is:

"skills we will be working on in the next few weeks: character, setting, plot
fairy tales
sorting
rhymes
GUIDED READING- I am excited to see the progress your children are making in their reading. WE ARE WORKING HARD AT USING PICTURES TO GIVE THEM CLUES TO WHAT THE TEXT SAYS. We then compare that guess to the words on the page to see if they match. The children are learning that it is important to look at the beginning letter sounds!"

Hello? Using pictures to give clues? How about just learning how to sound out a word, so that you can even read books that have no pictures in them, and you can read indepentently, without memorizing words that your teacher showed you? DUH!!!
Luckily, I won't have a big habit to break from this, since she wasn't even doing this for a whole year yet.
More to come in my next post.

[Rubia Warren]

Sozo:
La Rubia... before we started homeschooling, we taught each of our kids to read by age 5, and I highly recommend this book to make it easy for you to accomplish this. (If she isn't reading already).

BTW I applaud your decision :yipee:

I would send my kids to Michael Jackson's house before I would send them to public school.

Here is the book...

Too cool that you posted this, as I was about at the end of my rope today, trying to figure out what the best way to show them would be. I was thinking, "I wish I could just find a book that would guide me!!"
You see, I was read to by my mom since I was a baby, and began to read around age 4- I don't know how I learned, I just took off reading one day. I later learned phonics in school, but I have not been able to figure out where to start with my kids, what's better to focus on first, etc. and it has frustrated me. This coming weekend, I'm getting this book, I needed something like this! Thanks, Sozo!

[Rubia Warren]

By the way, thank you Reba, and you, too, Susan, for your posts as well. That was very good advice, keep it coming, everybody!

[Alden]

GUIDED READING- I am excited to see the progress your children are making in their reading. WE ARE WORKING HARD AT USING PICTURES TO GIVE THEM CLUES TO WHAT THE TEXT SAYS. We then compare that guess to the words on the page to see if they match. The children are learning that it is important to look at the beginning letter sounds!"


I read a book called "Dumbing Down Our Kids." It gave an almost verbatim description of guided reading, and then continued its description in even more horrid detail. Reading this book made me extremely angry. That's saying a great deal considering that most books don't make me want to literally scream. If you want the author's name, I would be more than happy to find it for you. I recommend it to everyone.

[Rubia Warren]

Yeah, Alden, I'd like to know the author- I'd like to read it.
I never paid much attention to all the hoopty-hoo when they began changing it all, so I didn't realize really what was going on, and just how really bad it actually is. But seeing my daughter go from constantly learning and growing, and suddenly, NOTHING- that's literally the difference, I do not exaggerate. Like night and day, it's unbelievable. Why would you try to fix something that's not broken? :argh:
My daughter up until this year has been such an independant learner- she was always trying to figure things out on her own, and I accredit it to the way she was taught. When you're taught that way, you acquire skills that enable you to learn limitlessly, but this style of crap that she was learning this year, just made her rely on what was handed to her- and nothing more.

[DantheRM]

La Rubia,

I spend a lot of time in a Kindergarten classroom as a teacher in training. I think the thing you have to be careful to do is make sure your child gets the opportunity to be interactive and have learning opportunities with other students.

Like no other year, students in Kindergarten learn how to relate with one another in a shared learning environment. They learn to play, eat, communicate, and learn together.

Homeschooling programs only provide a portion of this exposure-- although I have met some very well adjusted homeschooled students; they usually make very successful college students.

Look for opportunities to get your daughter involved in activities with other children at the church. That would be a great place to start and also involvement in short day camp activities in the summer. (any longer than that is too much for an elementary school student).

Good luck. What matters is that you are seeking out the best for your child and your child will pick up on that.

Look for opportunities to use cheap manipulatives as much as possible (little plastic visuals and counters for math and other subjects) and never underestimate the value of reading to your child. These children need lots of breaks, but that doesn't mean their breaks can't have an educational component.

