Shrike Team #3: Roots of Contention [Archive]

jpholding

June 5th 2006, 12:57 PM

Here we go....

http://www.tektoonics.com/intro/shriketoon3/shriketoon3001.html

A few preliminary comments...

1) Per my Alum campaign promises, a lot of you will see your names used in here. I didn't get them ALL in but thanks to having a number of extras, a lot of them did get in. We'll get more in, next time in RP #4.

2) No more baubles to look for. The two storylines (RP/ST) are slowly merging together, so instead of baubles, you'll find three quite direct RP connections in this story. The trend will continue in RP #4.

No one guessed the baubles last time, from RP #3 referring back to ST #2 (since Darth took a vacation from that :teeth:), so here's what they were:

a) Visual/verbal bauble between Brom's "yuk" glance into the crater Von Lucre crashed and burned into, and Beamer's "yuk" glance into the crushed robot
2) Visual bauble: check the restaurant table the Ketterlings eat at, and the table in the commissary Brom and Melinda eat in. Someone must like that sauce that blue bottle has in it!

There's some other stuff up too: Ted Bell's Atheist Survivor piece http://www.tektoonics.com/parody/survivor04.html , May Screwballs http://www.tektoonics.com/parody/may06scr.html , a formalized setup of the Flemming material, and a few concept piece, including one at http://www.tektoonics.com/etc/clawart.html featuring a new Hearthstonian polar species, the Mangravarian.

Enjoy!

Sparko

June 5th 2006, 02:26 PM

:woohoo:

I am famous! http://www.tektoonics.com/intro/shriketoon3/shriketoon3055.html

jpholding

June 5th 2006, 02:29 PM

:woohoo:

I am famous! http://www.tektoonics.com/intro/shriketoon3/shriketoon3055.html

Not only that, you get that drawing of Noah and his animals as a pirate crew to enjoy. :hehe:

{Tim}

June 6th 2006, 01:51 AM

www.tektoonics.com/intro/shriketoon3/shriketoon3006.html

"I... I just realised.. I'm teamed up with a Sanslorian and a Tilkrig...

... why do I have this crazy idea that I should arm myself with a boomerang?"

:lmbo: :rofl: :lol: :rofl:

Oh and www.tektoonics.com/intro/shriketoon3/shriketoon3030.html
:hehe:

Was that deliberate, or did you pick it afterwards?

jpholding

June 6th 2006, 08:28 AM

Was that deliberate, or did you pick it afterwards?

Picked it afterwards. :teeth: It was one of those coincidental insights I had after the fact. This page, by the way, is also a tribute to a recurring Tex Avery gag, which some of the younger folks here may not realize.

I'm interested in any reactions to the "revelations" at

http://www.tektoonics.com/intro/shriketoon3/shriketoon3020.html

and

http://www.tektoonics.com/intro/shriketoon3/shriketoon3079.html

Back a few I asked for a volunteer to give a test reaction to the first one, it may be recalled, and Darth stepped to the plate and gave me what I was looking for. Any thoughts?

May as well also give the customary commentary since there's not much to say. This was, as I once said, the first original Brom Shriker story in 20+ years. Only the elements of Felicity's possession by Gen'a'too and Brom's work as an intelligence agent remain from the older incarnation. The whole setup with the trees is entirely new and rooted in the unique environment of the Canopy. Couldn't do this story in Nullabor!

I did make a huge change in the plot about halfway through. Originally the story called for Gen'a'too to get Brom's attention by felling trees all over the city, thus drawing him out. The city would be evacuated except for a few law enforcement sorts, etc. but I figured this to be too cumbersome and merely reduced it to the present scenario. The only price paid was that I have now established the geography of Monitaw definitively such that one gets from the maglev terminal, past Brom's old house and to the police station. But somehow I don't think that'll come back to haunt me. :teeth:

I'll be redoing about 10 pages from RP #1 for about a week, then get to work on RP #4.

{Tim}

June 7th 2006, 02:55 AM

Hey, you could have had them making "a slight detour" if you didn't want it to be on the way. :tongue: But you're right... I doubt it will jump out and bite you later.

When I saw the "revelations"... the first one was like, "oho! The plot thickens... :hehe:" But then I thought it's not really that unbelieveable, when you think about it. :shrug: Just unexpected.

