What's the difference between eating beef to eating dog?

[aardvarkcore]

If you kill a dog it is somehow murder ... If you kill thousands of cows it's an industry?

[Jnthn]

If you kill a dog it is somehow murder ... If you kill thousands of cows it's an industry?Sez who? I personally wouldn't mind trying Dog!

J

[Lazarus]

In Korea, Vietnam and parts of China there seems to be little difference at all, except dog meat may be cheaper.

[SteveF]

I've got a friend who says that dog is really tasty. I've never been offered it, but wouldn't have a problem with eating it. I try to base my animal eating activities on whether or not they are endangered or reared cruely for example, not how cute and fluffy they are.

[mossrose]

If you kill a dog it is somehow murder ... If you kill thousands of cows it's an industry?
It becomes an emotional factor. Dogs are, as Steve says, cute and fluffy, for the most part, and the majority of them in our western culture are kept as family pets, or perhaps working dogs on farms or ranches.

Cattle are not cute and fluffy except when they are little, and the majority of those used in the food chain are bred to be such. They are not pets.

[Crow]

If you kill a dog it is somehow murder ... If you kill thousands of cows it's an industry?

I ate dog when I lived in Taiwan, and it's tasty. Many generations of my American Indian forebears weren't kidding when they said it was good eats.

Not eating dog is a cultural thing. The same as eating a hamburger in India would be perceived as wrong, or eating a pig in Israel would be seen as nasty.

[Longstreet]

What's the difference between eating beef to eating dog?
The way it's seasoned?

[MooseOnTheLoose]

What's the difference between eating beef to eating dog?

A cow doesn't bite back.

[aardvarkcore]

Someone should start a slaughter house for dogs and see what happens, pretty humorous social experiment if you ask me.

[Timothy Leary]

You've got cultural taboos, it wouldn't sell.
That's the power of people in the market w/o the govt.

But to answer your question, the only difference is that of 'taboo'.
Otherwise, no, there is a difference.
But I don't see it as wrong, per se

[Nicholas]

You've got cultural taboos, it wouldn't sell.
That's the power of people in the market w/o the govt.

But to answer your question, the only difference is that of 'taboo'.
Otherwise, no, there is a difference.
But I don't see it as wrong, per se

I've got two dogs right here who would very much disagree with you saying that it's not necessarily wrong.

[Amazing Rando]

I've got two dogs right here who would very much disagree with you saying that it's not necessarily wrong.

What about the Chick-Fil-A ad campaign where all the cows are encouraging us to eat more chicken? The cows want us to eat more chicken because then we'd eat less cows!

[Raptor]

What about the Chick-Fil-A ad campaign where all the cows are encouraging us to eat more chicken? The cows want us to eat more chicken because then we'd eat less cows!

:shifty:

[Nicholas]

What about the Chick-Fil-A ad campaign where all the cows are encouraging us to eat more chicken? The cows want us to eat more chicken because then we'd eat less cows!

Don't remember that, but back on topic. I could never eat mine or any other dogs, I've lived with dogs and cats my entire life and my dogs are like members of the family.

[Abigail]

cows eat grass, dogs eat everything including disgusting non-mentionables. ...uugh the thought of eating dog yuk!

[Timothy Leary]

I've got two dogs right here who would very much disagree with you saying that it's not necessarily wrong.

Yet, outside of cultural taboos, what reason do you have for that?
Why should I condemn an african who eats dogs?

[Timothy Leary]

cows eat grass, dogs eat everything including disgusting non-mentionables. ...uugh the thought of eating dog yuk!
chickens are worse.

[JusticeMachine]

If you kill a dog it is somehow murder ... If you kill thousands of cows it's an industry?

Here is an interesting article from Glendale Arizona:

Glendale man who fed a puppy coated with cooking oil to a malnourished snake was sentenced Thursday to a 90-day jail term. Joseph E. Beadle, 40, who pleaded guilty to a charge of animal cruelty

Why is this illegal?

[Nicholas]

Here is an interesting article from Glendale Arizona:



Why is this illegal?


