I've also seen Christians go to the opposite extreme and claim that we sin continuously, but I don't think either of them have it right. Christians are set free from our sin nature, not in the sense that we no longer have it, but in the sense that it is no longer our master. We are set free from one master to come under a new master in service to God to live in obedience to His commands. I understand statements, such as 1 John 3:6, about Christians not sinning to be talking about intentional sin. If we love God, we are in Christ, and Christ is in us, then how can we willfully choose to transgress His law? If we realize that doing in sinful, then we should become convicted and refrain from doing it. To know that something is sinful and to do it anyway is an act of rebellion against God. How can we say we know God if we live in rebellion to Him?
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This forum is open discussion between atheists and all theists to defend and debate their views on religion or non-religion. Please respect that this is a Christian-owned forum and refrain from gratuitous blasphemy. VERY wide leeway is given in range of expression and allowable behavior as compared to other areas of the forum, and moderation is not overly involved unless necessary. Please keep this in mind. Atheists who wish to interact with theists in a way that does not seek to undermine theistic faith may participate in the World Religions Department. Non-debate question and answers and mild and less confrontational discussions can take place in General Theistics.
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Christians Don't Sin
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A recent thread asking how long you can go without sinning:
http://www.reasonablefaith.org/forum...6029663.0.html"Faith is nothing less than the will to keep one's mind fixed precisely on what reason has discovered to it." - Edward Feser
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When I was in college, there was a fairly notorious itinerant preacher named "Brother Jed" who would come by a few times a year. He claimed that he had not sinned since 1969. However, I could see clear evidence to the contrary with his false judgments of people. One example was how he once yelled at a male and female walking to class together, accusing them of fornication... when they were actually a brother and sister."I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill
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Originally posted by KingsGambit View PostWhen I was in college, there was a fairly notorious itinerant preacher named "Brother Jed" who would come by a few times a year. He claimed that he had not sinned since 1969. However, I could see clear evidence to the contrary with his false judgments of people. One example was how he once yelled at a male and female walking to class together, accusing them of fornication... when they were actually a brother and sister.If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!
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Originally posted by whag View PostThis is a very murky issue. As you know, some Christians sin frequently and are stubborn to admit it (Thomas Kinkaide is an example that comes to mind, but there are many others), while some non-believers don't have anything approximating a "pattern of ongoing sin" because they're naturally kind and considerate people. When the latter group sins (for example, loses one's temper, cheats on spouse, etc), they feel remorse and fess up. There are many examples of these kinds of people.
There's so much overlap between these groups as to create no clear distinction between "Christians who sin" and "nonbelievers who are sinners." Generally speaking, we all "sin" the same amount, and Christians aren't any better at feeling remorse and apologizing to those they have hurt."Faith is nothing less than the will to keep one's mind fixed precisely on what reason has discovered to it." - Edward Feser
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Originally posted by Christianbookworm View PostReading the thread. How can you sin while dreaming??? You aren't responsible for anything that happens in them.
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Originally posted by Cerebrum123 View PostActually, I've been able to control a few dreams once in them. Although, I can't think of any time that I did anything other than say fly around, or similar.If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!
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Originally posted by Soyeong View PostI've also seen Christians go to the opposite extreme and claim that we sin continuously, but I don't think either of them have it right. Christians are set free from our sin nature, not in the sense that we no longer have it, but in the sense that it is no longer our master. We are set free from one master to come under a new master in service to God to live in obedience to His commands. I understand statements, such as 1 John 3:6, about Christians not sinning to be talking about intentional sin.
Originally posted by Soyeong View PostIf we love God, we are in Christ, and Christ is in us, then how can we willfully choose to transgress His law? If we realize that doing in sinful, then we should become convicted and refrain from doing it. To know that something is sinful and to do it anyway is an act of rebellion against God. How can we say we know God if we live in rebellion to Him?
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Originally posted by Soyeong View PostI have no idea what what being naturally kind an considerate people as to do with no having a pattern of ongoing sin.
I have no idea what you mean by willful rebellion vs. unintentional rebellion. Let's start there and weave discussion of our treatment of one another into the discussion from there.
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Originally posted by Christianbookworm View PostYeah, how does continuous sinning make sense? That you could always be doing something even better than what you are doing right now???Middle-of-the-road swing voter. Feel free to sway my opinion.
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Please give an example of "unintentional" sin.
This doesn't really clarify anything. What constitutes willful rebellion vs. unintentional rebellion? *scratches head*"Faith is nothing less than the will to keep one's mind fixed precisely on what reason has discovered to it." - Edward Feser
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Originally posted by Soyeong View PostBasically doing something without consciously being aware that what you were doing was in violation of God's law. This can range from simply being ignorant of all of God's laws, to having a conversation with someone and realizing afterward that it had crossed the line into gossip, to not realizing that pepperoni pizza that you ate contains pork.
Originally posted by Soyeong View PostIf we love God, we are in Christ, and Christ is in us, then how can we willfully choose to transgress His law? If we realize that doing in sinful, then we should become convicted and refrain from doing it. To know that something is sinful and to do it anyway is an act of rebellion against God. How can we say we know God if we live in rebellion to Him?
Originally posted by Soyeong View PostIf you know that something is wrong and you do it anyway, that is a different sort of action than doing something wrong without realizing it.Last edited by whag; 03-28-2015, 06:09 PM.
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Originally posted by Soyeong View PostBasically doing something without consciously being aware that what you were doing was in violation of God's law. This can range from simply being ignorant of all of God's laws, to having a conversation with someone and realizing afterward that it had crossed the line into gossip, to not realizing that pepperoni pizza that you ate contains pork.
If you know that something is wrong and you do it anyway, that is a different sort of action than doing something wrong without realizing it.If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!
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