Does anyone else feel like an alien when it comes to other people?

[Thoughtful Monk]

I've been thinking about the thread title. I guess feeling disconnected from other people is somewhat a normal experience everyone has. It be worse as a Christian because we have different values than what the world practices. It's only human to feel different when you don't fit into the crowd.

Maybe the saddest part of this thread is other Christians don't get it. You would think they would be a little more understanding because they have gone through it. Like everyone else, they're human and fail. I think we need to stop thinking every Christian is a trained therapist or for that matter a properly discipled Christian. To paraphrase Admiral Beatty at the Battle of Jutland, "Something is wrong with our churches" but now I'm going off-topic so I'll stop here.

[footwasher]

I've been thinking about the thread title. I guess feeling disconnected from other people is somewhat a normal experience everyone has. It be worse as a Christian because we have different values than what the world practices. It's only human to feel different when you don't fit into the crowd.

Maybe the saddest part of this thread is other Christians don't get it. You would think they would be a little more understanding because they have gone through it. Like everyone else, they're human and fail. I think we need to stop thinking every Christian is a trained therapist or for that matter a properly discipled Christian. To paraphrase Admiral Beatty at the Battle of Jutland, "Something is wrong with our churches" but now I'm going off-topic so I'll stop here.

When Paul saw the altar erected to honor an unknown god, he felt empathy for the Athenians: their problem was a common one. Not only did they not have the answers, they did not even know what the question needed to be.

We can feel alienated, or we can understand their problem and try to help out:

Matthew 9:36When he saw the crowds, he had compassion on them, because they were
harassed and helpless, like sheep without a shepherd.

[Maranatha]

How do we know that the Spirit is the source, the motive power behind our good works?

Indeed, how do you know.

Not being a believer until early adulthood, the difference was stark.

And btw, you are not saved by works, so why look to it?

[footwasher]

Indeed, how do you know?

Not being a believer until early adulthood, the difference was stark.

And btw, you are not saved by works, so why look to it?

The New Testament was written two thousand years ago. Certain promises were made, about benefits, attached to terms and conditions. The probability of not getting the message right is quite high, so it makes sense to make lots of effort to ensure that that doesn’t happen. Unfortunately, because of losing the original context, most of the puzzlement arising, for about one and a half millenia led to wrong questions being asked.

Thankfully, new material has been discovered that clears enough confusion, so that we do have a better idea about the matter. Now the task is not to ask the same questions facing the theologians of the sixteenth century. We have to, instead, ask the questions facing those who heard the message in the first century. God’s plan of rescue was beginning to work, just not in the way believers were expecting. That is what most of the New Testament is dealing with.

Works by which we are not saved does not mean human effort. In different places, works means different things. In James 2, the idea is that faith has got two components. One is the promise to be loyal to God. The second is to prove it, when you hear God’s voice:

Hebrews 3:7Therefore, just as the Holy Spirit says,
“TODAY IF YOU HEAR HIS VOICE,
8DO NOT HARDEN YOUR HEARTS AS WHEN THEY PROVOKED ME,
AS IN THE DAY OF TRIAL IN THE WILDERNESS,
9WHERE YOUR FATHERS TRIED Me BY TESTING Me,
AND SAW MY WORKS FOR FORTY YEARS.
10“THEREFORE I WAS ANGRY WITH THIS GENERATION,
AND SAID, ‘THEY ALWAYS GO ASTRAY IN THEIR HEART,
AND THEY DID NOT KNOW MY WAYS’;
11AS I SWORE IN MY WRATH,
‘THEY SHALL NOT ENTER MY REST.’”

[Christianbookworm]

Hello, I request that people not debate in my thread. Please start a new thread if you wish to discuss the thread derail topic further.

[footwasher]

Hello, I request that people not debate in my thread. Please start a new thread if you wish to discuss the thread derail topic further.

You brought us back here with post #73!

[Thoughtful Monk]

Still can't wait for the new Creation. I desire to see Jesus face to face. In a glorified body.

I think that desire explains a lot. You are aware that this world is not as God intended it to be and no amount of patching will fix it. So no wonder you don't feel comfortable in this world, you recognize you belong somewhere else.

[Christianbookworm]

Hmm... maybe I should explain my joke. I don't mean alien in the sense that Paul uses it. I'm essentially saying that if I had superpowers, I'd so be Super girl. Don't know why Superman gets called a Christ figure. If that fictional farmboy reporter is a Christ figure, every Christian that is serious about following Jesus is a Christ figure. And we don't need super powers to help others.