The second one... I was, ":hrm:" It looks a bit like Sheila's 'rang, but I can't see any clear connection as yet.

jpholding

June 7th 2006, 06:51 AM

the first one was like, "oho! The plot thickens... :hehe:" But then I thought it's not really that unbelieveable, when you think about it. :shrug:

How so? :smile:

The second one... I was, ":hrm:" It looks a bit like Sheila's 'rang, but I can't see any clear connection as yet.

Not in the second symbol on the bottom?

Spheniscine

June 7th 2006, 10:13 AM

A few questions:
1. Gen'a'too is correct in that he does not have the strength to meet Brom in a pitched battle. But why doesn't he just launch a hypersonic ambush instead? He could rush out, drill right through Brom, and put half the continent between them before anyone else so much as blinks. I guess he just isn't very bright.

2. Why does Lady Abigail look so much like Annabelle?

3. Why doesn't Detective Tyra notice that Felicity's eyes are glowing red?

jpholding

June 7th 2006, 10:42 AM

1. Gen'a'too is correct in that he does not have the strength to meet Brom in a pitched battle. But why doesn't he just launch a hypersonic ambush instead? He could rush out, drill right through Brom, and put half the continent between them before anyone else so much as blinks. I guess he just isn't very bright.

You're right, he isn't. :hehe: The K'rek'skran have gotten lazy and stupid, as arrogant sorts often do. M'l'strom is going to give him some instructions for battle that we'll see worked out in ST #4. That said, the ambush idea wouldn't necessarily work either, but I won't be explaining why until the ST/RP crossover.

2. Why does Lady Abigail look so much like Annabelle?

You'll find the answer to that in the crossover story too. :wink: But I welcome any speculations.

3. Why doesn't Detective Tyra notice that Felicity's eyes are glowing red?

She's my portrait of a materialist who often misses the clear evidence in front of them in their drive to pursue a goal. Hence she doesn't care how Brom or Felicity got their powers; all she cares about is results and the bottom line.

Keep your eye on her. She's bad news.

jpholding

June 7th 2006, 11:42 AM

Sphen, one other thing. Wouldn't such a hypersonic ambush also destroy Felicity's body? I'm not a physicist, but....

Sir-Think-A-Lot

June 7th 2006, 01:21 PM

Spheniscine

June 7th 2006, 10:10 PM

Yeah, I would guess so. The impact would probably drive the axes into her as well. Well, she could run around him and dice him like she did the tree. (I'm coming across as a sadist here, aren't I?)

{Tim}

June 8th 2006, 12:53 AM

How so? :smile:Well, it looks like Eidolon. Since he's millions of years old (:ahem:), it's not actually that surprising if he's at some point been famous for something in the past. :shrug: I actually have a vague feeling I've read that idea somewhere before in a novel, but I have no idea where (if I even did)...

Not in the second symbol on the bottom?No. I couldn't make head or tail of that one. If it's something we've seen before, I've obviously forgotten it. :doh:

Edit: I was right, I had forgetten. That's very interesting...
... if I hadn't read your posts on TWeb that suggest otherwise, I would have started to wonder if Sheila had ended up going back in time and becoming the villainess... :hehe:

{Tim}

June 8th 2006, 12:54 AM

Yeah, I would guess so. The impact would probably drive the axes into her as well. Well, she could run around him and dice him like she did the tree. (I'm coming across as a sadist here, aren't I?)
It would probably have much the same effect as her attempt to beat him up, I imagine. :ahem:

jpholding

June 8th 2006, 06:47 AM

So is Lady Abigale supposed to be Annabelle's ancestor or something? I know inter-species marriages dont normaly produce children but maybe....

Or maybe Annabelle is a clone of her? Do they have cloneing technology in Hearthstone?

And what's up with the Boomerrang shaped notch in the portal at the end?

I have a feeling that both Shelia and Annabelle(and probably the rest of the Range Patrol) are gonna have their own part to play in the STs storyline.

They are. I'm going to leave the Lady Abigail issue in the air for now (until the crossover issue, ST #5/RP #6). On the microlith though...

Not in the second symbol on the bottom?
No. I couldn't make head or tail of that one. If it's something we've seen before, I've obviously forgotten it.