Break out in song and dance with your child as you sing about the letters of the alphabet in many different ways and for clean-up oh yeah! (That's a wonderful trick!)

Your child will appreciate the personalized instruction. Don't neglect her the best that you can give her.

And best of all you don't have to follow classroom criteria. You can bring God into the Curriculum! You can take your child on field trips whenever you want to learn in the real world-- at the store and at nature parks.

Beyond just what the child wants to learn is necessary though. This has been the fallacy I've fallen for in my own education. I've always been the creative one and wanted to learn my own way and adapt projects to my liking. Creative learning is absolutely WONDERFUL! There's nothing like it in the world, but the core basics must be learned. Most of us enjoyed drama in high school, but we still had to learn how to file taxes in govt. class; it's just one of those things.

Your child is going to be stubborn at times-- as you well know. You are going to have to be just as firm with her education at times as you are with her moral upbringing. A lot of her instruction should be open-ended, but something you'll just have to buckle down and meet the minimum standards in all areas just so she is not lacking anything she would have learned in the classroom, but enhancing it instead.

Good Luck to you and your daughter.

Christ be with You,
Dan

darnold@toylegacies.org
http://clik.to/MSUCWG

[abarnhar]

What a great decision! Our public school system certainly leaves much to be desired.

I will have to echo Dan. There is some extremely important social development that occurs in a public setting such as school. I know many home-schooled individuals. They are typically excellent students, but many I know lack in the social-skills department. It is important for your daughter to grow as a member in a Christian community and learn to trust the love and support that fellow believers give.

It is also just as important for her to be exposed to children of other faiths or even non-faith. Two of my friends who were home-schooled in solid Christian homes have run into problems when dealing with others outside their faiths. One of them acts horribly inappropriate (e.g., rude comments, put downs) when they are faced with an opposing view-point. It's behavior that is neither social nor Christian.

Blessings on this large step and all the little ones that will be on the way.

Adam

[Rubia Warren]

Thank you very much, you guys, for your advice!!! I'm sorry I haven't responded until now. This thread kinda got away from me! That was very good advice from both of you, and I appreciate it.

And hey, SOZO!!! I got that book!!!!! It is awesome. Exactly what I needed, and I mean EXACTLY. I needed something like that to guide me step by step. I am using it with my 2 daughters, and I think I am going to start doing it with my son, who is only 3, but he learns fast, and I think that he could catch on to this. My grandma got it for me the other day, along with the book,"What every kindergartener needs to know" which was kind of interesting, too.

[Sozo]

03-04-2003 @ 09:13 PM
La Rubia:

And hey, SOZO!!! I got that book!!!!! It is awesome. Exactly what I needed, and I mean EXACTLY. I needed something like that to guide me step by step. I am using it with my 2 daughters, and I think I am going to start doing it with my son, who is only 3, but he learns fast, and I think that he could catch on to this.

That's great. Stay with it on a daily basis, and you will be amazed how soon and how well your children will be reading!

Keep me updated! :yipee:

[ctwmn]

02-03-2003 @ 04:59 PM
La Rubia:
If anyone has any suggestions, comments, or advice, PLEASE post it here! Especially all of you experienced homeschoolers out there! I would love to hear from all of you, as I'm going into uncharted territory! LOL I would love to know what kinds of things you did with your kids at this age, what worked, what didn't, etc.

I'm new here, and I'll admit I haven't read any of the other posts, but the one thing that came to my mind was, pay attention to your daughter's signals as to whether you're going too fast or not fast enough. She'll let you know if she is capable of going at a faster pace than you are.

I have a friend who home-schools, and she said that the most important thing in home-schooling (and in raising children in general) is to get them on a schedule and keep them there. They get up at the same time every morning, eat breakfast, make their beds, and feed the dogs and cats. Each child (she has 6 now) has a job to do every morning, and they rotate responsibilities and get little stars on their charts for completing them (taken away if they don't). Around 8:00, they all start their home-study classes. I don't know when she ends them, though.

