Who changed the Battle Hymn?

[wfaber]

I remember when that last verse read, "As He died to make men holy let us die to make men free". It was changed to read, "As He died to make men holy let us live to make men free."

That's bad enough. But yesterday in church they eliminated the second verse and added an entire new verse that I never heard of before.

To me, some songs are sacred and should never be changed. And I think this is one of them.

Just a rant.

[Cynic Sage]

I remember when that last verse read, "As He died to make men holy let us die to make men free". It was changed to read, "As He died to make men holy let us live to make men free."

That's bad enough. But yesterday in church they eliminated the second verse and added an entire new verse that I never heard of before.

To me, some songs are sacred and should never be changed. And I think this is one of them.

Just a rant.

I agree, It's a pet peeve when somebody messes with a song I like. :sad:

[Pilgrim]

Here's a little history of the hymn with all the verses. It does note the original wording as you have mentioned...

http://www.cyberhymnal.org/htm/b/h/bhymnotr.htm

[wfaber]

I never realized there were six verses. Verses 3 and 6 are new to me. But what I heard yesterday morning was definitely something different.

[Piebald]

It is an awesome hymn. I can listen to it all day. It also represents one of (if not the) greatest achievement of the Church as far as social issues goes.

[Dee Dee Warren]

That is absolutely my favourite hymn and I cannot believe that premill futurist dispie churches sing it. This song embodies postmillennialism.


Also I do not like when words are changed - but in this one cause, I think that the change makes the song more self- and theologically - coherent.


I always have to ask my futurists friends, "wow what a mad woman - she said that her eyes SAW the GLORY OF THE COMING of the Lord"

Amazing.

[Pilgrim]

really, this is your favorite hymn?

[Piebald]

I don't see what is theologically incorrect about the original version. "Dying to make men free" is in reference to dying in the war to help free the slaves, isn't it?

[Dee Dee Warren]

yes really - my husband hates it, and I love it, I sing it frequently - perhaps because it was important to me when I was changing my views and opened my eyes to some wonderful truths

This excludes holiday hymns in which I have two favourites, What Child is This, and Oh Holy Night (not the cheesy one, the good one)

[Dee Dee Warren]

I don't see what is theologically incorrect about the original version. "Dying to make men free" is in reference to dying in the war to help free the slaves, isn't it?

Yes of course - but to take the song and apply it to other situations we are to live the great commission - I don't know if that is why it is changed but that is how it makes it more coherent for today.\

[Dee Dee Warren]

I have a few close runner's up and the name of one if eluding me,, but another is (and forgive me if this is recent, it was my understanding that this is an old hymn)

All Hail the Power of Jesus' Name

(another one that is completely at odds with modern dispiesm)

[mossrose]

Dee Dee, would you please explain why you are surprised that those 2 songs are often sung by "premill futurist dispies"?

Becaue I am one, and I sing them all the time, looking forward to the coming kingdom.

And perhaps you could give a critique of my enjoyment of "Joy to the World", also, as it looks forward to the coming kingdom as well.

[Dee Dee Warren]

Neither of those songs Moss are talking about a coming Kingdom (in the premill sense) - they are declaring the present Kingdom. And yes I would have the same criticism with Joy to the World. Most songs which predate Darby have a much different theological focus.

Let's take one stanza:


Mine eyes have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord;
He is trampling out the vintage where the grapes of wrath are stored;
He hath loosed the fateful lightning of His terrible swift sword;
His truth is marching on.
Glory! Glory! Hallelujah! Glory! Glory! Hallelujah!
Glory! Glory! Hallelujah! His truth is marching on.

A lot of things could be said. First, in battle in which evil was being defeated (slavery - though some would say a far greater evil won in the form of a centralized fed govnt) the author could say that she was seeing the glory of the coming of the Lord.

How was the Lord "coming"? How did she "see" it? Where did she see the Lord's "glory"?

There are a few more points but we can take this slowly. There are songs I will not sing now as a preterist, I now use that time to pray.

[Xavier]

And that was DDW's 21,000st post... Surprise, it's on eschatology... :hehe:

[Dee Dee Warren]

In fact, oddly enough, the song has been a watershed for me as it spurred me on to my current synthesis of the "coming of the Lord" - so not only am I a preterist, but I am a minority within a minority.

[mossrose]

So, you are saying that lyrics like this:



He rules the world with truth and grace,
And makes the nations prove
The glories of His righteousness
And wonders of His love,
And wonders of His love,
And wonders, wonders of His love.


No more let sin and sorrow grow,
Nor thorns, infest the ground.
He comes to make His blessings flow
Far as the curse is found,
Far as the curse is found,
Far as, far as the curse is found.


are not referring to the coming Kingdom, but are indicitive of past events?

Because, I sure don't see Him ruling the world with truth and grace yet, and the nations sure aren't proving the glories of His righteousness, and I sure don't see that sin and sorrow and thorns aren't around yet. There are a lot of weeds in my back yard still, and I still have to go and get rid of them.

I guess I just don't understand pretie thinking......

[Dee Dee Warren]

We can get to Joy to the World in a bit - I would like to discuss the first chunk of the Battle Hymn I presented (and by the way what I will be arguing is not preterist belief at all - it is the historic view of the church prior to Darby, thus these types of hymns were written).

Today we have (and I know this is not a hymn) - People get ready, Jesus is coming, soon we'll be going home

and I Wish We'd All Been Ready

[rmwilliamsjr]

We sang it Sunday in a PCA church, i could hear Dabney and Thornwell (plus Jackson and Lee) rolling over in their graves. I whispered to my wife (who is from Maine) that despite the fact that it is pretty and blood warming, it is still a d..n Yankee song that Sherman's men sang as they pillaged, raped and plundered their way to Atlanta.

still got tears in my eyes but it was for the UnCivil War dead.