Dovetail Hell

[headheart]

The spliff, the joint, the slowboat, the toke, the doobie, the Californian toothpick, the three blader ... whatever name you give to that smoke you light up and whose taste alters you mood from sad to happy, from happy to sad, from mundane to reflective, from reflective to depressed, from depressed to manic, from manic to delusional, from delusional to psychotic, from psychotic to insance, from insane to demented, from demented to suicidal, from alive to dead, though apparently useful in the treatment of certain disorders is a drug that is able to open you up to some of the most diabolical nightmares, that do not just happen while you are sleeping. It is often regarded as a drug that if used in moderation is very good for you. The reasons why people do and don't are varied, but could it be that this drug, or rather hallocinogenic can open up the door and let in dark and dangerous entities that leech off your life joy, and ultimately render you passionless and hollow ?

(Poll if you like. This is "Dovetail Hell" and I headheart am your ever mellow host.)

[headheart]

The spliff, the joint, the slowboat, the toke, the doobie, the Californian toothpick, the three blader ... whatever name you give to that smoke you light up and whose taste alters you mood from sad to happy, from happy to sad, from mundane to reflective, from reflective to depressed, from depressed to manic, from manic to delusional, from delusional to psychotic, from psychotic to insance, from insane to demented, from demented to suicidal, from alive to dead, though apparently useful in the treatment of certain disorders is a drug that is able to open you up to some of the most diabolical nightmares, that do not just happen while you are sleeping. It is often regarded as a drug that if used in moderation is very good for you. The reasons why people do and don't are varied, but could it be that this drug, or rather hallocinogenic can open up the door and let in dark and dangerous entities that leech off your life joy, and ultimately render you passionless and hollow ?

(Poll if you like. This is "Dovetail Hell" and I headheart am your ever mellow host.)

Oh come on this is nearly as bad as the masturbation denails. Surely, someone is not afraid to talk about the Holy Herb of the Rastafarians ?

You guys crack me up!

:yipee:

Headheart, please wait a reasonable amount of time for replies (2 to 3 days) before bumping your threads.

[Jnthn]

It's probably that your post smacks of the modus operandi of a recent "character" here who had a particular fetish for 'shrooms...

It's not a conversation I want to be part of.

J

[headheart]

It's not a conversation I want to be part of.

J


:broccoli: (there just aren't any dancing chickens paaaaak, pak, pak...)

[lao tzu]

:broccoli: (there just aren't any dancing chickens paaaaak, pak, pak...) Backhanded slaps at the dancing broccoli will win you no friends among us vegetarians, HH.

This is a public bulletin board on the internet. It would be foolish for many members who are less than careful to guard their anonymity to participate in this discussion. Bosses, parents, friends, the government ... somebody's always watching.

As ever, Jesse

[headheart]

Backhanded slaps at the dancing broccoli will win you no friends among us vegetarians, HH.

This is a public bulletin board on the internet. It would be foolish for many members who are less than careful to guard their anonymity to participate in this discussion. Bosses, parents, friends, the government ... somebody's always watching.

As ever, Jesse

Yes, you are right Jesse. I got a little to carried away with this whole thing, and perhaps a thread like this is not really a useful addition to TWeb. I will notify the Mod's to delete this thread or take any action they deem wise.

HH

[mossrose]

Is pot not illegal?

Is it appropriate for a professing believer to be partaking of something illegal?

Especially when that law made by man does not contradict any of God's laws......

So, to partake of an illegal substance, and then to boast about it on a public forum, is not particularly Christlike, do you think?

[lao tzu]

Yes, you are right Jesse. I got a little to carried away with this whole thing, and perhaps a thread like this is not really a useful addition to TWeb. I will notify the Mod's to delete this thread or take any action they deem wise.

HH Aw shucks, I didn't mean to be a wet blanket. There's lots of ways to have fun around here (without publicly admitting to illegal activities). You can go a few more rounds with LGM if you like. Eventually, he grows on you. Or you can join the ranks of the Polygerbilists. But then I'll have to pray the Great Rodent smites you down. Nothing personal, it's my mission (http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showthread.php?p=1683154#post1683154). And I wasn't really given much choice.

