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  • Doubt

    A recent article published by John Piper's "Desiring God" ministry was on the topic of doubt. By and large I found the article helpful, it hits on some good and valid points. I also read some articles in response that equally made some good and valid points. Please read the article and share your thoughts. Please do not share your thoughts unless you've read the article.

    Thank you.

  • #2
    Thought provoking article (and thread). I think that article is the first one I've seen from DesiringGod that I disagreed with.

    One of the most common points when doubt invades is when we face tragedy, whether facing the horrors of war or personal loss. CS Lewis faced doubt when faced with tragedy in life, others have expressed doubt after surveying the things which man has wrought. But that doubt does not always imply a loss of faith. Sometimes they are followed by a deepening of faith. So maybe there is more than just doubt in view when we see a loss of faith.

    Science has been criticized as seeding doubt among the faithful. From Galileo to Darwin and beyond, science has been seen to counter the Word, a counter to faith (how often is faith taken to mean something in opposition to science? I don't think science challenges the certainty of G-d's word, just the certainty of our understanding of G-d's word.

    While I happen to like Aquinas' five proofs, some say that they don't prove much of anything, rather, they justify the belief. So I may hold some doubt about the role of Aquinas' proofs in the faith, but I won't say that that doubt translates to any doubt on Jesus. The Israelites experienced many wondrous miracles, but their doubt was less an uncertainty but a rejection, or a certainty that their G-d would not reject them, their position as members of the tribe was enough to guarantee their position. The doubting of the utility of Aquinas is hardly like the doubting of the Israelites.

    Only sometimes is faith the opposite of doubt. Usually the opposite of doubt is certainty. But I am never comfortable when people are so certain of their position as to equate it with the Lord's position. What should the steadfast and stable standard look like in the Christian? That is the point of the article, a point which it fails; the prayer of "Lord I believe, help my unbelief" is at root a form of doubt, a doubt which is not injurious to the faith.

    What does a steadfast faith look like?

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by simplicio View Post
      Thought provoking article (and thread). I think that article is the first one I've seen from DesiringGod that I disagreed with.

      One of the most common points when doubt invades is when we face tragedy, whether facing the horrors of war or personal loss. CS Lewis faced doubt when faced with tragedy in life, others have expressed doubt after surveying the things which man has wrought. But that doubt does not always imply a loss of faith. Sometimes they are followed by a deepening of faith. So maybe there is more than just doubt in view when we see a loss of faith.

      Science has been criticized as seeding doubt among the faithful. From Galileo to Darwin and beyond, science has been seen to counter the Word, a counter to faith (how often is faith taken to mean something in opposition to science? I don't think science challenges the certainty of G-d's word, just the certainty of our understanding of G-d's word.

      While I happen to like Aquinas' five proofs, some say that they don't prove much of anything, rather, they justify the belief. So I may hold some doubt about the role of Aquinas' proofs in the faith, but I won't say that that doubt translates to any doubt on Jesus. The Israelites experienced many wondrous miracles, but their doubt was less an uncertainty but a rejection, or a certainty that their G-d would not reject them, their position as members of the tribe was enough to guarantee their position. The doubting of the utility of Aquinas is hardly like the doubting of the Israelites.

      Only sometimes is faith the opposite of doubt. Usually the opposite of doubt is certainty. But I am never comfortable when people are so certain of their position as to equate it with the Lord's position. What should the steadfast and stable standard look like in the Christian? That is the point of the article, a point which it fails; the prayer of "Lord I believe, help my unbelief" is at root a form of doubt, a doubt which is not injurious to the faith.

      What does a steadfast faith look like?
      proud of their weak faith to wake up and realize that this is not the life or mentality that the Lord has called us to.

      Comment


      • #4

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        • #5
          I think there is something to be said about not voicing your doubt publically. Leading others to doubt the same way you do. We have a responsibility to weaker brothers. I've sometimes done it to small social circles of strong Christian friends when I've struggled with the Faith.

          I think if you've struggled with something for a while you can develop a bitterness about it, a sneer, a grumbling about God. There's a line between voicing your grief with your friends, or your struggles, and letting out little snide asides. Or chucklingly admit that you don't buy the whole thing about homosexuality being a sin, and doing so to a sunday school class.

          One person is struggling to overcome their doubt and working with God's grace, the other has given up. The latter is definitely dishonouring God. If the former is also dishonouring God, its only within the confines of ordinary ways we humans dishonour God. Its not heroic, or honouring to Him, but I think God will show mercy.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Scrawly View Post
            A recent article published by John Piper's "Desiring God" ministry was on the topic of doubt. By and large I found the article helpful, it hits on some good and valid points. I also read some articles in response that equally made some good and valid points. Please read the article and share your thoughts. Please do not share your thoughts unless you've read the article.

            Thank you.
            We believe that God, from all eternity, in order to display the full extent of His glory for the eternal and ever-increasing enjoyment of all who love Him, did, by the most wise and holy counsel of His will, freely and unchangeably ordain and foreknow whatever comes to pass. (, 3.1)*

            Consequently, the implications concerning faith and doubt in Calvinistic thought are as follows:
            https://www.desiringgod.org/affirmation-of-faith>.
            Last edited by The Remonstrant; 01-11-2018, 06:52 PM.
            For Neo-Remonstration (Arminian/Remonstrant ruminations): <https://theremonstrant.blogspot.com>

            Comment


            • #7

              Comment


              • #8
                For Neo-Remonstration (Arminian/Remonstrant ruminations): <https://theremonstrant.blogspot.com>

                Comment


                • #9

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Morse would say that the theological implications I have drawn pertain to the secret, all-encompassing, decretivepreceptive will, however, God does not desire believers to doubt. When we come back to the issue relating to why some believers harbour grave doubts in God and his promises, the answer is not complex: Calvinistic thought maintains that God decreed it to be so.
                    Last edited by The Remonstrant; 01-13-2018, 12:22 PM.
                    For Neo-Remonstration (Arminian/Remonstrant ruminations): <https://theremonstrant.blogspot.com>

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      It is doubtful that others will leave further responses on this thread (except, perhaps, after this one).
                      For Neo-Remonstration (Arminian/Remonstrant ruminations): <https://theremonstrant.blogspot.com>

                      Comment

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