The nice thing is that if you've got a quick-learner, she won't get bored waiting for the rest of the class to catch up, risking behavioral problems (quick learners and smart children tend to act up in class because they're bored). With home-schooling, you work at your own pace, so if she's ready to move on, you don't have to wait for everybody else to catch up.

Good luck! I wish you well. I hope to home-school my kids when the time comes, too...right now, my kids are still only "thoughts".
:smile:

[ctwmn]

02-22-2003 @ 04:37 AM
DantheRM:

La Rubia,

I spend a lot of time in a Kindergarten classroom as a teacher in training. I think the thing you have to be careful to do is make sure your child gets the opportunity to be interactive and have learning opportunities with other students.

Like no other year, students in Kindergarten learn how to relate with one another in a shared learning environment. They learn to play, eat, communicate, and learn together.

darnold@toylegacies.org
http://clik.to/MSUCWG

Kindergarten (and daycare) is also a great place for a child to pick up some very bad habits and phrases from children whose parents don't care as much about raising them correctly.

But I understand what you're saying about socializing them. I think this can be accomplished in other settings, though. I learned more about socializing with other children by playing with my friends after school than I did while I was in school.

[Sozo]

Great posts ctwmn!! :thumb:

[Sher]

Couple of points: While scheduling is good, don't overschedule. Take a day to walk through a field, watch an ant hill, color the afternoon away. Relax and don't take yourself too seriously. It is very easy to burn out early if you try too hard and stress too much. Even in the higher elementary grades, science is in God's creation, math is at the grocery store, literature is at the local library reading time, etc.

There is TONS of free curriculum ideas, worksheets, etc. on the web. While a purchased curriculum gives you guidelines to cover everything, as time passes you should feel a bit more comfortable to not purchase everything. It makes for a bit more work for you, but it will lighten the load on the pocketbook.

Finally, increase your prayer life and if you are married, make time for your spouse. Like a new baby, this tends to suck focus somewhat and a good balance needs to be kept.

God's blessings on you and your family. I wish I had started in kindergarten with my son instead of yanking him from 6th grade when the bullies got out of hand and the school system wouldn't do anything. It has been the most fulfilling and best decision we could have made for our family. We love it and he is learning so much more than he would have because we can increase/decrease the pace as needed. (and ... shhhh... we've even taken hooky days off to be lazy :yipee: )

[AVmetro]

Homeschooling doesn't sound like a bad idea. In fact, it seems as if it has it's advantages in certain areas. :wink:

[John Reece]

05-01-2003 @ 10:41 PM post located here (http://www.theologyweb.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=84452#post84452)
IronMetro:

Homeschooling doesn't sound like a bad idea. In fact, it seems as if it has it's advantages in certain areas. :wink:


[b]SherBear:]/b]
(and ... shhhh... we've even taken hooky days off to be lazy )

Among the countless advantages of home-schooling, my grandchildren have had opportunities to do a lot of traveling during school terms that they could not have done if not for the fact they have been home-schooled. Traveling can be an education in itself if done with adults (their parents) who know how to optimize the experiences for them.

[DanielleJoy]

I wish I'd been home schooled... I was put into the gifted class in 2nd grade, and that was the only class I ever wanted to go to because the rest of my day was so boring... kids and teachers treated me differently, almost resentfully... and if I'd been home schooled I'd have more than this shred of confidence that I'm struggling to improve upon now.

[Socrates]

DanielleJoy:I wish I'd been home schooled... I was put into the gifted class in 2nd grade, and that was the only class I ever wanted to go to because the rest of my day was so boring... kids and teachers treated me differently, almost resentfully... and if I'd been home schooled I'd have more than this shred of confidence that I'm struggling to improve upon now. Good point. Not only does public schooling mis-socialise the kiddies into age-segregated herds, it also regresses towards the mean. Homeschooling can cater for individuals far better.