I'm guessing from your edit that you found it...

http://www.tektoonics.com/intro/rangtoon3/rangtoon3069.html

While I'll leave the "why" of the microlith in the air also (until at least after the Claw of Vengeance series) this was a test of sorts to see how readily the connection was made. It apparently can take some searching, but the question is, does it matter when reading the story? I'm considering adding some commentary at the end of each story (like I do here) which would include reminders such as, "If that symbol looked familiar...." Those that want to can read it; those that don't want to....

Seem like a good idea? As complex as I'm winding this thing together, I just wonder.

Sir-Think-A-Lot

June 8th 2006, 11:27 PM

They are. I'm going to leave the Lady Abigail issue in the air for now (until the crossover issue, ST #5/RP #6). On the microlith though...

Sweet. I kinda like the characters in RP(especially Shelia and Beamer) more than the St.

While I'll leave the "why" of the microlith in the air also (until at least after the Claw of Vengeance series) this was a test of sorts to see how readily the connection was made. It apparently can take some searching, but the question is, does it matter when reading the story? I'm considering adding some commentary at the end of each story (like I do here) which would include reminders such as, "If that symbol looked familiar...." Those that want to can read it; those that don't want to....

Seem like a good idea? As complex as I'm winding this thing together, I just wonder.

Doesnt sound like a bad idea. I think most of the readers of your comics are pretty dedicated, its easy to miss stuff if you havent read any of hte comics in a while(like the position I was in when ST3 came out)

jpholding

June 9th 2006, 12:47 PM

Sweet. I kinda like the characters in RP(especially Shelia and Beamer) more than the St.

This is funny, because I know someone who's the opposite. They only cared for ST and I said, "You need to read RP too, because otherwise it won't all make sense!" :hehe:

Doesnt sound like a bad idea. I think most of the readers of your comics are pretty dedicated, its easy to miss stuff if you havent read any of hte comics in a while(like the position I was in when ST3 came out)

Readers now are in an unusual position because as they material grows, there won't be a long wait between issues. Imagine if you found it all NOW and was able to read all 6 stories in one sitting (as happens with dedicated webcomic readers). Now picture that when the Cartel cycle is wrapped up by the middle of 2008 at the latest. Things like the Rangslinger family symbol will still be fresh in the mind.

So far no one seems to object to explanation pages at the end. There is precedent for this sort of thing in comics, too, usually disgused as a "letter" from the editor.

jpholding

June 9th 2006, 04:33 PM

OK, how about this as an example...

http://www.tektoonics.com/intro/rangtoon1/rangtooninsider1.html

Sir-Think-A-Lot

June 9th 2006, 04:40 PM

This is funny, because I know someone who's the opposite. They only cared for ST and I said, "You need to read RP too, because otherwise it won't all make sense!" :hehe:

I'v actually read(and enjoyed) both. I just happen to enjoy RP a little more.

Sparko

June 9th 2006, 04:56 PM

one thing I would like JP is to have more on a page. I hate having to flip through 100 pages of two panels each (or so it seems)

Leonhard

June 9th 2006, 05:37 PM

OK, how about this as an example...

http://www.tektoonics.com/intro/rangtoon1/rangtooninsider1.html

That looks about right, however thou hast made an erur in thine hypertext, the last link button "Back" is broken, it's adress is "http://www.tektoonics.com/intro/rangtoon1/hearthstone.html" which gave me 404 error!

Shouldn't it be "http://www.tektoonics.com/intro/hearthstone.html" or "http://www.tektoonics.com/intro/rangtoon1/rangtoon1-1.html"

{Tim}

June 10th 2006, 06:41 AM

They are. I'm going to leave the Lady Abigail issue in the air for now (until the crossover issue, ST #5/RP #6). On the microlith though...

I'm guessing from your edit that you found it...

http://www.tektoonics.com/intro/rangtoon3/rangtoon3069.html

While I'll leave the "why" of the microlith in the air also (until at least after the Claw of Vengeance series) this was a test of sorts to see how readily the connection was made. It apparently can take some searching, but the question is, does it matter when reading the story? I'm considering adding some commentary at the end of each story (like I do here) which would include reminders such as, "If that symbol looked familiar...." Those that want to can read it; those that don't want to....