I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic, but if you're not, don't come anywhere near my dogs.

[Smokering]

What's the difference between eating beef to eating dog?
What--morally, socially, economically?

I don't see any particular moral distinction between consuming beef and... is there a word for dog meat? Socially, it'll probably get you into trouble (in many parts of the Western world) with those who think thee *is* a moral distinction. Economically.. probably depends on the pedigree of the dog in question. :p

I've got two dogs right here who would very much disagree with you saying that it's not necessarily wrong.
I'm sorry, but that is a particularly meaningless statement. Dogs cannot talk, or presumably formulate an ethical argument against being eaten; in which case, all you are really saying is that they have an instinctual desire to survive. In which case, they are no different from COWS, or indeed any other animal (my mother's particularly stupid and apathetic rabbit excepting!). As you don't seem to be making a case for vegetarianism, I wonder what your point is? I can see that you are fond of your dogs, and as such would not want them to be eaten; therefore, eating your particular dogs against your will could be seen as immoral (theft, at any rate). However, you are presenting no reason for logically extending the immorality to the consumption of other dogs, which is what this thread is about. The owner of a very beloved pet cow could equally be affronted at the idea of Bossie being eaten, without feeling the need to embargo the eating of other cows. I personally would not wish to eat my own chickens, Bridget and Saffron; but I have chicken breast thawing in my fridge, from the supermarket.

[Lili]

There's no moral difference. I'd never eat a dog, though, unless I was starving, because they eat all matter of disgusting things.

[Nicholas]

I'm sorry, but that is a particularly meaningless statement. Dogs cannot talk, or presumably formulate an ethical argument against being eaten; in which case, all you are really saying is that they have an instinctual desire to survive. In which case, they are no different from COWS, or indeed any other animal (my mother's particularly stupid and apathetic rabbit excepting!). As you don't seem to be making a case for vegetarianism, I wonder what your point is? I can see that you are fond of your dogs, and as such would not want them to be eaten; therefore, eating your particular dogs against your will could be seen as immoral (theft, at any rate). However, you are presenting no reason for logically extending the immorality to the consumption of other dogs, which is what this thread is about. The owner of a very beloved pet cow could equally be affronted at the idea of Bossie being eaten, without feeling the need to embargo the eating of other cows. I personally would not wish to eat my own chickens, Bridget and Saffron; but I have chicken breast thawing in my fridge, from the supermarket.

A meaningless statement? The statement I made was atleast partly sarcastic, but the emotional bond that I have with my dogs isn't the only reason I would be against eating them. Dogs don't act purely on instinct, they, like human beings, are social animals, and probably have some limited capacity for thought, which his a whole lot more than I could say for chickens.

[JusticeMachine]

I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic, but if you're not, don't come anywhere near my dogs.

I have seen people feed living crickets to snake and frogs, isn’t that animal cruelty? Are all animals of equal value?

[Nicholas]

I have seen people feed living crickets to snake and frogs, isn’t that animal cruelty? Are all animals of equal value?

Are you seriously comparing dogs to crickets?

[Smokering]

A meaningless statement? The statement I made was atleast partly sarcastic, but the emotional bond that I have with my dogs isn't the only reason I would be against eating them. Dogs don't act purely on instinct, they, like human beings, are social animals, and probably have some limited capacity for thought, which his a whole lot more than I could say for chickens.
Okay, but to be fair, you didn't mention those reasons in your original post.

I still don't see what the intelligence of the dogs has to do with it. Is it your opinion that it is only moral to eat stupid animals? (Incidentally, they say chickens are very smart. I have never observed this to be the case with my own chickens. They are terminally stupid). If so, at what level of intelligence does an animal become taboo?

Also, out of curiosity, are you a vegetarian?

[Nicholas]

Okay, but to be fair, you didn't mention those reasons in your original post.


I didn't think it was necessary.


I still don't see what the intelligence of the dogs has to do with it. Is it your opinion that it is only moral to eat stupid animals? (Incidentally, they say chickens are very smart. I have never observed this to be the case with my own chickens. They are terminally stupid). If so, at what level of intelligence does an animal become taboo?