[John Reece]

Today @ 09:42 AM post located here (http://www.theologyweb.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=94024#post94024)
Socrates:

DanielleJoy:I wish I'd been home schooled... I was put into the gifted class in 2nd grade, and that was the only class I ever wanted to go to because the rest of my day was so boring... kids and teachers treated me differently, almost resentfully... and if I'd been home schooled I'd have more than this shred of confidence that I'm struggling to improve upon now. Good point. Not only does public schooling mis-socialise the kiddies into age-segregated herds, it also regresses towards the mean. Homeschooling can cater for individuals far better.

:thumb:

[Sher]

Hey Rubes? How about an update?

[Esther]

How's it going, La Rubia?

Are you homeschooling this school year? How did the rest of your school year go? This is officially the first year for my almost 5yo. He has been chomping at the bit to learn stuff, like how to read. He doesn't realize he already is learning, just not from a book yet.

Just a couple of comments on the socialization issue which you've probably already figured out for yourself.

The whole issue is overrated. How many times in your adult life outside of the classroom, have you found yourself sitting in a room full of your age-mates? I don't know about anyone else but even when I attended college classes the ages were varied. I personally prefer not to socially limit my children by forcing them to only spend vast amounts of time with other children as immature as they are. Yes, they need to know how to interact with kids but they also need to know how to interact with adults. After all, we're not raising them to be well socialized children but well rounded adults (among other things).

During our nearly 6 years of hs'ing I have learned one important thing about socialization: a person would have to live in a cave to miss all of the opportunities in the day to day life outside of an institutionalized education setting. That took a lot of pressure off me once I learned that reality. (Besides that, how many times did you hear as a kid, "You're hear to learn, not socialize"????)

Anyway, I hope things went well for you last school year and are going well this year, regardless of whether you're still hs'ing.

Sincerely,

Esther

[fundieRfunny]

05-01-2003 @ 10:41 PM post located here (http://www.theologyweb.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=84452#post84452)
IronMetro:

Homeschooling doesn't sound like a bad idea. In fact, it seems as if it has it's advantages in certain areas. :wink:


It does! Where I live, we homeschool because the school system is full of fundamentalism to a degree that is naueseating. Those who say threis a separation of church and state obviously have never been below the mason-dixon line. The day my oldest came in from school talking about noah and the ark, was the day I decided enough was enough. The biggest advantage so far is that she is about 2 grades ahead of her peers, and has more common sense than most adults I know. A very practical child.

[Esther]

Wow, that's a switch, fundie! I've never heard of someone hs'ing for that reason.

That's great that your daughter is so far ahead. Makes ya proud I bet!

[fundieRfunny]

Oh, it pleases me greatly! Among the dozens of good reasons for HS, is the ability to give curriculum at the CHILD'S pace, instead of the babysitters...um, I mean teachers.

[Esther]

LOL I know what you mean. I have one who is very slow and deliberate about everything and another who blows through just about everything I give him. The jury's still out on the third one.

[BeHereNow]

Bah! Chil'ren don't need no edurcashun! Lookie me, I dropped out at nahn yers and A'hm jes fahn! If yer yungins take a notion ta ask ye a queshun ... give'm a knuckle samich! That'll lern'em real good.

Er..

Hey, Rubia I wish every parent would homeschool their kids. Public education is not only a travesty, but a cancer. It teaches kids to do just enough to make that grade, and how to act fake and showy to be "cool" with other immature kids. The compulsive gendering and other unedifying social skills one learns in school hurt more than they help.

I've known quite a few homeschooled people, and they're always very bright and personable.

The only homeschool text name I know is A Beka books. My school used them when I was a kid, and they stress all the basics like phonics and mathematics. I think we were doing fractions by 3rd grade (whereas public schools start it around 5th or 6th).

DanielleJoy:

I wish I'd been home schooled... I was put into the gifted class in 2nd grade, and that was the only class I ever wanted to go to because the rest of my day was so boring... kids and teachers treated me differently, almost resentfully...

Ugh, I hated that. They'd make us "gifted" kids leave in the middle of class, and all the kids would stare like they were mad. What kind of stupid idea is that, anyway, to tell just some of the kids they are gifted? What, like the other kids are just idiots? pfft.. public education reeks.

