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Transgender boy (girl?) wins Texas hish school wrestling championship

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  • Transgender boy (girl?) wins Texas hish school wrestling championship

    Texas is facing the issue they in reality cannot solve, . . . unless there is a paradigm shift in accepting transgenders the gender of their physiology, and reject the Puritan Victorian view of gender.

    Source: http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/02/27/517491492/17-year-old-transgender-boy-wins-texas-girls-wrestling-championship



    17-Year-Old Transgender Boy Wins Texas Girls' Wrestling Championship

    © Copyright Original Source


  • #2
    Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
    Texas is facing the issue they in reality cannot solve, . . . unless there is a paradigm shift in accepting transgenders the gender of their physiology, and reject the Puritan Victorian view of gender.
    There is no issue, just have biological boys wrestle biological boys, the same with girls. And what is wrong with the Puritan Victorian view of gender? I mean your faith does not accept homosexual behavior - is that too a Puritan Victorian view?

    http://bahai-library.com/compilation_homosexuality_bwc
    Last edited by seer; 02-27-2017, 02:20 PM.
    Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by seer View Post
      There is no issue, just have biological boys wrestle biological boys, the same with girls. And what is wrong with the Puritan Victorian view of gender? I mean your faith does not accept homosexual behavior - is that too a Puritan Victorian view?

      http://bahai-library.com/compilation_homosexuality_bwc
      I think shunyadragon said Ba-bye to Bahai.
      Blog: Atheism and the City

      If your whole worldview rests on a particular claim being true, you damn well better have evidence for it. You should have tons of evidence.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by The Thinker View Post
        I think shunyadragon said Ba-bye to Bahai.
        No, he is still a Bahai, I think...
        Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by seer View Post
          There is no issue, just have biological boys wrestle biological boys, the same with girls. And what is wrong with the Puritan Victorian view of gender? I mean your faith does not accept homosexual behavior - is that too a Puritan Victorian view?

          http://bahai-library.com/compilation_homosexuality_bwc
          The problem occurs in this instance because the "boy" in question is a biological girl, but is receiving hormones (i.e. testosterone) that increases his strength and muscle mass giving "him" an unfair advantage over the non-transitioning girls that "he" is wrestling against. Of course the other girls (mostly their parents) are protesting that it's an unfair advantage (which it is) for someone on male hormones to be allowed to compete against girls.
          "What has the Church gained if it is popular, but there is no conviction, no repentance, no power?" - A.W. Tozer

          "... there are two parties in Washington, the stupid party and the evil party, who occasionally get together and do something both stupid and evil, and this is called bipartisanship." - Everett Dirksen

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Littlejoe View Post
            The problem occurs in this instance because the "boy" in question is a biological girl, but is receiving hormones (i.e. testosterone) that increases his strength and muscle mass giving "him" an unfair advantage over the non-transitioning girls that "he" is wrestling against. Of course the other girls (mostly their parents) are protesting that it's an unfair advantage (which it is) for someone on male hormones to be allowed to compete against girls.
            Yes, it seems terribly unfair.
            Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

            Comment


            • #7
              This is one of the places where I feel transgender rights issues become extremely difficult.

              In general, advocates of transgender rights (myself included) like to note the distinction between biological sex and cultural gender roles. It is argued that one can perfectly recognize one's biology while still identifying with the particular cultural gender role of one's choice.

              However, the division of sports is not a matter of cultural gender. It's a matter of biology. There are biochemical and morphological differences between biological males and females which make it appropriate to split competitions along these lines.

              In general, I think that biological males should compete in Boys'/Men's divisions, while biological females compete in Girl's/Women's divisions. However, the question of testosterone treatments is a very important one.

              In many-- if not most-- competitive sports, testosterone is treated as a regulated substance. My experience is particularly in Mixed Martial Arts, where quite a number of fighters-- including teammates and friends of mine-- have been put under a great bit of scrutiny for excessive testosterone levels. This is a well known issue in both Men's and Women's divisions, and even people who have legitimate medical reasons for high test are often pegged by the USADA or other anti-doping regulators. While I certainly feel compassion for someone like Beggs, the fact of the matter is that testosterone is most certainly a performance enhancer. I absolutely agree with the one father mentioned in the article who objected to Beggs' competing on that basis.
              "[Mathematics] is the revealer of every genuine truth, for it knows every hidden secret, and bears the key to every subtlety of letters; whoever, then, has the effrontery to pursue physics while neglecting mathematics should know from the start he will never make his entry through the portals of wisdom."
              --Thomas Bradwardine, De Continuo (c. 1325)