Maybe I was mistaken about your argument, but you had mentioned that their desire to survive was mostly instinctual, and I was just pointing out that they are capable of more than just instinct.


Also, out of curiosity, are you a vegetarian?

Nope. I'll admit that I like meat, though I will aknowledget hat what I eat is a combination of what I like the taste of and a societal distaste for eating our pets. Then again, I would draw the line at eating something that has been proven to be intelligent, like dolphins and apes.

[Smokering]

I didn't think it was necessary.
Well, er, I can't engage with an argument you haven't presented.

Maybe I was mistaken about your argument, but you had mentioned that their desire to survive was mostly instinctual, and I was just pointing out that they are capable of more than just instinct.
Even in humans, the desire to survive is basically instinctual--even a suicidal person will reflexively duck from a blow, or blink when dust hits his eye. The body takes care of itself.

Humans do have other reasons for wishing to live, but I'm not sure any of them would be shared by dogs. I find it difficult to believe that a dog, when faced with a man holding a club, would think 'Aieee, my wife and children!' or 'I have so much left to live for'. Of course, if you have any evidence to the contrary, you are welcome to present it.

Nope. I'll admit that I like meat, though I will aknowledget hat what I eat is a combination of what I like the taste of and a societal distaste for eating our pets. Then again, I would draw the line at eating something that has been proven to be intelligent, like dolphins and apes.
Again I ask--why, and what's the cutoff? Cows aren't entirely stupid, surely? Lambs can be trained to do all manner of tricks. I don't have a problem with your diet being somewhat illogical (mine is--I have an aversion to eating animals such as deer, rabbit and kangaroo, for NO good moral or even societal reason whatsoever); but I find it curious that you're attempting to present a moral argument when there seems to be no basis for it under your carnivorous worldview. A vegetarian argument I can understand, but you seem to be making rather arbitrary distinctions between edible and inedible critters.

[Nicholas]

Well, er, I can't engage with an argument you haven't presented.


I wasn't really trying to argue a point, per say. I was more trying to illustrate my disagreement.


Even in humans, the desire to survive is basically instinctual--even a suicidal person will reflexively duck from a blow, or blink when dust hits his eye. The body takes care of itself.

Humans do have other reasons for wishing to live, but I'm not sure any of them would be shared by dogs. I find it difficult to believe that a dog, when faced with a man holding a club, would think 'Aieee, my wife and children!' or 'I have so much left to live for'. Of course, if you have any evidence to the contrary, you are welcome to present it.


This is true, but on the other hand how do we explain animals that would put themselves in danger to save their offspring or even a member of their perceived pack? It is probably partly due to an instinct that exists in social animals, but is that all that there is to it?


Again I ask--why, and what's the cutoff? Cows aren't entirely stupid, surely? Lambs can be trained to do all manner of tricks. I don't have a problem with your diet being somewhat illogical (mine is--I have an aversion to eating animals such as deer, rabbit and kangaroo, for NO good moral or even societal reason whatsoever); but I find it curious that you're attempting to present a moral argument when there seems to be no basis for it under your carnivorous worldview. A vegetarian argument I can understand, but you seem to be making rather arbitrary distinctions between edible and inedible critters.

Honestly, I don't know where the cutoff is. I do know that I don't like the idea of eating dogs. I would be against eating animals like dolphins, whales, and great apes beause they can be shown to be very intelligent and likely self-aware. Animals like chickens aren't very intelligent and so I have less of a problem. Animals that are in between and is more difficult to determine which is smarter, I don't really have a more logical reason for choosing, but it is likely more emotional than anything. Animals like cows, dogs, and pigs, I really can't say it's moral or immoral to eat one or the other, but other than the fact that I wouldn't like to eat a dog I can't really say much.

[JusticeMachine]

Are you seriously comparing dogs to crickets?

What I am doing it trying to find out where the line is drawn. If the man has fed the snake rabbits, would he still be in trouble? If he fed the snake a hampster or a rat, would he still be in trouble? If he fed it a small calf, would he still be in trouble?