:hrm:

[Esther]

BeHereNow:

Bah! Chil'ren don't need no edurcashun! Lookie me, I dropped out at nahn yers and A'hm jes fahn! If yer yungins take a notion ta ask ye a queshun ... give'm a knuckle samich! That'll lern'em real good.

And that's just the teachers. heh heh. Kidding. I know quite a few caring teachers that don't talk anything like that. wink1



Hey, Rubia I wish every parent would homeschool their kids. Public education is not only a travesty, but a cancer.

Whoa! I agree! I didn't realize you felt so strongly about public education, BHN.

It teaches kids to do just enough to make that grade, and how to act fake and showy to be "cool" with other immature kids. The compulsive gendering and other unedifying social skills one learns in school hurt more than they help.

I think the same could be said for traditional schooling in general. Except for the gendering. I honestly don't remember any of that.

I totally agree about the "other unedifying social skills". Being the object of a band of bullies' interest, I learned quite clearly that if you're different in any way at all, you might as well forget having a peaceful ride home on the bus. lol And heaven help you if your name happens to be "Esther", which rhymes with "molester". Many a rap song was composed on the way home with "Esthuh ... the chile ... moh-lestuh" as the theme. :ahem:

Yep, BHN. In school, if you're different in any way, or maybe not different but "the chosen one", you had better have thick skin or one huge ally. Although ... I had neither until about 4 years into it and somehow managed to survive. That's not the primary reason we homeschool but it's one of them. You had better believe my kids never get away with picking on someone else (except each other when I'm having a slow day). Thankfully it doesn't seem to cross their minds.

I've known quite a few homeschooled people, and they're always very bright and personable.

:thumb: Glad to hear it!

The only homeschool text name I know is A Beka books. My school used them when I was a kid, and they stress all the basics like phonics and mathematics. I think we were doing fractions by 3rd grade (whereas public schools start it around 5th or 6th).

I've heard good things about A Beka. I think my mother in-law used that when she taught in FL. She really liked it.

Ugh, I hated that. They'd make us "gifted" kids leave in the middle of class, and all the kids would stare like they were mad. What kind of stupid idea is that, anyway, to tell just some of the kids they are gifted? What, like the other kids are just idiots? pfft.. public education reeks.

See, I loved that! It was my one chance to prove that my head wasn't completely full of air. I did really well in language arts but stunk at science and math. It's strange that I was such a terrible student in science because it has always been interesting to me.

But anyway, I don't think gifted kids should go unchallenged but I think the method in general is too ridged and doesn't allow the "non-gifted" kids to excel in their strong points. School is set up to do things pretty much one way, regardless of how individual children learn best.

[Sher]

Yesterday @ 09:50 PM post located here (http://www.theologyweb.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=211862#post211862)
BeHereNow:

Ugh, I hated that. They'd make us "gifted" kids leave in the middle of class, and all the kids would stare like they were mad.

Yup ... then got back to class ... amid the nastiness of the other students, and had to "make-up" the work missed ... what was up with that?

I hate public "education" ... which is anything but


aBeka seems to be really great. I've liked what we've used so far.

[Esther]

Sher:

Yup ... then got back to class ... amid the nastiness of the other students, and had to "make-up" the work missed ... what was up with that?

That's not right.

[Sher]

Yesterday @ 08:56 AM post located here (http://www.theologyweb.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=211995#post211995)
Esther:

That's not right.

No, it wasn't. And the amazing thing was that in 20 odd years, the process pretty much hadn't changed when my son reached those grades in school.

But I agree with the levels of "gifted" that we can better address with HE. My son is more than a little gifted in math/science/logic reasoning, but writing/grammar is something he constantly struggles with.

I feel that I should add here that I was educated in the public school system, and I do know that there are some teachers who are caring, loving individuals. My feelings about the institution of public education by no means negates their worth and commitment to the children.

