Evangelism and Anxiety De-rail

[whag]

My wife and I went to Walmart last night, and she went toward the back of the store to round up some TP and PT. I was hanging around the produce area.

Two Mormon "elders" came in - 'in uniform' - and began perusing the fresh fruit area. One of the guys looked a bit nervous - he kept looking around like he was out of place, or was concerned about people seeing him there.

When the skinny guy headed over to the bananas, the chunky guy was within reach, and I just asked him, "You're not really comfortable with this whole Mormon thing, are you?" He looked surprised, and said, "How do you know that?" I was surprised by his response - I thought he would be more defensive.

I pressed on. I said, "I think you're having second thoughts, and wondering if you made the right decision by going on this mission". He asked, "you know I'm on a mission?" (of course, that was pretty obvious)

I told him I'd really love to talk to him, and handed him one of my business cards, which he immediately slid into his pocket. His buddy was on the way back over from the fresh baked bread section, and asked, "What's going on here?" The chunky guy just shrugged it off and said "we were just talking". The skinny guy kinda stepped between me and the chunky guy and said, "we need to do that together".

I just looked at the chunky guy and asked, "Why do you think that is? Why do you think you're being kept from talking to somebody who God led to speak to you?" He slid his hand back in his pocket, and I thought he was going to give my business card back to me, but he didn't. He just stood there with his hand in his pocket, til his buddy kinda turned him away from me and said, "we need to go now".

They walked back to the entrance/exit without buying anything, and as they went through the door, the chunky guy looked back. I know it was corny, but I did the "call me" thing.

I hope he does, but he'll have to find an opportunity to do so without his buddy, apparently.

I've been tempted to do this with a nervous Christians to show they're really twitchy skeptics underneath, but I don't because it's plain rude and presumptive. Was this your line of thinking?

[Cow Poke]

I've been tempted to do this with a nervous Christians

And, how, exactly, could you tell "nervous Christians" shopping in Walmart?

to show they're really twitchy skeptics underneath,

"twitchy skeptics"?

but I don't because it's plain rude and presumptive.

So, you're "tempted" to do that which is "rude and presumptive". Hmmmmmm.

Was this your line of thinking?

I don't think I'm capable of thinking in that manner.

[whag]

And, how, exactly, could you tell "nervous Christians" shopping in Walmart?



"twitchy skeptics"?



So, you're "tempted" to do that which is "rude and presumptive". Hmmmmmm.



I don't think I'm capable of thinking in that manner.

No, I've met nervous fundamentalist Christians who've knocked in my door to invite me to their new church. Yes, I've been tempted to point out their anxiety while they evangelize as possibly indicating they're doubting the whole enterprise, just as you did with the elder. I politely deflected the invite rather than engage in a dialogue I knew I'd have the upper hand in.

[Cow Poke]

No, I've met nervous fundamentalist Christians who've knocked in my door to invite me to their new church.

I'm a bit suspicious, but, ok....

Yes, I've been tempted to point out their anxiety while they evangelize

So, were they 'evangelizing", or where they simply inviting you to their church?

as possibly indicating they're doubting the whole enterprise, just as you did with the elder.

Well, I believe I was prompted by the Holy Spirit, and the young man's willingness to talk to me seemed to confirm that.

I politely deflected the invite rather than engage in a dialogue I knew I'd have the upper hand in.

OK, so your point?

[37818]

Knock knock

[Jedidiah]

. . . snip . . .I politely deflected the invite rather than engage in a dialogue I knew I'd have the upper hand in.

By upper hand you mean you could have said "no."

[whag]

I'm a bit suspicious, but, ok....

I'm equally suspicious of your encounter (it sounds a bit contrived), but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.

So, were they 'evangelizing", or where they simply inviting you to their church?

You have enough pastoral seasoning to know those aren't mutually exclusive. They asked if I was a Christian. They always do in these door-to-door visits.

Well, I believe I was prompted by the Holy Spirit, and the young man's willingness to talk to me seemed to confirm that.

Had he been resistant, would you have chalked it up to a false prompting?

[whag]

Knock knock

Who's there? =P

[Cow Poke]

I'm equally suspicious of your encounter (it sounds a bit contrived), but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.

I was there, so I know it was true. Your encounter(s), on the other hand, seem a bit contrived, but.. no matter.

You have enough pastoral seasoning to know those aren't mutually exclusive.

Let's keep this friendly, OK? They're not mutually exclusive, but you specifically said they were "inviting you to their new Church".

They asked if I was a Christian. They always do in these door-to-door visits.

OK......

Had he been resistant, would you have chalked it up to a false prompting?

Not necessarily. But I would still see it as "planting the seed".

[37818]

Who's there? =P

Hi, we are from _______ church. Do you have a church home where you are currently attending? [One of many possible opening statements.]

[whag]

I was there, so I know it was true. Your encounter(s), on the other hand, seem a bit contrived, but.. no matter.

Christians going door to door isn’t unusual, and I politely refused interaction. Refusing the invite isn't unusual--some wouldn't even answer the door for Mormon missionaries (who at least announce their intention in their formal LDS dress). That doesn’t sound near as odd as your telling a Mormon (who you never met) "You're not really comfortable with this whole Mormon thing, are you?"

Meanwhile, I live in a demographic of many Christians establishing churches that need members. I’m not trying to mean, but I know you understand that, and should appreciate I’m not mean to them when they’re nervous.

