On information ... I may deeply regret this but ...

[oxmixmudd]

While I can imagine a scenario in which Jorge might be able to make a useful contribution, this ain't it. "Information" has too much inertia for any one scholar, or group of scholars, to budge. Post Shannon, it's a measurable quantity, with actual numbers coming out of long-accepted equations. It's the foundation of a multi-trillion dollar industry, and the stepping board for the launch of a host of affiliated academic disciplines.

I understand. But at the same time, I'm willing to give Jorge the benefit of the doubt. Not because he deserves it by any stretch of the imagination, but just because it's the appropriate thing to do.


Jim

[Juvenal]

I understand. But at the same time, I'm willing to give Jorge the benefit of the doubt. Not because he deserves it by any stretch of the imagination, but just because it's the appropriate thing to do.


Jim

Because he's a fellow Christian?

[oxmixmudd]

Because he's a fellow Christian?

Not really. But rather - and to be totally honest - because he has classed me as a false Christian and deceiver. With such direct personal attacks, and with my commitment to following Christ, I don't have the option of responding any other way.


Jim

[lilpixieofterror]

So Jorge, you're 'expelling' people from your thread?

[One Bad Pig]

Uhmmm ... 'You are off the thread'
Those were all monosyllable words so I can't say it any simpler.

"... attempt to bash someone over the head with it" ...
I'm going to guess that Piggy needs extra fiber in his diet.

As for "winning converts" -- fight fire with fire, I always say.
If you can't stand the heat then the kitchen's the wrong place for you.

Now, kindly stay off this thread. You obviously have NOTHING to
contribute except Jorge-bashing, and I don't need any more of that.

Jorge

I can see you're not interested in winning arguments. You just like flinging monkey poo. One would think that you'd like being bashed, giving you another opportunity to bash back, but apparently you're just a hypocritical bully. If you can find the intestinal fortitude to ask me to leave without a concomitant attempt at bullying, I'll comply. Cheerio.

[Juvenal]

Not really. But rather - and to be totally honest - because he has classed me as a false Christian and deceiver. With such direct personal attacks, and with my commitment to following Christ, I don't have the option of responding any other way.


Jim

Well, that's just as unfortunate, for much the same reason, I think. Here's why. Absent the abuse, or, as suggested earlier, the shared Christianity, would you have any hesitancy in dismissing yet another claim to upcoming foundation-cracking research from a source previously shown to be lacking any meaningful scientific chops, a source so craven and contemptuous of academic integrity he actually bought a PhD.

I don't know, maybe you would.

But I've got $150 that says his research won't pay off.

[oxmixmudd]

Well, that's just as unfortunate, for much the same reason, I think. Here's why. Absent the abuse, or, as suggested earlier, the shared Christianity, would you have any hesitancy in dismissing yet another claim to upcoming foundation-cracking research from a source previously shown to be lacking any meaningful scientific chops, a source so craven and contemptuous of academic integrity he actually bought a PhD.

I don't know, maybe you would.

But I've got $150 that says his research won't pay off.

Well - If you've noticed, I've made it clear that I'm not holding my breath and that my expectations are low. The point is, there is no point in reacting to something that doesn't exist and that we have no knowledge of. Jorge is who Jorge is. There is no reason I have to act like Jorge just because Jorge acts like Jorge. Sooner or later he'll present whatever it is he's come up with and then we will know.


Jim

[Juvenal]

Sooner or later he'll present whatever it is he's come up with and then we will know.

Before or after he comes up with the $150?

[Carrikature]

Not really. But rather - and to be totally honest - because he has classed me as a false Christian and deceiver. With such direct personal attacks, and with my commitment to following Christ, I don't have the option of responding any other way.


Jim

No one here think his claims on such matters have even a shred of merit. There's no reason you should treat them any differently.

[Jorge]

While I can imagine a scenario in which Jorge might be able to make a useful contribution, this ain't it. "Information" has too much inertia for any one scholar, or group of scholars, to budge. Post Shannon, it's a measurable quantity, with actual numbers coming out of long-accepted equations. It's the foundation of a multi-trillion dollar industry, and the stepping board for the launch of a host of affiliated academic disciplines.