[Socrates]

By Isabel Lyman, author of The Homeschooling Revolution (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0967043069/ludwigvonmisesinst/)

[Posted February 25, 2003]
www.mises.org/fullstory.asp?control=1167

It was only a matter of time before Hollywood "discovered" homeschoolers.

Ponder the promo from The O'Keefes, a sitcom, which will premiere this summer on the Warner Brothers network.

"Harry and Ellie O'Keefe are loving but eccentric parents who've homeschooled their three children to protect them from the loud and libidinal world." (Translation: The parents are losers.)

"Despite a ban on all things pop culture, teenagers Danny and Lauren and younger brother Mark are growing increasingly curious about what lies beyond the walls of their school/dining room." (Translation: The children are kept under house arrest.)

"They can speak six languages, but are unable to converse with kids their own age. The answer lies in their father's worst nightmare—public school." (Translation: Kids who don't attend government schools become misfits.)

It's infuriating, but not surprising, that homeschoolers—the largest group in the so-called school choice movement—still elicit scorn. The National Education Association, for instance, regularly passes an anti-homeschooling resolution at its annual convention. The resolution states that homeschooling "cannot provide the student with a comprehensive education experience." Now it's apparently Tinseltown's turn to bash the estimated 1.5 million homeschooled children in the United States.

Even in a nation that applauds innovation and liberty, the act of homeschooling continues to raise many uncomfortable, but important, questions about government regulation of private choices. What follows are the seven most frequently asked questions about home education. Hopefully, the answers will explain the benefits of this educational endeavor and dispel common misperceptions.

Why Homeschool?

Homeschooling is simply the education of school-aged children at home rather than at a school. Why do people choose this option? In 1996, the Florida Department of Education surveyed 2,245 homeschoolers, and 31 percent of that number returned the survey. Of that group, 42 percent said that dissatisfaction with the public school environment (safety, drugs, adverse peer pressure) was their reason for launching a home-education program.

Focusing on homeschooling and the media, my own doctoral dissertation analysis of over 300 newspaper and magazine articles revealed that the top four reasons to bypass conventional schooling were dissatisfaction with the public schools, the desire to freely impart religious values, academic excellence, and the building of stronger family bonds.

What Types of Families Choose Homeschooling?

The Associated Press reported the findings of a U.S. Department of Education report about the "average" homeschooler in 2001. The AP story noted, "They are more likely than other students to live with two or more siblings in a two-parent family, with one parent working outside the home. Parents of homeschoolers are, on average, better educated than other parents—a greater percentage have college degrees—though their incomes are about the same. Like most parents, the vast majority of those who homeschool their children earn less than $50,000, and many earn less than $25,000."

Given many Americans' penchant for associations, there are national homeschooling groups for the disabled, the religious, and the athletically-minded. Johnson Obamehinti, for instance, founded the Minority Homeschoolers of Texas. His organization promotes home education among ethnic minorities, such as African-Americans, Asians, Hispanics, Jews, Native Americans, and Anglos with adopted minority children.

Homeschooling has also attracted the "high-profiled" to its ranks, such as Jason Taylor, who plays in the National Football League, and LeAnn Rimes, the country music sensation.

Are There Different Methods of Homeschooling?

Families may choose to purchase a prepackaged curriculum from companies that specifically target homeschoolers, such as A Beka Home School or Saxon Publishers. Others may choose to enroll their children in correspondence programs, like the Calvert School of Maryland, the Christian Liberty Academy Satellite Schools of Illinois, or the Clonlara School of Michigan. Cyber schools, like K-12 Inc., offer an online curriculum for homeschoolers.

As families gain confidence in their homeschooling abilities, they may opt for a less structured approach. Tutors may be sought to teach particular skills, such as a foreign language, a musical instrument, or a high-school science class. Homeschooled children also participate in field trips and learning co-ops with other homeschooled students or even take courses at a day school or local college.

How Do Homeschooled Children Interact With Others?

