I was wondering what the manuscript evidence for καθ᾿ ἡμέραν in Luke 9:23 .
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This is not the section for debates between theists and atheists. While a theistic viewpoint is not required for discussion in this area, discussion does presuppose a respect for the integrity of the Biblical text (or the willingness to accept such a presupposition for discussion purposes) and a respect for the integrity of the faith of others and a lack of an agenda to undermine the faith of others.
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Luke 9:23
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Originally posted by Omniskeptical View PostI was wondering what the manuscript evidence for καθ᾿ ἡμέραν in Luke 9:23 .
The manuscript evidence for omitting καθ᾿ ἡμέραν is comparatively so weak that it is not even noted as a variant reading in textual commentaries such as those by Metzger and Comfort.
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Originally posted by John Reece View Post
According to the critical apparatus in Nestle-Aland 28th edition, the manuscript evidence for καθ᾿ ἡμέραν in Luke 9:23 is P75 א[+ symbol for original hand *.2b which Hebrew font will not allow me to display adjacent to upper right corner of א where it belongs] A B K L W Θ Ξ Ψ f1.13 33. 700. 892. 2542 aur f vg syc.p.h** samss bo.
The manuscript evidence for omitting καθ᾿ ἡμέραν is comparatively so weak that it is not even noted as a variant reading in textual commentaries such as those by Metzger and Comfort.Last edited by Omniskeptical; 04-11-2015, 03:01 PM.
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Originally posted by Omniskeptical View PostAccording to Von Soden, Hodges-Farstad, Robison-Pierpont, and the Complutensian Polyglot, the words didn't exist.
Textus Receptus: Luke 9:23 ἔλεγε δὲ πρὸς πάντας, Εἴ τις θέλει ὀπίσω μου ἐλθεῖν, ἀπαρνησάσθω ἑαυτόν, καὶ ἀράτω τὸν σταυρὸν αὐτοῦ καθ᾿ ἡμέρανκαθ᾿ ἡμέραν, καὶ ἀκολουθείτω μοι.
Westcott & Hort: Luke 9:23 Ἔλεγεν δὲ πρὸς πάντας Εἴ τις θέλει ὀπίσω μου ἔρχεσθαι, ἀρνησάσθω ἑαυτὸν καὶ ἀράτω τὸν σταυρὸν αὐτοῦ καθ᾿ ἡμέραν, καὶ ἀκολουθείτω μοι.Last edited by John Reece; 04-11-2015, 04:03 PM.
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Wilbur N Pickering, The Greek New Testament According to Family 35, page 134, note 18:18αυτου f35C(D) [87%] CP,HF,RP || 1 καθ' ημεραν P75A,B,W [13%] TR,OC,NU
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Originally posted by Omniskeptical;184309 emphasis addedAccording to Von Soden, Hodges-Farstad, Robison-Pierpont, and the Complutensian Polyglot, the words didn't exist.
Originally posted by Omniskeptical View PostWilbur N Pickering, The Greek New Testament According to Family 35, page 134, note 18:
18αυτου f35C(D) [87%] CP,HF,RP || 1 καθ' ημεραν P75A,B,W [13%] TR,OC,NU
f35 means Von Soden's collation. CP means Complutensian Polyglot. HF means Hodges and Farstad. RP means Robinson-Pierpont. It is a Catholic, Masochistic interpolation. It is easier to prove this one came from the vulgate.
As for your comment that "It is easier to prove this one came from the vulgate", I would note that the Latin Vulgate is just one of nearly two dozen witnesses to the existence of the words καθ᾿ ἡμέραν, the primary and most important witnesses being Greek manuscripts.
Consider again the witnesses listed in the critical apparatus in Nestle-Aland 28th edition, wherein the manuscript evidence for reading καθ᾿ ἡμέραν in Luke 9:23 is as follows:P75 א[+ symbol for original hand *.2b which Hebrew font will not allow me to display adjacent to upper right corner of א where it belongs] A B K L W Θ Ξ Ψ f1.13 33. 700. 892. 2542 aur f vg [(= Vulgata) represents agreement of the most important editions of the Vulgate in support of the same Greek reading.] syc.p.h** samss bo.
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Originally posted by John Reece View PostWhere does it say "the words didn't exist"?
Why isn't in the majority of manuscripts?
According to Pickering, Von Soden says 87% of his manuscripts or facsimiles had it.Last edited by Omniskeptical; 04-12-2015, 08:44 AM.
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Originally posted by Omniskeptical View Post18 αυτου f35C(D) [87%] CP,HF,RP
Why isn't in the majority of manuscripts?
According to Pickering, Von Soden says 87% of his manuscripts or facsimiles had it.
You ignore my question; I ignore your question.
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Originally posted by John Reece View PostYou have changed the subject rather than responding to my question.
You ignore my question; I ignore your question.
No I didn't change the subject. You pretended to refute my answer, then I demonstrated that you were wrong by showing an accurate apparatus. I even told you it was Von Soden, but you didn't get any more specific in your response. You were specific on how specific I needed to be.
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Originally posted by Omniskeptical View PostOnly if you don't understand the picture. Seriously, does it work?
"Invalid Attachment specified. If you followed a valid link, please notify the administrator."
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Originally posted by John Reece View PostSeriously, no: When I wrote "Invalid" I was copying the message I received when I clicked on the link:
"Invalid Attachment specified. If you followed a valid link, please notify the administrator."Last edited by Omniskeptical; 04-12-2015, 12:51 PM.
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