[Rahab]

The spliff, the joint, the slowboat, the toke, the doobie, the Californian toothpick, the three blader ... whatever name you give to that smoke you light up and whose taste alters you mood from sad to happy, from happy to sad, from mundane to reflective, from reflective to depressed, from depressed to manic, from manic to delusional, from delusional to psychotic, from psychotic to insance, from insane to demented, from demented to suicidal, from alive to dead,)

Bonjour Headheart,

You could probably ask for the poll to be deleted instead of your entire thread in view of the comments Taoist made.

A couple of things I need to comment on: THC, the active ingredient of the leaves harvested from the canabis sativa, is generaly not classified as a psychotogenic drug (which means inducing psychosis). And some of the effects ,you mentionned here as being caused by "pot", describe the effects of mescaline, LSD 25, bufotenine, harmine, psilocybin etc....

If THC will increase sensorial perceptions and alterate moods, it is not a depressant as you presented it. In fact, HTC based therapies are recommended for cancer patients undergoing chemo treatments for three reasons : it combats depression which accompanies the ordeal of cancer/treatments, it is an appetite stimulant and it suppresses the nausea side effects caused by high toxicity chemo.




. though apparently useful in the treatment of certain disorders is a drug that is able to open you up to some of the most diabolical nightmares, that do not just happen while you are sleeping..) The medical therapeutic effects of HTC are not just an appearance. Among its proven therapeutic effects, anti spasmodic, pressure reducer in glaucoma, analgesic, anti depressant etc..... However, because such medicinal plant would not profit to the pharmaceutical industry (since it can be homegrown and necessitates no processing or manufacturing), there has not been much effort made to promote it as a natural drug capable to compete with currently high priced chemicaly manufactured drugs.



. It is often regarded as a drug that if used in moderation is very good for you..) The reasons why people do and don't are varied, but could it be that this drug, or rather hallocinogenic can open up the door and let in dark and dangerous entities that leech off your life joy, and ultimately render you passionless and hollow ?.) That is quite debatable considering that cancer patients who were treated with an HTC based drug experienced the opposite of the loss of joy, or "being rendered passionless and hollow". I am not sure what you mean by "dark entities" as my approach to how HTC interacts with our biochemistry remains purely clinical.

(Poll if you like. This is "Dovetail Hell" and I headheart am your ever mellow host.) As an aside, your profile indicates your location to be Africa. Born and raised in Africa here until we moved to France.:smile:

[headheart]

Hi Rahab,

Thanks so much for your informative response. I am a little pushed for time it is 23h03 in Africa. I think much has to do with the climate in which dagga is grown. The potency varies considerably. Some strains are so potent that a single pull on a joint can knock you out cold, send you dashing into the ocean, or have you laugh yourself to sleep. Well, make of it what you will. Sometimes insecticides get into the stuff, and well a little poison can blow the mind pretty severly. Enough for now, I have other dreams to dream, and shall look back on your post. It was delicious and curiously positive in a very good way. The medical potential of all herbs is certainly something that is coming of it's own in the current resurgence of New Age healers etc...

Nice to converse with another African. Peace on yer sista.

HH
:innocent:

[Rahab]

Hi Rahab,

Thanks so much for your informative response. I am a little pushed for time it is 23h03 in Africa. I think much has to do with the climate in which dagga is grown. The potency varies considerably. Some strains are so potent that a single pull on a joint can knock you out cold, send you dashing into the ocean, or have you laugh yourself to sleep. Well, make of it what you will. Sometimes insecticides get into the stuff, and well a little poison can blow the mind pretty severly. Enough for now, I have other dreams to dream, and shall look back on your post. It was delicious and curiously positive in a very good way. The medical potential of all herbs is certainly something that is coming of it's own in the current resurgence of New Age healers etc...