Seem like a good idea? As complex as I'm winding this thing together, I just wonder.
Yeah. And just now I read Eidolon's extended version of the history, which I'd somehow missed before. Interesting... so I'd say Sheila is descended from the chick who blew up the teleportation machine originally... though it's possible she's only a descendant "in spirit" rather than reality :wink: Probably the symbol on the stone is something to do with her, then.

I like the sample of the explanation page at the end. It's interesting to read, and gives more insight into the story... whether you want to put references to things like the symbol there, depends whether you want readers to be sure to pick up on it or not. :shrug: There's a fair chance I might have recognised it if I'd just read the other comics beforehand... and then again, they'll probably figure it out sooner or later; if it's important to the story, it'll come up again, and maybe with more explanation. Or, again, it could be one of those things they spot the second (or third!) time through, just those "oh, I just realised I never noticed that before!" things. :shrug:

Little Shepherd

June 10th 2006, 07:04 AM

I got done reading, and it was pretty cool. I assume the old portal symbol is a hint that something very important will happen in a future issue involving Sheila.

Oh, and one point, Brom mentioned a legend of a Prycene with a Tilkrig on his shoulder being important. It's been a while since I read all the RP issues, but didn't Sheila have a similar legend, only with an Elapine rather than a Prycene? It sounded really familiar anyway.

And I can't wait for Miss Hornacek to surrender to M'kai. I assume that's what's going to happen eventually because knocking the seed from her stomach again . . . sure, it seems effective at dispelling Gen-a-too, but wouldn't that also get rid of her superpowers?

This is from an older issue, but am I the only one who thinks it's so obvious that Shriker and Hornacek are becoming all googly-eyed over each other(even though Eidolon said their friendship was destined, but not necessarily romantic . . . )? I remember some of your notes, and I can't help but think that it's just really good timing for them. I mean, you did say there would be some event in Hearthstone's future that would take care of that little problem of mixed marriages not producing children.

I might not pipe up very often, but I do read your notes and stuff, and am looking forward to how the story develops.

{Tim}

June 10th 2006, 07:31 AM

This is from an older issue, but am I the only one who thinks it's so obvious that Shriker and Hornacek are becoming all googly-eyed over each other(even though Eidolon said their friendship was destined, but not necessarily romantic . . . )? I remember some of your notes, and I can't help but think that it's just really good timing for them. I mean, you did say there would be some event in Hearthstone's future that would take care of that little problem of mixed marriages not producing children.It looks a little like that to me, too, but that doesn't mean it will work out that way. :shrug:

I don't remember Sheila saying anything about a Tilkrig on the shoulder, but it would probably trace back to the same thing anyway, if you look at the history page on tektoonics...

Little Shepherd

June 10th 2006, 08:33 AM

It looks a little like that to me, too, but that doesn't mean it will work out that way. :shrug:
Yeah, I was thinking about it. And in my weird head, I got the idea that maybe Sheila and Brom are supposed to end up together. And y'know how Jesus was born of a virgin -- something impossible here? Well, mixed-breed kids are impossible there, so maybe they're supposed to be the parents of the impossible prophecy child of the world of Hearthstone. Or maybe my imagination's just a little overactive. :tongue:
I don't remember Sheila saying anything about a Tilkrig on the shoulder, but it would probably trace back to the same thing anyway, if you look at the history page on tektoonics...
Y'know, if Brom and Sheila have a kid, it could technically fulfill both prophecies. Assuming I remembered that right(I probably didn't, but whatever). I really should read the RP comics again.

jpholding

June 10th 2006, 12:27 PM

one thing I would like JP is to have more on a page. I hate having to flip through 100 pages of two panels each (or so it seems)

I'll bet if I *do* do that, some people will say I'm naking the stories shorter... :glare: But let's be realistic here...the largest is now 90 (RP #1) but most of them have been between 69-80. How many pages are acceptable? 50? 40?

Leonhard, thanks for that note. I think I'll also hyperlink the page numbers.

I'll be back later to comment on the rest.

jpholding

June 10th 2006, 01:09 PM

Lunch was good! Beef fried rice. :yummy:

The speculation is quite enthralling. Some of it is even right. Some. :wink:

I like the sample of the explanation page at the end. It's interesting to read, and gives more insight into the story... whether you want to put references to things like the symbol there, depends whether you want readers to be sure to pick up on it or not.

