Scientist says dolphins are dimwits

[Nicholas]

Scientist says dolphins are dimwits
Cold-water mammals ‘not built for complex information processing’

Updated: 11:21 a.m. CT Aug 17, 2006
JOHANNESBURG - Dolphins may have big brains, but a South African-based scientist says lab rats and even goldfish can outwit them.

Paul Manger of Johannesburg's University of the Witwatersrand says the super-sized brains of dolphins, whales and porpoises are a function of being warm-blooded in a cold water environment and not a sign of intelligence.

Source and more: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14388922/

Unless I missed something, hasn't there been quite a bit of research into dolphin intelligence?

[Tickle Me Mercury]

Scientist says dolphins are dimwits
Cold-water mammals ‘not built for complex information processing’

Updated: 11:21 a.m. CT Aug 17, 2006
JOHANNESBURG - Dolphins may have big brains, but a South African-based scientist says lab rats and even goldfish can outwit them.

Paul Manger of Johannesburg's University of the Witwatersrand says the super-sized brains of dolphins, whales and porpoises are a function of being warm-blooded in a cold water environment and not a sign of intelligence.

Source and more: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14388922/

Unless I missed something, hasn't there been quite a bit of research into dolphin intelligence?

If I call correctly, dolphins have a brain size and cerebral cortex complexity on par with humans (in relation to body size etc.), which led to much sspeculation about their intelligence.

I have however, read articles that suggest that a large portion of their "intelligence capacity" is dedicated to the deciphering of their sonar.

[Nicholas]

If I call correctly, dolphins have a brain size and cerebral cortex complexity on par with humans (in relation to body size etc.), which led to much sspeculation about their intelligence.

I have however, read articles that suggest that a large portion of their "intelligence capacity" is dedicated to the deciphering of their sonar.

From what I've read there seems to be more than simply speculation. One of the reasons listed in the article for this conclusion was that they don't attempt to jump out of marine parks while goldfish will attempt to escape from a bowl. Now while I haven't read about this elsewhere, if the comparison is accurate, couldn't this behavior just as easily be used to conclude the opposite since after jumping out the goldfish would die?

There also seems to be quite a bit of research pointing in the direction that dolphins would appear to exhibit intelligence, such as recognizing their own reflection (see here: http://www.jhu.edu/~newslett/05-3-01/Science/2.html), and even using tools (see here: http://www.sciencenews.org/articles/20050611/fob2.asp).

[Teallaura]

:rant:

That's it! We should abolish science! How dare anyone attack the intelligence of Flipper!




























Sorry, but it was just too good to pass up..... :hehe:

[Tickle Me Mercury]

From what I've read there seems to be more than simply speculation. One of the reasons listed in the article for this conclusion was that they don't attempt to jump out of marine parks while goldfish will attempt to escape from a bowl. Now while I haven't read about this elsewhere, if the comparison is accurate, couldn't this behavior just as easily be used to conclude the opposite since after jumping out the goldfish would die?

There also seems to be quite a bit of research pointing in the direction that dolphins would appear to exhibit intelligence, such as recognizing their own reflection (see here: http://www.jhu.edu/~newslett/05-3-01/Science/2.html), and even using tools (see here: http://www.sciencenews.org/articles/20050611/fob2.asp).

You're links are coming up bad...


But besides that, after reading the first article with food in my stomache and undistracted, the conclusions the scientist has provided, absent of any context that might change them, seem quite speculative themselves.

If I can find anything about the dolphin's intelligence being used mainly to process sonar information, I'll post back with a link. It was quite a while ago that I read the article.

[lao tzu]

You're links are coming up bad... Try 'em without the final closed parentheses.

http://www.jhu.edu/~newslett/05-3-01/Science/2.html

http://www.sciencenews.org/articles/20050611/fob2.asp

[Tickle Me Mercury]

Try 'em without the final closed parentheses.

http://www.jhu.edu/~newslett/05-3-01/Science/2.html

http://www.sciencenews.org/articles/20050611/fob2.asp
Well would ya look at that!

Thanks.

[Glenn P]

Sweet, Now I don't feel so bad about slicing dolphins up and putting them on my cornflakes.

[kneel2hymn]

I've owned both rats and goldfish. I always found the rats to be fairly intelligent if that is what you can call being able to traverse a maze to find food. The goldfish on the other hand I always assumed was suicidal.

One question though that has always baffeled me is why do we want to know how intelligent an animal is. I mean, do we really want to know if they are smarter than we are?

[Teallaura]

I've owned both rats and goldfish. I always found the rats to be fairly intelligent if that is what you can call being able to traverse a maze to find food. The goldfish on the other hand I always assumed was suicidal.

One question though that has always baffeled me is why do we want to know how intelligent an animal is. I mean, do we really want to know if they are smarter than we are?

Well, smarter than the jerk who cuts us off would be nice. Most people wouldn't want an animal smarter than themselves, but if they could get bright enough to handle household chores we'd love it.

:teeth:

More seriously, we'd like to see Pavlov refuted - who wants to think that they are merely (or mostly) wired by instinct? Problem solving ability would be evidence to the contrary.

Or it could be that we just like useless comparasons/measurements. Maybe we're wired that way? :wink:

[Didaktylos]

Dolphins are smart (and paranoid) enough to deliberately frustrate human attempts to measure their intelligence. (I was told this by Hagbard Celine's friend, Howard.)

[Nicholas]

To quote Douglas Adams on this Subject:
"Man has always assumed that he is more intelligent than the dolphin, because he has achieved so much more throughout history... the wheel, New York, wars, and so on, whilst all the dolphins ever did was muck about in the water having a good time. But conversely the dolphins know themselves to be more intelligent than man for precisely the same reason."