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Boxing Pythagoras View Post
                In many-- if not most-- competitive sports, testosterone is treated as a regulated substance. My experience is particularly in Mixed Martial Arts, where quite a number of fighters-- including teammates and friends of mine-- have been put under a great bit of scrutiny for excessive testosterone levels. This is a well known issue in both Men's and Women's divisions, and even people who have legitimate medical reasons for high test are often pegged by the USADA or other anti-doping regulators. While I certainly feel compassion for someone like Beggs, the fact of the matter is that testosterone is most certainly a performance enhancer. I absolutely agree with the one father mentioned in the article who objected to Beggs' competing on that basis.
                I have an old school friend who is a professional mountain biker. He was being treated for low testosterone levels, and was working with the local anti-doping agency, keeping them fully notified of the treatment and levels, and applied for medical exemption (and was informed by them that he could keep competing while awaiting the decision).
                The medical exemption was turned down and he stopped the treatment immediately, but for one race his levels were slightly above normal (the treatment he was on does a slow build-up) and got whacked with a two year ban.
                Be watchful, stand firm in the faith, act like men, be strong.
                1 Corinthians 16:13

                "...he [Doherty] is no historian and he is not even conversant with the historical discussions of the very matters he wants to pontificate on."
                -Ben Witherington III

                Comment


                • #9
                  This is a girl who is taking ihormones to win. That is already illegal in every sports league. No conflict at all

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Boxing Pythagoras View Post
                    This is one of the places where I feel transgender rights issues become extremely difficult.

                    In general, advocates of transgender rights (myself included) like to note the distinction between biological sex and cultural gender roles. It is argued that one can perfectly recognize one's biology while still identifying with the particular cultural gender role of one's choice.

                    However, the division of sports is not a matter of cultural gender. It's a matter of biology. There are biochemical and morphological differences between biological males and females which make it appropriate to split competitions along these lines.

                    In general, I think that biological males should compete in Boys'/Men's divisions, while biological females compete in Girl's/Women's divisions. However, the question of testosterone treatments is a very important one.

                    In many-- if not most-- competitive sports, testosterone is treated as a regulated substance. My experience is particularly in Mixed Martial Arts, where quite a number of fighters-- including teammates and friends of mine-- have been put under a great bit of scrutiny for excessive testosterone levels. This is a well known issue in both Men's and Women's divisions, and even people who have legitimate medical reasons for high test are often pegged by the USADA or other anti-doping regulators. While I certainly feel compassion for someone like Beggs, the fact of the matter is that testosterone is most certainly a performance enhancer. I absolutely agree with the one father mentioned in the article who objected to Beggs' competing on that basis.
                    So, in your opinion, Beggs should have to choose whether to continue with transitioning and not competing, OR halt the transitioning hormones in order to continue competing?

                    If so, then I agree with you. Because as you say, (like it or not) Testosterone is a performance enhancer.

                    We can't always have everything we want...
                    "What has the Church gained if it is popular, but there is no conviction, no repentance, no power?" - A.W. Tozer

                    "... there are two parties in Washington, the stupid party and the evil party, who occasionally get together and do something both stupid and evil, and this is called bipartisanship." - Everett Dirksen

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      There's nothing difficult about it, just bar them from competing. Problem solved.
                      "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

                      There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by seer View Post
                        There is no issue, just have biological boys wrestle biological boys, the same with girls. And what is wrong with the Puritan Victorian view of gender? I mean your faith does not accept homosexual behavior - is that too a Puritan Victorian view?

                        http://bahai-library.com/compilation_homosexuality_bwc
                        The Baha'i view is a spiritual law forbidding homosexual acts ONLY. Letters from the Universal House of Justice are clear and specific. The Baha'i Faith does not advocate laws discriminating against homosexuals nor Transgenders in the secular world.

                        Also the Transgender issue is absolutely not an issue in the spiritual laws of the Baha'i Faith concerning homosexuality, and in reality not the subject of this thread.
                        Last edited by shunyadragon; 02-27-2017, 04:57 PM.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by The Thinker View Post
                          I think shunyadragon said Ba-bye to Bahai.
                          Beware of seer's warped view and selective citations concerning evryone or anyone who does not believe as he does. This includes anything concerning science.

                          The Baha'i view is a spiritual law forbidding homosexual acts ONLY. Letters from the Universal House of Justice are clear and specific. The Baha'i Faith does not advocate laws discriminating against homosexuals nor Transgenders in the secular world.

                          Also the Transgender issue is absolutely not an issue in the spiritual laws of the Baha'i Faith concerning homosexuality, and in reality not the subject of this thread.
                          Last edited by shunyadragon; 02-27-2017, 04:59 PM.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Darth Executor View Post
                            There's nothing difficult about it, just bar them from competing. Problem solved.
                            There is a problem here of Discrimination, Equal Rights and Civil Liberties, which are Constitutional issues and again if it was up to some states they would likely still have slaves, and feudal labor practices.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Littlejoe View Post
                              The problem occurs in this instance because the "boy" in question is a biological girl, but is receiving hormones (i.e. testosterone) that increases his strength and muscle mass giving "him" an unfair advantage over the non-transitioning girls that "he" is wrestling against. Of course the other girls (mostly their parents) are protesting that it's an unfair advantage (which it is) for someone on male hormones to be allowed to compete against girls.
                              THe wrestler, of course, did not want to compete against girls. The treatments were medically legal and accepted under the Texas athletic guidelines.

                              Comment

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