Let's keep this friendly, OK?

I've read your interactions here. If you think that’s rude (like, violating Cow Poke standards rude), I don’t know what to say.

They're not mutually exclusive, but you specifically said they were "inviting you to their new Church".

Sorry for the misunderstanding. Even a mere church invite campaign can cause anxiety--we're nervous when going into new territory. Even without evangelization, a church invite has obvious evangelistic subtext. I wouldn’t take advantage of that missionary intention to accuse them of an absence of heart.

Not necessarily. But I would still see it as "planting the seed".

I wonder if "chunky guy's" doubts are doctrine based or just generally skeptical of the whole religious enterprise. For all you know, Chunky’s just nervous on his mission. Surely, missionaries have feelings like that and should be entitled to feel them without the likes of you telling them you know what's best for their life. Maybe the trip itself would be the religious awakening he needed.

[Cow Poke]

Christians going door to door isn’t unusual, and I politely refused interaction.

Sadly, it's far more unusual than it used to be.

Refusing the invite isn't unusual--some wouldn't even answer the door for Mormon missionaries (who at least announce their intention in their formal LDS dress).

Yes, that's helpful - both to those who want to avoid them, and to those of us who love to engage them.

That doesn’t sound near as odd as your telling a Mormon (who you never met) "You're not really comfortable with this whole Mormon thing, are you?"

Actually, I wasn't "telling" him that, I was asking - as indicated by the question mark at the end. And I'm a people person - and a very observant one, at that.

Meanwhile, I live in a demographic of many Christians establishing churches that need members. I’m not trying to mean, but I know you understand that, and should appreciate I’m not mean to them when they’re nervous.

I have a hard time with the "nervous" part in regards to going door to door -- that's not something that's very common anymore, and the ones who still do it are usually rather confident, but I'll give you that.

I've read your interactions here. If you think that’s rude (like, violating Cow Poke standards rude), I don’t know what to say.

Well, yeah, I've read your interactions, too, and if you want a civil discussion, I'm all for it. If you're just here to troll....

Sorry for the misunderstanding. Even a mere church invite campaign can cause anxiety--we're nervous when going into new territory. Even without evangelization, a church invite has obvious evangelistic subtext. I wouldn’t take advantage of that missionary intention to accuse them of an absence of heart.

Somehow, I have the feeling that you're only looking for ways to show yourself kinder and gentler than me --- or something.

I wonder if "chunky guy's" doubts are doctrine based or just generally skeptical of the whole religious enterprise. For all you know, Chunky’s just nervous on his mission.

I didn't know, which is why I asked. And I suspect I know a little more about the "Mormon mission" thing than you do.

Surely, missionaries have feelings like that and should be entitled to feel them without the likes of you telling them you know what's best for their life. Maybe the trip itself would be the religious awakening he needed.

I sincerely believe he's getting sucked into a false religion that steers him away from the true Gospel. I have interacted with a number of Mormons in such situations, and my wife and I see that as a ministry. If I saw him about to step in front of a cement truck, would it be "rude" of me to pull him back?

[Jichard]

My wife and I went to Walmart last night, and she went toward the back of the store to round up some TP and PT. I was hanging around the produce area.

Two Mormon "elders" came in - 'in uniform' - and began perusing the fresh fruit area. One of the guys looked a bit nervous - he kept looking around like he was out of place, or was concerned about people seeing him there.

When the skinny guy headed over to the bananas, the chunky guy was within reach, and I just asked him, "You're not really comfortable with this whole Mormon thing, are you?" He looked surprised, and said, "How do you know that?" I was surprised by his response - I thought he would be more defensive.

I pressed on. I said, "I think you're having second thoughts, and wondering if you made the right decision by going on this mission". He asked, "you know I'm on a mission?" (of course, that was pretty obvious)

I told him I'd really love to talk to him, and handed him one of my business cards, which he immediately slid into his pocket. His buddy was on the way back over from the fresh baked bread section, and asked, "What's going on here?" The chunky guy just shrugged it off and said "we were just talking". The skinny guy kinda stepped between me and the chunky guy and said, "we need to do that together".

I just looked at the chunky guy and asked, "Why do you think that is? Why do you think you're being kept from talking to somebody who God led to speak to you?" He slid his hand back in his pocket, and I thought he was going to give my business card back to me, but he didn't. He just stood there with his hand in his pocket, til his buddy kinda turned him away from me and said, "we need to go now".

They walked back to the entrance/exit without buying anything, and as they went through the door, the chunky guy looked back. I know it was corny, but I did the "call me" thing.

I hope he does, but he'll have to find an opportunity to do so without his buddy, apparently.

I've been tempted to do this with a nervous Christians to show they're really twitchy skeptics underneath, but I don't because it's plain rude and presumptive. Was this your line of thinking?

I find the following line priceless, when it comes from someone who goes to great lengths to avoid folks who say truths he does not want to hear:

"I just looked at the chunky guy and asked, "Why do you think that is? Why do you think you're being kept from talking to somebody who God led to speak to you?" "

Anyway, I don't see a particular problem in challenging someone's beliefs in a way that doesn't harm them, nor in listening to challenges from other's I might be rude, but it's going to need to be done eventually if they're going to change their minds.

[Cow Poke]

I find the following line priceless

Do not post in this thread.

Thanks

[Jichard]

Do not post in this thread.

Thanks

You're not whag, so you don't dictate who posts, troll.

Thanks.