Announcement

Collapse

Biblical Ethics 301 Guidelines

This forum is for Christians to discuss ethical issues within Christianity. Non-theists, non-christians, and unorthodox Christians should not post here without first getting permission from the area's moderators.

If you have a question about what's OK and what's not OK, please contact the moderators.


Forum Rules: Here
See more
See less

Imprecatory prayer

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Imprecatory prayer

    An ultra conservative pastor is making waves online after publicly calling for imprecatory prayer against John McCain. While I think few would support this, it does raise the question of how Christians should treat imprecatory prayer. It does, after all, appear in the Psalms. I would personally side with the view that Jesus's ethics leave no room for it under the New Covenant.
    "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

  • #2
    Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
    An ultra conservative pastor is making waves online after publicly calling for imprecatory prayer against John McCain. While I think few would support this, it does raise the question of how Christians should treat imprecatory prayer. It does, after all, appear in the Psalms. I would personally side with the view that Jesus's ethics leave no room for it under the New Covenant.
    Given Paul's rhetoric in various places, notably Galatians, I think there needs to be some other way to interpret and apply those passages other than their being obviated by the change in Covenants.
    Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

    Beige Federalist.

    Nationalist Christian.

    "Everybody is somebody's heretic."

    Social Justice is usually the opposite of actual justice.

    Proud member of the this space left blank community.

    Would-be Grand Vizier of the Padishah Maxi-Super-Ultra-Hyper-Mega-MAGA King Trumpius Rex.

    Justice for Ashli Babbitt!

    Justice for Matthew Perna!

    Arrest Ray Epps and his Fed bosses!

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by NorrinRadd View Post
      Given Paul's rhetoric in various places, notably Galatians, I think there needs to be some other way to interpret and apply those passages other than their being obviated by the change in Covenants.
      But the key word there is rhetoric, which allows for differing interpretations of the statements. I don't think this is enough to overturn a direct commandment from Jesus to pray for one's enemies.
      "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

      Comment


      • #4
        can you give us a link to the story? I haven't heard anything about it.

        In the bible when people prayed against anyone as an enemy, they were praying for justice when they were being oppressed. This happened in the old testament a few time, but in the New Testament Jesus tells us to pray FOR our enemies, to help our neighbors.

        While it is still good to hold people accountable for their sins (as in criminals) we should also pray that they turn to God and become saved.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
          An ultra conservative pastor is making waves online after publicly calling for imprecatory prayer against John McCain. While I think few would support this, it does raise the question of how Christians should treat imprecatory prayer. It does, after all, appear in the Psalms. I would personally side with the view that Jesus's ethics leave no room for it under the New Covenant.
          As we have pointed out to atheists many times, the fact that something appears in the Bible does not indicate God's approval. God never said that we should call down evil on our enemies.
          Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

          Comment


          • #6
            My Momma always said, "be kind to your enemies because you made them!"
            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

            Comment


            • #7
              I still can't find the news story about this preacher. anyone have a link?

              Comment


              • #8
                Why is the pastor in question "ultra conservative" rather than "conservative"? Why is that mentioned at all? His political affiliation doesn't make his actions wrong or right; all it does is smear others who are labeled "ultra conservative" or "conservative" with the same thing.
                Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

                Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
                sigpic
                I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                  An ultra conservative pastor is making waves online after publicly calling for imprecatory prayer against John McCain. While I think few would support this, it does raise the question of how Christians should treat imprecatory prayer. It does, after all, appear in the Psalms. I would personally side with the view that Jesus's ethics leave no room for it under the New Covenant.
                  Link.
                  Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
                    Why is the pastor in question "ultra conservative" rather than "conservative"? Why is that mentioned at all? His political affiliation doesn't make his actions wrong or right; all it does is smear others who are labeled "ultra conservative" or "conservative" with the same thing.
                    Yep. There are the foolish and wicked in all groups - including all the political spectrum.
                    Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Jedidiah View Post
                      As we have pointed out to atheists many times, the fact that something appears in the Bible does not indicate God's approval. God never said that we should call down evil on our enemies.
                      He gave Elijah the power to call down fire on two groups of fifty soldiers sent by a faithless king to inquire of him; only when the third group begged for mercy did the angel of the LORD restrain him from calling down fire on them also. But when James and John asked Jesus if they should call down fire to consume the Samaritans for their lack of hospitality, Jesus rebuked them (but interestingly, did not say they lacked that authority or power).
                      Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

                      Beige Federalist.

                      Nationalist Christian.

                      "Everybody is somebody's heretic."

                      Social Justice is usually the opposite of actual justice.

                      Proud member of the this space left blank community.

                      Would-be Grand Vizier of the Padishah Maxi-Super-Ultra-Hyper-Mega-MAGA King Trumpius Rex.

                      Justice for Ashli Babbitt!

                      Justice for Matthew Perna!

                      Arrest Ray Epps and his Fed bosses!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by NorrinRadd View Post
                        He gave Elijah the power to call down fire on two groups of fifty soldiers sent by a faithless king to inquire of him; only when the third group begged for mercy did the angel of the LORD restrain him from calling down fire on them also. But when James and John asked Jesus if they should call down fire to consume the Samaritans for their lack of hospitality, Jesus rebuked them (but interestingly, did not say they lacked that authority or power).
                        Elijah was given the power to defend himself for God's purpose. This was not just calling down evil on enemies.
                        Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
                          Why is the pastor in question "ultra conservative" rather than "conservative"? Why is that mentioned at all? His political affiliation doesn't make his actions wrong or right; all it does is smear others who are labeled "ultra conservative" or "conservative" with the same thing.
                          I wanted to demonstrate which side it was coming from, as that is relevant (is it a leftist who hates all things Republican?), and "ultra" is to distance him from mainstream conservatives. I figured that would be kind to the majority of posters here.

                          There are no news articles as of yet. I saw it from an acquaintance who posted it and supports the imprecatory prayer.
                          "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                            I wanted to demonstrate which side it was coming from, as that is relevant (is it a leftist who hates all things Republican?), and "ultra" is to distance him from mainstream conservatives. I figured that would be kind to the majority of posters here.

                            There are no news articles as of yet. I saw it from an acquaintance who posted it and supports the imprecatory prayer.
                            This does not seem like you, KG. We do not even know who this guy is, there is no corroboration, and no way to tell if he (assuming this is more than fake new) liberal or conservative. And if this unknown man is in fact an ultra conservative, it does not seem to have any bearing on the issue at all. Liberals and conservatives both are subject to error (if this is indeed error).
                            Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Jedidiah View Post
                              This does not seem like you, KG. We do not even know who this guy is, there is no corroboration, and no way to tell if he (assuming this is more than fake new) liberal or conservative. And if this unknown man is in fact an ultra conservative, it does not seem to have any bearing on the issue at all. Liberals and conservatives both are subject to error (if this is indeed error).
                              I know somebody who is supporting it. The origins of the story don't matter. I simply want to discuss the ethics of imprecatory prayers since it does come up as an issue from time to time (such as when the Rev. Steven Anderson announced his prayers for Obama's death a few years ago http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009...mas-death.html )
                              "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

                              Comment

                              widgetinstance 221 (Related Threads) skipped due to lack of content & hide_module_if_empty option.
                              Working...
                              X