[Nicholas]

What I am doing it trying to find out where the line is drawn. If the man has fed the snake rabbits, would he still be in trouble? If he fed the snake a hampster or a rat, would he still be in trouble? If he fed it a small calf, would he still be in trouble?

You said crickets before...

[JusticeMachine]

You said crickets before...

Correct, I am expanding the debate. What criteria is used to determine if an animal is eligible to be consumed either by myself, or a pet snake?

It really revolves around animal rights, but most animal rights activists (not saying you are one) put all animals (humans included) on the same level as far as value goes.

[Sparko]

If you kill a dog it is somehow murder ... If you kill thousands of cows it's an industry?

Cows don't usually lick their own rear ends or eat poop.

[Nicholas]

Correct, I am expanding the debate. What criteria is used to determine if an animal is eligible to be consumed either by myself, or a pet snake?

It really revolves around animal rights, but most animal rights activists (not saying you are one) put all animals (humans included) on the same level as far as value goes.

Didn't I just go through this discussion?

[Timothy Leary]

Why is this illegal?

You know, that completely and totally disgusts me - and I almost agreed with it for a moment.
But then I thought this: "would I have been so disgusted if the opposite was done?" (i.e. the snake used to feed the dog). And my answer was "no".

Perhaps there ought to be some regulations to insure that their deaths are as quick and painless as possible, but other than that I see no reason why one animal should be considered more important than another animal. As long as their deaths are done as "humanely" - for lack of a better word - as possible, I don't see why I could object without being hypocritical.

[gharfish]

As long as their deaths are done as "humanely" - for lack of a better word - as possible, I don't see why I could object without being hypocritical.Yes, pweese. Jus make it a very quick deep cut to my jugular, 'kay ? (May I have a last meal ?)

[Timothy Leary]

Yes, pweese. Jus make it a very quick deep cut to my jugular, 'kay ? (May I have a last meal ?)

Have you ever killed a fly?
Squashed an ant?
Smashed a spider?

What's the difference?

[Sparko]

Have you ever killed a fly?
Squashed an ant?
Smashed a spider?

What's the difference?

They are teeny and don't make a big mess. Ever step on a dog? You are likely to get your leg bitten.

[Nicholas]

Have you ever killed a fly?
Squashed an ant?
Smashed a spider?

What's the difference?

I'm going to have to strongly disagree with you here. A dog is a very different animal from an insect or an arachnid.

And while I admit my reaction is based on an emotional connection to dogs (and the fact that my dogs are dachshunds), I have to say this. I just can't see myself killing a dog, I just can't. If it makes me a hypocrite to value dogs more than cattle, so be it, I just can't imagine someone killing a dog like that without thinking it's somehow wrong. Everyone is a hypocrite in some way, and if this one of my illogical positions, I can live with it.

[Timothy Leary]

They are teeny and don't make a big mess. Ever step on a dog? You are likely to get your leg bitten.
The same can be true of cows.
Ask anyone who's cowtipped a bull, or an angry mother.

[Smokering]

Honestly, I don't know where the cutoff is. I do know that I don't like the idea of eating dogs. I would be against eating animals like dolphins, whales, and great apes beause they can be shown to be very intelligent and likely self-aware. Animals like chickens aren't very intelligent and so I have less of a problem. Animals that are in between and is more difficult to determine which is smarter, I don't really have a more logical reason for choosing, but it is likely more emotional than anything. Animals like cows, dogs, and pigs, I really can't say it's moral or immoral to eat one or the other, but other than the fact that I wouldn't like to eat a dog I can't really say much.
I don't disagree with that. :) As long as you're not posing it as a moral issue ('eating dogs is evil'), I tend to agree with what you're saying. I don't even know why my own meat-related scruples are what they are--a rabbit is about as cute as a pig or a chicken, in my mind, and certainly not an endangered species. I just don't like the thought of eating one.

[gharfish]

I thought hippies were very peaceful plant-munching (and smoking) types. But, I guess if half southern redneck.....?