Bonjour or bonsoir depending on your time,

The "curiously positive" was there to balance your OP where "pot" was described as having effects similar to other drugs. I wanted to make sure that folks who were not familiar with the classification of cannabis sativa leaves did not assume that HTC causes psychotic effects.

Nonetheless, because of the alteration of senses and mood, it is still classified as an hallucinogenic. However, it does not cause visual, tactile, olfactile or auditive hallucinations as LSD 25 or mescaline do.

You mentionned the "current resurgence of New Age healers" which I prefer to describe as the rediscovery of herbology and its medical therapeutic qualities. Holistic medicine, for example, does promote the use of herbology for certain treatments. Such as hormonal replacement therapy. It does not claim to "heal" rather to treat symptoms with natural products less susceptible to cause negative side effects. Chemicaly manufactured hormones for example to replace the loss of estrogene and progesterone in menopausal stages are known to potentialy cause cervical and breast cancer.

The way I look at it, Headheart, is that God created some plants for us to use safely to help us withstand various health conditions. From many of those plants are currently extracted substances used in pharmacology such as Valium from the Valerian. Many people do not know that when they experience muscular pain escorted by poor sleep, a few capsules of Valerian Root will do the job! Instead, they might resort to prescribed muscle relaxants which produce side effects such as drowsiness and nausea and the use of chemical sleeping aids.

IMO, we need to distinguish between claims of "healing" qualities and claims of symptom reducing qualities when it comes to the use of herbology. Also, please keep in mind that Luke, as a physician, certainly did not prescribe chemicaly manufactured drugs as a remedy but indeed he had to have studied the potentiality of various herbs and plants to offer relief.

Nice to converse with another African. Peace on yer sista.

HH
:innocent: Very nice to converse with you too! I have been away from Africa for a very long time. But for myself as well as for my sister, we both experience nostalgy. I always look for African communities when in France or in the US. I lived mostly in ex French colonies from Madagascar to Senegal and Ivory Coast. My father spent 20 years in Africa. My mother was born and raised in Algeria.

Peace on you too, Headheart. Africa Obota!

[headheart]

Bonjour or bonsoir depending on your time,

The "curiously positive" was there to balance your OP where "pot" was described as having effects similar to other drugs. I wanted to make sure that folks who were not familiar with the classification of cannabis sativa leaves did not assume that HTC causes psychotic effects.

Nonetheless, because of the alteration of senses and mood, it is still classified as an hallucinogenic. However, it does not cause visual, tactile, olfactile or auditive hallucinations as LSD 25 or mescaline do.

You mentionned the "current resurgence of New Age healers" which I prefer to describe as the rediscovery of herbology and its medical therapeutic qualities. Holistic medicine, for example, does promote the use of herbology for certain treatments. Such as hormonal replacement therapy. It does not claim to "heal" rather to treat symptoms with natural products less susceptible to cause negative side effects. Chemicaly manufactured hormones for example to replace the loss of estrogene and progesterone in menopausal stages are known to potentialy cause cervical and breast cancer.

The way I look at it, Headheart, is that God created some plants for us to use safely to help us withstand various health conditions. From many of those plants are currently extracted substances used in pharmacology such as Valium from the Valerian. Many people do not know that when they experience muscular pain escorted by poor sleep, a few capsules of Valerian Root will do the job! Instead, they might resort to prescribed muscle relaxants which produce side effects such as drowsiness and nausea and the use of chemical sleeping aids.

IMO, we need to distinguish between claims of "healing" qualities and claims of symptom reducing qualities when it comes to the use of herbology. Also, please keep in mind that Luke, as a physician, certainly did not prescribe chemicaly manufactured drugs as a remedy but indeed he had to have studied the potentiality of various herbs and plants to offer relief.

Very nice to converse with you too! I have been away from Africa for a very long time. But for myself as well as for my sister, we both experience nostalgy. I always look for African communities when in France or in the US. I lived mostly in ex French colonies from Madagascar to Senegal and Ivory Coast. My father spent 20 years in Africa. My mother was born and raised in Algeria.

