Shrike Team #6: Island of Conflict

[Little Shepherd]

Yeah, the explanation for Sk'lan host pregnancy made me wince a bit, and I'm not even a biology major. After conception, the parent's genetic material can no longer affect the child's genes, so as long as they fertilize first, then implant, the worries about genetic contamination are laughable.

[Abykale]

After conception, the parent's genetic material can no longer affect the child's genes, so as long as they fertilize first, then implant, the worries about genetic contamination are laughable.

Actually, I seem to recall something about babies having small numbers of maternal cells, and vice versa.

*Googles*

Yep.

http://www.nasw.org/users/ccmorton/globesamplemay2001.html

Though countless sons and daughters will present mothers with cards that promise to keep Mom in their hearts this Sunday, the truth, alas, is far less poetic. More likely, some of Mom is careening around their bloodstreams, while tiny bits of the children may well be stored in Mom's spleen.
It turns out that the bonds between a mother and her child are not merely psychological or even genetic: During pregnancy, the mother and the fetus literally exchange cells, leaving identifiable bits and pieces of the child inside the mother - and vice versa - for decades after birth.

© source where applicable

[Raphael]

Yeah, the explanation for Sk'lan host pregnancy made me wince a bit, and I'm not even a biology major. After conception, the parent's genetic material can no longer affect the child's genes, so as long as they fertilize first, then implant, the worries about genetic contamination are laughable.

You're assuming that the Sk'lan's class prejudices are rational.

The lower castes would basically be considered untouchables (like the ones in India), and the higher castes would fear contamination from merely being associated with them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dalit

wikipedia

In the context of traditional Hindu society, Dalit [untouchables] status has often been historically associated with occupations regarded as ritually impure, such as any occupation involving killing, handling of animal cadavers or night soil (human feces). One million Dalits work as manual scavengers, cleaning latrines and sewers by hand and clearing away dead animals.[9] Engaging in these activities was considered to be polluting to the individual who performed them, and this pollution was considered to be 'contagious'. As a result, Dalits were commonly banned and segregated from full participation in Hindu social life (they could not enter the premises of a temple or a school and stay/ed outside the village), while elaborate precautions were sometimes observed to prevent incidental contact between Dalits and other Hindus.

© source where applicable

[Mr Minder]

So, unless Felicity and Precog will get some sort of "abortion-escape plan", will Precog give birth to little S'klans eventually?

I'm not sure...

On another matter, time for a lame wordplay! I noticed that Felicity's heroic identity name, Sonica, sounds and spells like a Swedish word: sonika. However, when 'sonika' is used in conversational language it is always used in conjuction with the word 'helt'. With both words used in a sentence it can sound like this:

"Hon stack iväg helt sonika!"

Translated into English, it roughly means:

"She went off without much ado!"/"She simply went off!"

Personally I prefer the latter sentence before the former since it sounds more like what an English-speaking person would use in conversational language.

Anyway, just so you know (despite this fact doesn't affect you in any way): Sonica resembles 'sonika', which used in conjunction with the word 'helt' can be translated into either 'without much ado' or 'simply'.

[Little Shepherd]

So, unless Felicity and Precog will get some sort of "abortion-escape plan", will Precog give birth to little S'klans eventually?

I'm not sure...

She did it 3 times before, so there's no reason it couldn't happen a 4th time. I don't think she said she was currently pregnant, though. Just that she'd been used for that purpose 3 times already.

[Mr Minder]

And that means that Precog isn't necessarily with children. Got it. But I wonder how the S'klan have gotten around the infertility problem that exists between - at most - all races on Hearthstone? I don't understand the science behind the fertilization and implantation.

[jpholding]

Odd that this didn't occur to me until today. Not that there's anything you can do about it at this point. Just know that there might be some biology majors wincing . . .

Heck, they'd probably wince just at the very idea of my anthropomorphs...

Yeah, the explanation for Sk'lan host pregnancy made me wince a bit, and I'm not even a biology major. After conception, the parent's genetic material can no longer affect the child's genes, so as long as they fertilize first, then implant, the worries about genetic contamination are laughable.

Raphael is correct -- the Sk'lan are not being rational. They aren't -- no more so than Nazi Master Race theorists were. The issue here is much as Raphael noted -- ritual purity taken to an extreme level.


Miko, someone once noted that this idea I'm using was similar to one called an axolotl tank used in Frank Herbert (?).

[Mr Minder]

"Axolotl tank"... yeahhhhhhhhh...

Oh, by the way, I haven't said this yet: very nice update, JPH. Will be interesting with such a pessimistic character introduced now.

[TolkienFan]

Originally posted by MikO von Mirtos

And that means that Precog isn't necessarily with children. Got it. But I wonder how the S'klan have gotten around the infertility problem that exists between - at most - all races on Hearthstone? I don't understand the science behind the fertilization and implantation.

Well, maybe JP will explain that at some point. But I think that when you get Tilkrigs working on this subject constantly (as has no doubt happened), you'll eventually find some kind of solution.

Of course, that's the completely simplistic explanation. Maybe JP (or one of his scientific advisors) will explain later.

[Raphael]

As I understand it inter-special breeding no longer works because fertilization is no-longer possible between the species.

If however the S'klan are are taking the eggs from another species and inserting their DNA into the nucleus (in a vaguely similar methods to how cloning works) then implanting that into the womb, then it is plausible, especially if the "breeders" are pumped with enough immune suppressors.

EDA:
Alternatively S'klan females of a high enough caste to be affected by the inability to breed when becoming too teched out could have their eggs harvested and frozen for reproduction later (and similarly the males could have their sperm harvested and frozen. This would then mean that the "breeders" are merely acting as a womb, and if pumped with enough immune suppressors (or perhaps a specialised immune suppressor as the S'klan will want them to remain relatively healthy during the pregnancy) should avoid the immediate rejection of the embryo.

As TF noted the Tilkrig are smart enough to have figured a solution for the S'klan

NOTE: I am no geneticist so I'm sure I'm ignoring lots of problems

[Leonhard]

"Axolotl tank"... yeahhhhhhhhh...

For those of you who've never read Frank Sherbert's Dune and its following books, an axolotl tank was a way one group in that universe used to manufacture clones, and later something called Spice. Its never really depicted directly, or explained much, but you can glean that they're women somehow changed to be used for that purpose.

[jpholding]

This would then mean that the "breeders" are merely acting as a womb, and if pumped with enough immune suppressors (or perhaps a specialised immune suppressor as the S'klan will want them to remain relatively healthy during the pregnancy) should avoid the immediate rejection of the embryo.

That's what is happening. I toyed with the idea of the Sk'lan extracting the "best" DNA from other races (such as Tilkrig intelligence factors) but so far don't see that working out since the upper-caste Sk'lan are convinced they're superior already. (IOW, they're a bunch of John Loftuses.)

[Tophet]

the upper-caste Sk'lan are convinced they're superior already. (IOW, they're a bunch of John Loftuses.)

Hey, JP,

Is Loftuscite legal in their country?

[jpholding]

Hey, JP,

Is Loftuscite legal in their country?

It's mandatory, I think.

[TolkienFan]

Originally posted by jpholding

It's mandatory, I think.

You know what you should do JP? You should make a bonus cartoon in which a Sk'lan and Brett or Eidolon get in a debate of some sort. Then we'll be able to really see the effects of Loftuscite.