Is there a natural language?

[Sparko]

But maybe they did in the same way that babies do when they begin speaking. It could be that the first human made random noises that eventually developed into a series of noises, which became the first speech?

or it could be that God made man with a language. After all, how did Adam talk to God or Eve?

[Zeluvia]

Women invented language.

Men were perfectly happy with gestures and clicking noises, and imitating animal sounds, and other bodily noises.

I would say that there is no natural language beyond a template for interpretative sounds, that all animals have. A similar template probably exists for body language.

But I do remember reading somewhere that the clicking languages are some of the oldest linguistically.

[Teluog]

or it could be that God made man with a language. After all, how did Adam talk to God or Eve?

Clicking noises? Or maybe they developed the language starting from baby noises.

God could have made them with a pre-installed language no doubt, but I'm not sure if Genesis is clear enough to conclude that Adam n Eve communicated with each other verbally, or can we?

[FreezBee]

Clicking noises? Or maybe they developed the language starting from baby noises.

God could have made them with a pre-installed language no doubt, but I'm not sure if Genesis is clear enough to conclude that Adam n Eve communicated with each other verbally, or can we?

No, I think that Adam just clubbed Eve until she did what he wanted.

But supposedly Adam came up with the names of animals, so apparently he was able to make some sounds.


- FreezBee

[FreezBee]

Women invented language.

Men were perfectly happy with gestures and clicking noises, and imitating animal sounds, and other bodily noises.

Actually, in my humble experience women appear in general to be perfectly happy with grunts and, at best, words expressing aggressivity.

I would say that there is no natural language beyond a template for interpretative sounds, that all animals have. A similar template probably exists for body language.

But I do remember reading somewhere that the clicking languages are some of the oldest linguistically.

And now, how would we know that? How many 100.000+ years old records do we have?


- FreezBee

[Sparko]

Clicking noises? Or maybe they developed the language starting from baby noises.

God could have made them with a pre-installed language no doubt, but I'm not sure if Genesis is clear enough to conclude that Adam n Eve communicated with each other verbally, or can we?

huh? If you actually read genesis you can be sure. If you choose to reject it then you can believe whatever you wish.

[Teluog]

huh? If you actually read genesis you can be sure. If you choose to reject it then you can believe whatever you wish.

I was actually too lazy to check it that day, since I was pretty sick and tired

[FreezBee]

Just found this article: The Piraha challenge: an Amazonian tribe takes grammar to a strange place.

It is about the language of the Piraha people in South America. The Piraha have a language as complex as other languages, yet they lack words for abstractions.

According to the article:

above link

Everett expected criticism. His findings challenge the influential theory that all spoken languages draw on common grammatical rules. Proponents of that premise believe that the human brain comes equipped with grammar networks, as a biological consequence of Stone Age evolution.

Instead, Everett champions an approach that held sway in the first half of the 20th century. Influential anthropologists and linguists of that era argued that cultural values mold how people talk, just as a language's expressive power shapes a culture's traits. If that's the case, basic elements of grammar can differ from one culture to the next, and cultural and social forces continually alter the fundamental rules of language.

© source where applicable

- FreezBee

[Zeluvia]

Interesting = )

[FreezBee]

Interesting = )

I knew, you'd like it

- FreezBee

[Paintbucket]

That's a pretty neat article. I think we should dumb down civilization so I don't have to learn as many words, kind of like an Orwellian Newspeak.

[Sparko]

words bad. pearls good. give pirate pearls.

[JHardin]

I apologize if this has already been mentioned, but it would seem logical that the most complex of all spoken languages should also the be the original spoken language. Over time, other variations of that original spoken language will have dropped words of phrases, or will have simplified phrases by compounding words,

I'm not a linguistics expert, it's just a thought.

[greentwiga]

Actually, JHardin, you are not far off in your idea. Trade languages all follow certain simple rules. They are what might be called natural languages. All languages get more complex over time. Arabic is one of the hardest. Scholars say 3 year olds have a reasonable mastery of a trade language, 5 years olds have a reasonable mastery of English, but it isn't until 7 that they have a reasonable mastery of Arabic. I don't know the criteria they used.
Another way of determining how ancient a language is, is to analyze all the cognate languages for the most stable words, such as ma (mother). That is how they determined that the IndoEuropean languages originated near the Caucasus. Semitic languages could have originated in Kurdish territories. Similar versions of both techniques are used in genetic analysis.

[JHardin]

Actually, JHardin, you are not far off in your idea. Trade languages all follow certain simple rules. They are what might be called natural languages. All languages get more complex over time. Arabic is one of the hardest. Scholars say 3 year olds have a reasonable mastery of a trade language, 5 years olds have a reasonable mastery of English, but it isn't until 7 that they have a reasonable mastery of Arabic. I don't know the criteria they used.
Another way of determining how ancient a language is, is to analyze all the cognate languages for the most stable words, such as ma (mother). That is how they determined that the IndoEuropean languages originated near the Caucasus. Semitic languages could have originated in Kurdish territories. Similar versions of both techniques are used in genetic analysis.

Very interesting.