Peace on you too, Headheart. Africa Obota!

Excellent reply.

One point you have missed. CS is psychologically addictive, and in the case you might not know CS then becomes a dependancy. Increased use will result in the reverse effects, instead of increased appetite - loss of appetite, instead of calming and passive effect - wild manically depressed and severly outrageous behaviour. (I am not talking about the effect of coupling it with alcohol, or upper or downers, just the good old leaf...and I do mean GOOD leaves, not the typical Californian leaves. Good rich succulent and dripping with THC. I mean almost dripping out of the leaf. Sorry, I got carried away, but only to stress a piont. Where there is not additive, ie: cigarette tabacco, just the green leave crushed ever so slightly and placed in either a soapstone or chillum pipe. It is hard to smoke, but it will have similar effects if not even more hysterical to that of hashish, which is after all the pure extract of THC. The effect are harmful to the personality and can result in massive depression. I do mean after the episode which is as potent as the effects of heroin or morphine, and certainly rates as high as XTC and LSD.)

This might be a load of tripe to most, but the truth is that most have only had the occassional joint, and not even a BIG RASTA joint..I mean a twenty five blader, all on your ownsome lonesome. Well, enough from my crazy inventory of life through the window of a Dovetail joint, that points to the Dovetail Hell.

Cough, cough, cough....stagger, sway, wobble, smile.....

:eek:

ps. Do you ever listen to the work of Johnny Clegg, or Lucky Dube ?

[Jade]

Increased use will result in the reverse effects, instead of increased appetite - loss of appetite, instead of calming and passive effect - wild manically depressed and severely outrageous behavior.
I wanted to jump in here briefly to add: Many folks that use drugs also have mood disorders. Sometimes these people experience different effects from the drugs than people without mood disorders. On the other hand drugs themselves can produce some of the same symptoms as the disorders. Psychiatrists here in the U.S. choose to treat as one issue (instead of trying to figure out whether the symptoms led to the the drug use or the drug use led to the symptoms) -- Dual Diagnosis, they call it. Some street drugs seem to help sometimes for awhile. But the harmful effects outweigh the benefits. Other street drugs totally make the symptoms worse. Likewise some medicine prescribed by a doctor can make symptoms worse others make the symptoms better.



(Warning: Triggers)

I have bipolar disorder which used to be called Manic Depression: Manic for the highs and depression for the lows. There are some that have high energy while depressed (Mixed Episode). While I've never been on street drugs, I am quite familiar with the symptoms you've described.

It can be quite a subtle progression that sometime you don't realize that you're not your normal self. You start off thinking that you can do a better job than someone else. Next then you know, you feel like you're better than the rest of the population. You have brilliant ideas and they come to you very quickly. Your energy level soars. You feel like you could do anything and that nothing could hurt you. Then you think you've discovered something that everyone else on the planet has missed. Of course if you share these ideas with others, most of the times they haven't a clue what you're talking about. It feels like the whole world around you has slowed to a crawl. That feeling starts to grate on your nerves until you become irritable and sometimes violent. It can progress to the point where you think you can control the world; that you are god; your ideas starting coming from the TV or computer actually talking to you and you totally detach from reality around you.

Somewhere around this point your mind begins to muddle into a confusing puddle and you begin the awful drop into despair. All the self-confidence you had disappears and you are left a dark fog of a self-esteem that's in the toilet. All the negativity builds up in your mind: I'm no good; I'm worthless; I can't do anything right. All that energy runs out, and it takes everything you've got just to get out of bed. Or perhaps you just stay in bed for weeks on end. You start thinking that people would be better off without you. From there it's not a far walk to the point were you want to die. Some folks get so severely depressed that they start hearing voices telling them how to end it or seeing images in their head of self-harm. These just add to impulse. At this point all it takes, for some, is a tiny bit of energy to act on the impulse. If allowed the time, the mood will eventually return back to normal, waiting the next trigger to set off the cycle once again.