I absolutely do. A broad survey suggests that people are getting the rang part of the symbol right but missing the Rangslinger family symbol -- but even if they do miss it, they just figure it'll be explained later.

The Hearthstone material rewards the reader that pays attention closely -- just like apologetics. :hehe: But if I want a broader readership for them then things like "insider" pages may be the way to go...

Shep, Tim's right; there has not been a connection of the shoulder saying between Elapines and Tilkrig, though ironically enough there will be one made briefly in RP #5 (and that's no big spoiler to say; it's pretty clear Beamer sees himself in that sort of role with Sheila).

As for Shriker and Hornacek becoming an item... :wink: ST #4 will define their relationship a lot more. Sphen's winker-nudger might break, but....

Leonhard

June 11th 2006, 05:54 PM

I absolutely do. A broad survey suggests that people are getting the rang part of the symbol right but missing the Rangslinger family symbol -- but even if they do miss it, they just figure it'll be explained later.

Well I got the rang part right then, I had sorta been thinking about "She of infinite heart" in the Eidolon historical commentary section of the sight. Since you've been alluding to the possibility of timetravel in the other shrike toons, then I think that it is a distinct possibility, that our beloved Sheila will go on some time surfing.

By the way, what in the name of Eidolons unmentionables, does that train run on?

Since it's not driven by fossil fuels and can surtainly have enough capacity for some some high pressure cooker for the steam jets, I guess cox, or the mother of all battery packs. How about methanol or ethanol? (Alchohols which can be readily made from grain with the right (very advanced biochemistry really!) enzymes.

Or what?

It must murder to work with these vehicles (even Sheilas steambike) if one allways have to warm up a tank of water to produce steam.

jpholding

June 12th 2006, 10:47 AM

then I think that it is a distinct possibility, that our beloved Sheila will go on some time surfing.

Very possible indeed. I've already said here that Brom will do some time-surfing, so.... :wink:

By the way, what in the name of Eidolons unmentionables, does that train run on?

It's steam, which is really all they have for propulsion now (other than the little mystery about the missile Beamer is trying to solve, in which a magnetic rail gun is used....and I reveal that only because it was an idea created by one of our TWeb members here, Darth).

Perhaps they could discover ethanol someday, though I see from http://www.eere.energy.gov/afdc/altfuel/ethanol.html that it is used mainly as an additive to increase the efficiency of gasoline, not as a primary fuel source. The same material also says that it's taken a while to make it so that the cost of producing ethanol is low enough to make production efficient.

I've tried to imagine how a world without fossil fuels would resolve and develop energy sources. Here it's an open question as to whether they'd bother to develop ethanol or such things; we developed them as the result of a crisis tied to our primary energy source, fossil fuels. Hearthstone as it now exists would never have an energy crisis that I can see, and so no motive to develop more efficient fuel sources quickly. They also have far fewer residents (2.3 billion) than we do occupying a much larger (x2) planet. If their population escalated to something on the order of 30 billion, then maybe we'd see a crisis.

It must murder to work with these vehicles (even Sheilas steambike) if one allways have to warm up a tank of water to produce steam.

No doubt. Here I have some influence from a work by Harry Turtledove (alternate history sci fi author) who did a book called The Two Georges in which George III and George Washington signed a peace accord, so that the US remained under England. Turtledove envisioned a modern world in which nearly everything ran by steam, and yes, in that case, you always had to wait a while to warm up the tank. But because everyone was British they didn't mind. :wink: They just drank some tea while they waited. Eh, Punkish?

Darth Executor

June 12th 2006, 04:14 PM

I got to read this late since my router's down the toilet.

Leonhard

June 14th 2006, 04:00 PM

It's steam, which is really all they have for propulsion now

Well my question is this, what generates that steam?

To get steam you need to heat up water; heating up water requires a heat source; a heat source requires energy. Where does that energy come from?

Can't be coal since you said that they didn't have fossil fuels, how about wood?

Perhaps they could discover ethanol someday, though I see from http://www.eere.energy.gov/afdc/altfuel/ethanol.html that it is used mainly as an additive to increase the efficiency of gasoline, not as a primary fuel source. The same material also says that it's taken a while to make it so that the cost of producing ethanol is low enough to make production efficient.

Ethanol like hydrogen or methanol, are all just ways of storing energy in an efficient way. Fossil fuels themselves are just that: stored energy.