[Nicholas]

I don't disagree with that. :) As long as you're not posing it as a moral issue ('eating dogs is evil'), I tend to agree with what you're saying. I don't even know why my own meat-related scruples are what they are--a rabbit is about as cute as a pig or a chicken, in my mind, and certainly not an endangered species. I just don't like the thought of eating one.

Agreed :smile:

[aardvarkcore]

There are also other reasons some go vegetarian/vegan for health reasons is a biggie but one of the biggest reasons besides this whole "meat is murder" type argument is that it is very good for environment (which is arguable).

I personally eat meat but rather having an alternative, tofu is this best thing out! (better than dog meat at least haha)

[JusticeMachine]

:lol: I thought hippies were very peaceful plant-munching (and smoking) types. But, I guess if half southern redneck.....?

Hippies are a very peaceful plant-munching (and smoking) type, but the don't taste very good. I was checking in my Hannibal Lecter cook book and there aren't even any good recepies for them.

However, my dog is smarter that most of them.

[gharfish]

I wonder if there'd be a western market for tender melt in your mouth monkey chips in a pita bread--say, packed neatly into a microwavable hot pocket ? My wife says they are considered sort of as pests in many parts of (her native) India, hanging around in numbers and bothering the tourists to no end; can be really annoyingly loud and very rowdy at times. They're no better than ill-tempered street bums.

So, sneak the more aggressive ones out of the country; kidnap just a quarter of the biggest kind that share the many many outer temple areas, carefully keeping the sensitive Hindus in the dark about the matter. Breed the fittest ones, getting up well their numbers in captivity. Shoot, with a little conveyor belt style training in good factories we could build for them, and with their natural tool handling skills put to use, they'd probably be up to humanely 'preparing' themselves for us ! Out of sight and mind Lean Cuisined.....the slow ones could hose off the killing floors.

If we in turn targeted certain parts of Asia with our left-over monkey by-product meal, then our companion animal cat and dog counterparts in the exotic far East might be eaten in fewer numbers. They'd still be harvested for their fur though. Aw, damit !

[Timothy Leary]

I thought hippies were very peaceful plant-munching (and smoking) types. But, I guess if half southern redneck.....?

mostly, but i don't see anything wrong with meat eating. As long as the animals are killed "humanely", then I'm fine. Maybe that's the redneck side of me coming out *shrugs*

[JusticeMachine]

I wonder if there'd be a western market for tender melt in your mouth monkey chips in a pita bread--say, packed neatly into a microwavable hot pocket ? My wife says they are considered sort of as pests in many parts of (her native) India, hanging around in numbers and bothering the tourists to no end; can be really annoyingly loud and very rowdy at times. They're no better than ill-tempered street bums.




Okay, now let's be serious. Monkey hot pockets is just wrong Wrong WRONG.................could you get them honey glazed? I mean maybe if they were honey glazed it wouldn't be quite so wrong.

[gharfish]

mostly, but i don't see anything wrong with meat eating. As long as the animals are killed "humanely", then I'm fine. Maybe that's the redneck side of me coming out *shrugs*Are you really a redneck ?! 'Where you from' !

[gharfish]

Okay, now let's be serious. Monkey hot pockets is just wrong Wrong WRONG.................could you get them honey glazed? I mean maybe if they were honey glazed it wouldn't be quite so wrong.Hmm. Well, is honey glazing doable in a TV dinner ? Might dry up and get real sticky too thick.

[Timothy Leary]

Are you really a redneck ?! 'Where you from' !
Utah

[gharfish]

I'm from Texas.

[Timothy Leary]

I'm from Texas.
...a texan opposed to hunting~!?

anywho, my perspective is essentially that of many native americans - hunting is alright, etc. but respect the animal, torture etc. is a no-no, and don't kill it if you aren't going to use all of it.

[gharfish]

A Texan can't be opposed to hunting, because he is a Texan (?) And "torturing, etc., of the animal" in the hunt ? If you mean as a part of that that One shot=One kill; it surely doesn't work that way in sport hunting. So I think we agree there.

I can understand what a "hippie" is if that is a 1960's attitude thing. But, what is a modern-day "redneck" ?