Announcement

Collapse

Apologetics 301 Guidelines

If you think this is the area where you tell everyone you are sorry for eating their lunch out of the fridge, it probably isn't the place for you


This forum is open discussion between atheists and all theists to defend and debate their views on religion or non-religion. Please respect that this is a Christian-owned forum and refrain from gratuitous blasphemy. VERY wide leeway is given in range of expression and allowable behavior as compared to other areas of the forum, and moderation is not overly involved unless necessary. Please keep this in mind. Atheists who wish to interact with theists in a way that does not seek to undermine theistic faith may participate in the World Religions Department. Non-debate question and answers and mild and less confrontational discussions can take place in General Theistics.


Forum Rules: Here
See more
See less

Problems and Questions in Atheism

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by JimL View Post
    No wonder that Aquinas, toward the end of his life, wished to burn his books.
    You sure you're not thinking of Franz Kafka? St. Aquinas is said to have had a vision of God after which he considered all his written works like 'straws' in comparison, but I haven't seen anything about him wanting his works to be burned.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Leonhard View Post
      You sure you're not thinking of Franz Kafka? St. Aquinas is said to have had a vision of God after which he considered all his written works like 'straws' in comparison, but I haven't seen anything about him wanting his works to be burned.
      Okay, thats possible, I probably heard or misunderstood in error. But I would have agreed with him if he had wished to burn the quotes of his that J.Martin cited concerning good and evil. Reads like so much high falutin gibberish.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by JimL View Post
        Okay, thats possible, I probably heard or misunderstood in error. But I would have agreed with him if he had wished to burn the quotes of his that J.Martin cited concerning good and evil. Reads like so much high falutin gibberish.
        As a thomist I can tell you that JohnMartin doesn't really get it. He just knows the kinds of words used and just strings them together in an ad hoc fashion.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Leonhard View Post
          As a thomist I can tell you that JohnMartin doesn't really get it. He just knows the kinds of words used and just strings them together in an ad hoc fashion.
          As a self proclaimed Thomist Leonhard rarely provides evidence for his claims to being a Thomist. Leonhard frequently also makes criticisms of my statements without much evidence.

          JM

          Comment


          • Originally posted by JohnMartin View Post
            Aquinas is the universal doctor of the Catholic Church and is well recognised as one of the greatest thinkers in Christian history.

            JM
            I can understand why orthodox Christians hold him in high regard, but I'm not a Christian.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Doug Shaver View Post
              I can understand why orthodox Christians hold him in high regard, but I'm not a Christian.
              The theological system propounded in the summa theologia and summa contra gentiles, along with his many other works is a strong intellectual bulwark for the Catholic faith. It is somethnig to take note of even if you are an unbeliever.

              JM

              Comment


              • Originally posted by JohnMartin View Post
                The theological system propounded in the summa theologia and summa contra gentiles, along with his many other works is a strong intellectual bulwark for the Catholic faith. It is somethnig to take note of even if you are an unbeliever.

                JM
                Taking note of a thinker is one thing. Assuming that the thinker is right is another. I take note that modern Christian apologetics is based on the warmed-over Aristotelianism of Thomas Aquinas. It was very clever of Aquinas to make Aristotle safe for Christian orthodoxy, but I can give him credit for cleverness without supposing that he could not have made any mistakes.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Doug Shaver View Post
                  Taking note of a thinker is one thing. Assuming that the thinker is right is another. I take note that modern Christian apologetics is based on the warmed-over Aristotelianism of Thomas Aquinas. It was very clever of Aquinas to make Aristotle safe for Christian orthodoxy, but I can give him credit for cleverness without supposing that he could not have made any mistakes.
                  You can credit Aquinas with anything, but your opinion carries no weight when your opinion is without evidence.

                  JM

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by JohnMartin View Post
                    You can credit Aquinas with anything, but your opinion carries no weight when your opinion is without evidence.

                    JM
                    My evidence is Edward Feser's book The Last Superstition, which is a defense of the Aristotelian-Thomistic worldview against the so-called New Atheists. His explanation of Aristotle's philosophy and how Aquinas adapted it to Christianity is pretty thorough.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Doug Shaver View Post
                      My evidence is Edward Feser's book The Last Superstition, which is a defense of the Aristotelian-Thomistic worldview against the so-called New Atheists. His explanation of Aristotle's philosophy and how Aquinas adapted it to Christianity is pretty thorough.
                      I hope you enjoyed the read. Feser has an interesing blog. But that's for another discussion at another time.

                      JM

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by JohnMartin View Post
                        I hope you enjoyed the read.
                        I did, and I've been working on an extended critique to post on my own website. It's been slow going, though. My site gets practically no traffic, and it's hard to sustain the motivation to write something lengthy when you know almost nobody is going to read it.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by JohnMartin View Post
                          I've never seen a proof of your assertion. Care to present one?

                          JM
                          I said. ". . . because Natural Law is possibly an uncaused cause."

                          There is no proof either way for an uncaused cause, whether natural or Divine. You have failed to provide a 'proof' for an uncaused cause that is anything other than natural.

                          Still waiting . . .
                          Last edited by shunyadragon; 06-22-2017, 01:49 PM.
                          Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                          Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                          But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                          go with the flow the river knows . . .

                          Frank

                          I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                          Comment

                          Related Threads

                          Collapse

                          Topics Statistics Last Post
                          Started by whag, Yesterday, 03:01 PM
                          14 responses
                          42 views
                          0 likes
                          Last Post tabibito  
                          Started by whag, 03-17-2024, 04:55 PM
                          21 responses
                          129 views
                          0 likes
                          Last Post Hypatia_Alexandria  
                          Started by whag, 03-14-2024, 06:04 PM
                          78 responses
                          411 views
                          0 likes
                          Last Post tabibito  
                          Started by whag, 03-13-2024, 12:06 PM
                          45 responses
                          303 views
                          1 like
                          Last Post Hypatia_Alexandria  
                          Working...
                          X