The blending of gasoline with ethanol has nothing (as far as I know) to do with increasing efficiency, just replacing a part of the gasoline with a CO2-neutral fuel, thereby decreasing overall CO2 outlet.

I've tried to imagine how a world without fossil fuels would resolve and develop energy sources. Here it's an open question as to whether they'd bother to develop ethanol or such things; we developed them as the result of a crisis tied to our primary energy source, fossil fuels.

Do they have any hard liquor on hearthstone? Lighting that on fire would just maybe make a tilkrieg or whatever go "Hey this stuff burns way bet than defingweuse", but then again maybe the tilkrieg where too busy tinkering with the possibility of grafting a Palm pad on to their wrists. The Drovines to busy programming their new OS Bahhhix. And the rest either too un-techish or too buzy fighting to notice.

It must murder to work with these vehicles (even Sheilas steambike) if one allways have to warm up a tank of water to produce steam.
No doubt. Here I have some influence from a work by Harry Turtledove (alternate history sci fi author) who did a book called The Two Georges in which George III and George Washington signed a peace accord, so that the US remained under England. Turtledove envisioned a modern world in which nearly everything ran by steam, and yes, in that case, you always had to wait a while to warm up the tank. But because everyone was British they didn't mind. :wink: They just drank some tea while they waited. Eh, Punkish?

Yeah I'm a steam freak, love all hunkling clunking steam machines I can get near. If you wanna watch a great steampunk anime, check out Steamboy, nothing serious just a good little action/adventure.

BTW am I completely off or is Hearthstone and its characters just a little platform games inspired, no? Whenever I read range patrols I start to hear background music from the Chrash Bandicoot games. Sheila looks like she would make a great video game character!

jpholding

June 14th 2006, 04:26 PM

Well my question is this, what generates that steam?

Wood or peat, I'd suspect, depending on where you are.

The blending of gasoline with ethanol has nothing (as far as I know) to do with increasing efficiency,

There's a lot of talk in the US about it as a way to increase efficiency, but maybe that's just talk.

Do they have any hard liquor on hearthstone?

Sure -- http://www.tektoonics.com/intro/rangtoon1/rangtoon1-5.html

HIC!

Yeah I'm a steam freak, love all hunkling clunking steam machines I can get near. If you wanna watch a great steampunk anime, check out Steamboy, nothing serious just a good little action/adventure.

Haw haw....it's on my kitchen counter now, someone loaned it to me and I haven't had time to watch it. :hehe:

BTW am I completely off or is Hearthstone and its characters just a little platform games inspired, no?

I got a bit of Sheila from Ty the Tasmanian Tiger, but otherwise, no.

Sheila looks like she would make a great video game character!

I agree. Hearthstone's Lara Croft...well, her middle name IS Laralynn (RP #2).

Per tradition, the first page of RP #4....see ya'll tomorrow. Oh, 5 pearls to whoever correctly first guesses what the gift is. This is an easy one.

[attachment=1]

Darth Executor

June 14th 2006, 04:31 PM

I agree. Hearthstone's Lara Croft...well, her middle name IS Laralynn (RP #2).

I dunno. Sheila doesn't have two Howitzers attached to her chest.

Per tradition, the first page of RP #4....see ya'll tomorrow. Oh, 5 pearls to whoever correctly first guesses what the gift is. This is an easy one.

New house?

Leonhard

June 14th 2006, 05:13 PM

Wood or peat, I'd suspect, depending on where you are.

There's a lot of talk in the US about it as a way to increase efficiency, but maybe that's just talk.

They mostly talk about decreasing CO2 outlet of vehicles pr global warming, so maybe just a way of saying we have now improved this vehicles outlet, in a way that is more catchy, or so I think. I really don't know!

http://www.tektoonics.com/intro/rangtoon1/rangtoon1-5.html

HIC!

Cool I missed that!

I got a bit of Sheila from Ty the Tasmanian Tiger, but otherwise, no.

Yeah well, maybe I've just been playing Jak 3 a little too long now.

Per tradition, the first page of RP #4....see ya'll tomorrow. Oh, 5 pearls to whoever correctly first guesses what the gift is. This is an easy one.

[attachment=1]

Since a house has already been taken I'll wager on a statue of them.