This question stems from a caricature of kids isolated and holed up in a house. Defining socialization is an arbitrary exercise. The burden, however, still seems to fall upon the parents of the homeschooled to make their case. To that end, one study debunked the myth that homeschoolers are undersocialized.

In 1992, Larry Shyers of the University of Florida defended a doctoral dissertation in which he challenged the notion that youngsters at home "lag" in social development. In his study, 8- to 10-year-old children were videotaped at play. Their behavior was observed by trained counselors who did not know which children attended conventional schools and which were homeschooled. The study found no significant difference between the two groups of children in self-concept or assertiveness, which was measured by social development tests. But the videotapes showed that youngsters taught at home by their parents had fewer behavior problems.

Typically, home schoolers engage in a variety of activities outside the home—athletics (homeschool sports teams are plentiful), scouting programs, church, community service, or part-time employment. Richard G. Medlin of Stetson University notes that homeschoolers rely heavily on support groups as a a means of maintaining contact with like-minded families.

Is Homeschooling Legal?

The National Homeschool Association has noted that "homeschooling is legally permitted in all fifty states, but laws and regulations are much more favorable in some states than others." For example, Oklahoma is considered friendly toward homeschooling in that parents are not required to initiate contact with state authorities to begin teaching their children at home. The Commonwealth of Massachusetts, however, is heavily regulated (approval of curriculum, submission of students' work, etc.). Seasoned veterans encourage homeschooling parents to become familiar with their state's laws before creating a homeschool.

The favorable legal climate does not mean that skirmishes don't occur. Dean Tong, author of Elusive Innocence: Survival Guide for the Falsely Accused (2002), says that a smattering of homeschoolers have had to fight false charges of child abuse.

"Based on the phone consultations I've had with (these) homeschoolers, most have been charged in Juvenile-Dependency court with neglect, failure to protect, emotional and psychological abuse, and failure to thrive," reports Tong. Relative to homeschoolers, he says that these unfounded charges are usually made by nosy neighbors who believe children should receive a more formal classroom education.

How Does the Education a Homeschooled Child Receives Compare with That of Conventionally Schooled Children?

One measure is how well they perform on standardized tests, like the Stanford Achievement Test or the Iowa Test of Basic Skills. The National Home Education Research Institute notes, "Repeatedly, across the nation, the home educated score as well as or better than those in conventional schools."

The National Merit Scholarship Corporation selected more than 70 homeschooled high school students as semifinalists in its 1998 competition. There were 137 homeschooled semifinalists chosen in 1999, and 150 in 2000.

Rebecca Sealfon, a 13-year-old homeschooler from Brooklyn, New York, won the 1997 Scripps Howard National Spelling Bee. David Beihl, also 13, of Saluda, South Carolina, won the 1999 National Geographic Bee. George Thampy, a 12-year-old homeschooler from Maryland Heights, Missouri, won the National Spelling Bee in 2000. Calvin McCarter, a 10-year-old homeschooler from near Grand Rapids, Michigan, won the 2002 National Geographic Bee and became the youngest competitor to do so.

Homeschoolers have graduated from such prestigious institutions as Yale University Law School, the United States Naval Academy, and Mount Holyoke College. Barnaby Marsh, who was homeschooled in the Alaskan wilderness, went on to graduate from Cornell University and was one of 32 Rhodes Scholars selected in 1996.

What Type of Young Adults Does Homeschooling Produce?

J. Gary Knowles of the University of Michigan studied 53 adults to see the long-term effects of being educated at home. In 1991, he presented a paper of his findings at the Annual Meeting of the American Educational Research Association in Chicago. Notes Knowles: "I have found no evidence that these adults were even moderately disadvantaged. . . . Two thirds of them were married, the norm for adults their age, and none were unemployed or any on any form of welfare assistance. More than three quarters felt that being taught at home had actually helped them to interact with people from different levels of society

Small business owner Tim Martin, 29, and his wife, Amy, 28, live in Whitehall, Montana with their four children. Both the Martins have a homeschooling background and are now teaching their brood at home. "Education just works better one-on-one," says Tim. "Why do we think the 'right' way to do education is to put 20 or 30 children in a classroom with one teacher. That model is more fit for manufacturing than education."