There's actually a pearl of truth in your post above. It's the part where you speak of "too much inertia" on how 'information' is viewed. I also recognized that long ago and consider it the greatest obstacle to my work. But there's nothing that I can do about that so ... onward and forward!

FYI, under my work Shannon is merely a subset of generalized 'information'. That does not take away anything from its usefulness and bearing of fruit.

Jorge

[Jorge]

OH - I'm not even close to the 'vilest'. I'm just the one that has gotten under your skin for whatever the reason. Probably because I've called you out on the fact you know your work on asteroid impacts is just plain wrong. People that prick our conscience tend to be the ones that bug us the most - especially if we are not open to having our conscience pricked.

Yeah, I know you want to think of yourself as being in a 'higher status' but you are what you are, O-Mudd. Your comments on my "Craters" paper have never bothered me much because it is obvious that you did not read carefully enough to even begin to grasp what I wrote. As for my conscience: funny thing, specimens like yourself make me think about their conscience (namely, if they have one). I mean, in all these years I have not heard you say ONCE that Biblical Creationists may be right. I still believe that a Biblical Creationist once stole your sweetheart and you will never forgive or forget.

I've not got any 'questions' on information I need answering right now. Why do you suppose I would? You have some agenda associated with this work, you wouldn't be doing it if you didn't. My guess is that what you've done targets some sort of over arching 'proof' evolution can't work (which is silly, it would be like trying to get equations published 'proving' airplanes can't fly) but who knows - again - maybe you have happened upon something useful. I'll wait and see.

Unlike you, I don't have to wait. My multi-year experiences with you prove that there's nothing worth waiting for.

And why do you suppose I would take any questions I might have to you in the first place? I'd much prefer to take them to acknowledged experts in the field. You don't have a very good track record as an 'expert' in any field.

Your 'valuable opinion' and $5.00 will get you a medium-sized popcorn in most movie theaters.
But don't forget the $5.00.

Really, if you want a discussion on some of your ideas, put some of them up for discussion and we (or others) can talk. But I also understand if you want to hold it close till it's published - that would be normal.

At least you got something right. Nope, I'm not yet ready for a discussion. My request for questions was to see if any 'show-stoppers' appeared. I was also looking to see if someone would toss something out that I had not considered. Here? With critters like yourself? Not even close!

Jorge

[Cow Poke]

... a bum steer?

It's a good thing I had already swallowed that mouthful of coffee.

[HMS_Beagle]

There's actually a pearl of truth in your post above. It's the part where you speak of "too much inertia" on how 'information' is viewed. I also recognized that long ago and consider it the greatest obstacle to my work. But there's nothing that I can do about that so ... onward and forward!

FYI, under my work Shannon is merely a subset of generalized 'information'. That does not take away anything from its usefulness and bearing of fruit.

Anyone want to bet that 's latest will be a giant equivocation-fest between the already accepted definitions of "information" and "meaning"? And that there will still be no clear definition of "biological information", just lots of clucking and flying feathers?

[HMS_Beagle]

I was also looking to see if someone would toss something out that I had not considered.

I can list lots of things you've never considered: answering questions honestly, letting the data drive the conclusion and not the other way around, paying off bets you fairly lost. There's three to start.

[Jorge]

Well - If you've noticed, I've made it clear that I'm not holding my breath and that my expectations are low. The point is, there is no point in reacting to something that doesn't exist and that we have no knowledge of. Jorge is who Jorge is. There is no reason I have to act like Jorge just because Jorge acts like Jorge.

Man-oh-man ... just who is that "Jorge" guy?
He sounds like a very, very bad person!
Hearing O-Mudd, one would be led to think that "Jorge" was Beelzebub himself.

See, critters like O-Mudd can only 'elevate' themselves by pushing others DOWN. And those like-minded gobble up his accusations because it also makes them feel 'superior' and 'justified'.

A ex-TWebber sent me a PM upon departing (he couldn't take it any more). In that PM he said words to the effect that he was convinced that some people here were "insane" to some degree. By golly, I think that guy was on to something.

Jorge