[footwasher]

Hmm... maybe I should explain my joke. I don't mean alien in the sense that Paul uses it. I'm essentially saying that if I had superpowers, I'd so be Super girl. Don't know why Superman gets called a Christ figure. If that fictional farmboy reporter is a Christ figure, every Christian that is serious about following Jesus is a Christ figure. And we don't need super powers to help others.

Actually, you do. Let's lay out the problem, and then the solution. If you apply it in every situation, from Adam to Ananias and Sapphira, the explanation works.

God created humanity to exist only in union with Himself. The indication that there is unity is when creation keeps bowing down to God, desiring union.

Case 1
Adam was in unity with God. Even the wind and the waves submitted to him. Every time he did something or said something which was supernatural, creation recognised it couldn’t have happened unless God was with him. He could step off a cliff, and angels would make sure that he landed without a scratch. However, he couldn’t test God, do things that didn’t have a witness, an audience, an entity that needed to submit to God which He had brought before Adam and told him about. In other words, he couldn’t do things to use God’s power to feel good or bring praise to himself. He had to do and say only the things God commanded. The ability to do great works was enabled by being in union with God. And being in union with God required Adam to stay away from the knowledge of good and evil, because only the pure can be in God’s presence.


Case 2
Israel was in unity with God, because they were in Christ. Even the wind and the waves submitted to her. Every time she did something or said something which was supernatural, creation recognised it couldn’t have happened unless God was with her. SHe could step off a cliff, and angels would make sure that she landed without a scratch. However, she couldn’t test God, do things that didn’t have a witness, an audience, an entity that needed to submit to God which He had brought before her and told her about. In other words, she couldn’t do things to use God’s power to feel good or bring praise to herself. sHe had to do and say only the things God commanded. So when she went out to fight Canaan even when God had not commanded it, she was testing God.

The ability to do great works was enabled by being in union with God. And being in union with God required Israel to believe that God would always protect her when she picked up a cross, did something dangerous, so that when someone saw it, like Rahab, that person would repent, stop serving self interest and begin to serve God. This was how Israel was supposed to be a blessing to the world: turning it from self destructive life to constructive life.

We can say that Israel had to believe that God could rescue always, be loyal, to be in union with God, because only the pure can be in God’s presence.

Case 3
Jesus was in unity with God. Even the wind and the waves submitted to him. Every time he did something or said something which was supernatural, creation, including Nicodemus and the Samaritan woman, recognised it couldn’t have happened unless God was with him. He could step off a roof top, and angels would make sure that He landed without a scratch. However, He couldn’t test God, do things that didn’t have a witness, an audience, an entity that needed to submit to God, which He had brought before Jesus and told Him about. In other words, He couldn’t do things to use God’s power to feel good or bring praise to Himself. He had to do and say only the things God commanded. The ability to do great works was enabled by being in union with God. God was like the Green Lantern’s lantern. And being in union with God required Jesus to always believe God would rescue Him, whenever He fed bread to the world, and especially at Calvary, when He gave a powerful presentation of God’s union with Himself, the wedding feast, so that when He was resurrected, He drew the whole world to God.

[Christianbookworm]

That last paragraph sounds like the adoptionist heresy to me. Aka the "Jesus is Green Lantern" heresy. Funny how superheroes make great analogies for Christological heresies.

[footwasher]

That last paragraph sounds like the adoptionist heresy to me. Aka the "Jesus is Green Lantern" heresy. Funny how superheroes make great analogies for Christological heresies.

The Green Lantern heresy claims Jesus was a human, adopted by God, like the Green Lantern. I never did that. I only said Jesus needed to be near the source of His super power till He entered Rest. Which He created when He went to the cross:

Hebrews 5:8Though he were a Son, yet {i} learned he obedience by the things which he suffered.

By entering Rest, you too can have super powers, rest from your own labors. You think people will be subdued without a display of power? Well the record shows otherwise. Read about Rahab and Nicodemus, what they said.

[Christianbookworm]

Why are you talking to me like a milk fed infant? I merely felt like venting. Not engaging in "preaching to the xlchoir" conversations.

[footwasher]

Why are you talking to me like a milk fed infant? I merely felt like venting. Not engaging in "preaching to the xlchoir" conversations.

Last I heard, it's a free country. Go ahead and vent, I'll go ahead and reduce the misinformation!

[Christianbookworm]

[Christianbookworm]

Chiefsinner, I am requesting that you take your technobabble elsewhere. Please commence to no longer participating in this thread.