No kidding. By using their liberties wisely, homeschooling parents have graduated scores upon scores of literate, well-adjusted students with minimal government interference and at a fraction of the cost of any government program. Now a second generation is following in those footsteps. It's the kind of story worthy of thoughtful documentary, not a silly sitcom.

[Warcraft3]

I was homeschooled for the majority of my grade levels. My junior and senior year I attended a private school. I am very thankful that my parents decided to homeschool us (me and my two sisters). We usually did better than the public school kids on tests....especially in reading/writing and math. We also would usually score higher in science as well.

My parents went through great sacrifice (especially my very ill Mother) to homeschool us and we all turned out fine.

So I am definately a supporter of homeschooling.



Russ

[India]

I was educated in the sort of school system all the homeschoolers are trying to avoid: your classic inner-city public school. I was always in special programs, though. Through 3rd grade I was in Montessori, and that has a lot of the same advantages that have been listed for homeschooling. Kids work at their own pace, and are free to choose what they work on for that day. The classes combine grade levels (e.g. 1st and 2nd might be in the same classroom, or 2nd, 3rd and 4th).

Then in 4th grade my parents took me out of Montessori and put me in an "academically talented" program. I felt like I'd been put in a cage because I couldn't do my own thing or work ahead anymore. I was doing 6th grade math in 3rd grade, and then had to keep doing 6th grade math until I got to 7th grade, all because the teachers didn't want me to be bored.

Even though I was always in "gifted" programs or magnet programs I was still "the smart one" and dealt with the accompanying teasing, resentment and pressure ("Why did you get a B? Is there something wrong?").

For the most part, though, I had good, dedicated teachers. The state of the public school system isn't primarily the fault of the teachers; it's the fault of the parents. It doesn't matter how good a teacher you are if you have students who don't care about learning or following rules and whose parents don't care about their education or character.

I don't think I would homeschool though, because I don't think I'd necessarily be the best teacher for my kids. I would like to put them in Montessori, though. That was probably the best educational experience I had.

[Esther]

"Despite a ban on all things pop culture, teenagers Danny and Lauren and younger brother Mark are growing increasingly curious about what lies beyond the walls of their school/dining room." (Translation: The children are kept under house arrest.)

My kids would certainly get a good laugh out of this one. There have been days when I think they would've prayed for house arrest because we've been away from our "school/dining room" for so long.

It's always interesting to me that people paint hs'ers that way because it's not based in reality at all. I can remember thinking that way when one of my friends was homeschooled for a year in high school. I wondered how she could possibly have a social life. (As if that's the most important thing on earth!) Now I know - and it was probably a very peaceful and productive school year for her! :lol:

steadele:

My parents went through great sacrifice (especially my very ill Mother) to homeschool us and we all turned out fine.

Russ

I applaud your Mother. I have a difficult struggle doing it with good health!

India:

Then in 4th grade my parents took me out of Montessori and put me in an "academically talented" program. I felt like I'd been put in a cage because I couldn't do my own thing or work ahead anymore. I was doing 6th grade math in 3rd grade, and then had to keep doing 6th grade math until I got to 7th grade, all because the teachers didn't want me to be bored.

All because they didn't want you to be bored, huh?

For the most part, though, I had good, dedicated teachers. The state of the public school system isn't primarily the fault of the teachers; it's the fault of the parents. It doesn't matter how good a teacher you are if you have students who don't care about learning or following rules and whose parents don't care about their education or character.

It's a combination of things, really. You're right that it's much harder if the students and their parents are impossible. I was just reading an article the other day about how big of an impact a parent's involvement has on the education success of their children.

Parents shouldn't have to be told that. But then I suppose after being told so often in so many words that they don't know what's good for their own children - at least in our district until recently, many have just assumed the schools want that responsibility.