Why does God need to/want to be worshipped?

[Sparko]

. . . and left the rest of the world in dark concerning the most important message from God, necessary for their salvation.

God doesn't OWE anyone salvation. that is why it is by his MERCY some are saved.

The problem would not change no matter which people God choose, if he choose only one tribe or culture. By the way, god may have revealed his message to the Babylonians through Zoroaster

then your previous objection is invalid, huh?

[rHarryr]

rizdek;

Methinks you presume too much. Concerning your first quote, you presume that I quote a lot of scriptures, second, you presume that what I have to write is an interpretation, third, you presume it is no better or worse than anyone else.

As for your second quote, you presume that I am referring to you

First of all, you won’t know whether what I wrote on my blog has any merit or not if you don’t go there and read what I said. And, then you still won’t know if you don’t do a little research and find out for yourself whether what I said is based on truth or interpretation.

Secondly, I was referring to those that come here, not with an honest desire to learn the truth but, to do everything they can to destroy what little faith a lot of people that do come here looking for answers to help strengthen their faith in GOD and Christ Jesus.

Frankly, this isn’t the place to find answers to those questions. They need to find an Ordained Minister, (Preacher, Pastor, etc…) that turns on lights when they teach scriptures that already read to the point that the one with the question says “I’ve read that, I don’t know how many times, how come I never saw that before” and when they hear it, they know in their heart that it is GODs truth (Gospel) they just heard. If you want the answers you seek, that’s the route you need to go.

Harry

[zorathruster]

Same reasons I need my kids to obey me, so they don't hurt themselves or each other.

And because I pay all the bills and don't hassle with nonsense in the house, because I'm the boss of the house, and they aren't.

What a great father? I'll bet the majority of "obey me children" comes not from a 'don't hurt themselves' perspective and more frequently from a 'I can't deal with this right now' perspective. Children engage in play to simulate future social interactions. They are learning. The more they learn in the house, the better their ability to interact with the real world situations they encounter later in life. If you are really as tyranical as you state, you might reconsider getting a grip and allowing a lot of "nonsense" in the house, whether you pay the bills or not.

[shunyadragon]

God doesn't OWE anyone salvation. that is why it is by his MERCY some are saved.

I never said God owed anybody anything. In your view God chooses to be selective and arbitray concerning who is saved and who is not, and who is informed and who is not.

My view of God reflects the universal, and not clams of a specific.

then your previous objection is invalid, huh?

No, it only demonstrates Biblically he may choose more than on tribe so to speak.

[Sparko]

I never said God owed anybody anything. In your view God chooses to be selective and arbitray concerning who is saved and who is not, and who is informed and who is not.

He is not arbitrary, but he does in fact not owe anyone salvation. he does owe us judgment and damnation because we all are sinners, but he is merciful and allows some to be saved. Those that are not saved, still get what they deserve.

example, if president chooses to pardon a criminal, does that mean he has to pardon ALL criminals or he is unjust?

[shunyadragon]

He is not arbitrary, but he does in fact not owe anyone salvation. he does owe us judgment and damnation because we all are sinners, but he is merciful and allows some to be saved. Those that are not saved, still get what they deserve.

example, if president chooses to pardon a criminal, does that mean he has to pardon ALL criminals or he is unjust?

I am referring to the other uninformed tribes and peoples of the world. Not one person being pardoned , and the other humg by the Presidents order.

[Sparko]

I am referring to the other uninformed tribes and peoples of the world. Not one person being pardoned , and the other humg by the Presidents order.

the principal is the same. we are all criminals and deserve punishment. God has mercy on a few according to his own rules. Who are we to complain? We still are criminals and if we are not saved we still get what we deserve.

[shunyadragon]

the principal is the same. we are all criminals and deserve punishment. God has mercy on a few according to his own rules. Who are we to complain? We still are criminals and if we are not saved we still get what we deserve.

Your still referring to a selective arbitrary ancient view of God, which is a problem.

[Sparko]

Your still referring to a selective arbitrary ancient view of God, which is a problem.

arbitrary implies he has no particular criteria in selection. as though it is random.

It's not.

romans 9

14What then shall we say? Is God unjust? Not at all! 15For he says to Moses,
"I will have mercy on whom I have mercy,
and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion."[f] 16It does not, therefore, depend on man's desire or effort, but on God's mercy. 17For the Scripture says to Pharaoh: "I raised you up for this very purpose, that I might display my power in you and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth."[g] 18Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he hardens whom he wants to harden.
19One of you will say to me: "Then why does God still blame us? For who resists his will?" 20But who are you, O man, to talk back to God? "Shall what is formed say to him who formed it, 'Why did you make me like this?' "[h] 21Does not the potter have the right to make out of the same lump of clay some pottery for noble purposes and some for common use?
22What if God, choosing to show his wrath and make his power known, bore with great patience the objects of his wrath—prepared for destruction? 23What if he did this to make the riches of his glory known to the objects of his mercy, whom he prepared in advance for glory— 24even us, whom he also called, not only from the Jews but also from the Gentiles? 25As he says in Hosea:
"I will call them 'my people' who are not my people;
and I will call her 'my loved one' who is not my loved one,"[i] 26and,
"It will happen that in the very place where it was said to them,
'You are not my people,'
they will be called 'sons of the living God.'


You might want to read the whole chapter.

[shunyadragon]

arbitrary implies he has no particular criteria in selection. as though it is random.

It's not.

romans 9

14What then shall we say? Is God unjust? Not at all! 15For he says to Moses,
"I will have mercy on whom I have mercy,
and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion."[f] 16It does not, therefore, depend on man's desire or effort, but on God's mercy. 17For the Scripture says to Pharaoh: "I raised you up for this very purpose, that I might display my power in you and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth."[g] 18Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he hardens whom he wants to harden.
19One of you will say to me: "Then why does God still blame us? For who resists his will?" 20But who are you, O man, to talk back to God? "Shall what is formed say to him who formed it, 'Why did you make me like this?' "[h] 21Does not the potter have the right to make out of the same lump of clay some pottery for noble purposes and some for common use?
22What if God, choosing to show his wrath and make his power known, bore with great patience the objects of his wrath—prepared for destruction? 23What if he did this to make the riches of his glory known to the objects of his mercy, whom he prepared in advance for glory— 24even us, whom he also called, not only from the Jews but also from the Gentiles? 25As he says in Hosea:
"I will call them 'my people' who are not my people;
and I will call her 'my loved one' who is not my loved one,"[i] 26and,
"It will happen that in the very place where it was said to them,
'You are not my people,'
they will be called 'sons of the living God.'


You might want to read the whole chapter.

This does not address the issue, there are many tribes, vultures and peoples across the globe that were left in the dark before this time, during and long after. The above quote does not address that issue.

The reality is the view of how the different peoples and tribes outside the immediate tribes and communities is universally similar for an ancient world view. 'We are the chosen ones.' in one way or another.

[Sparko]

This does not address the issue, there are many tribes, vultures and peoples across the globe that were left in the dark before this time, during and long after. The above quote does not address that issue.

The reality is the view of how the different peoples and tribes outside the immediate tribes and communities is universally similar for an ancient world view. 'We are the chosen ones.' in one way or another.

how does that not address the issue? God is sovereign. He determines when and where any person will be born. He also knows who will and won't respond to the gospel. I am sure that anyone who will respond to the gospel will hear it. Nobody will be able to say "well if I only knew.." at the judgment. Because God knows.

[shunyadragon]

how does that not address the issue? God is sovereign. He determines when and where any person will be born. He also knows who will and won't respond to the gospel. I am sure that anyone who will respond to the gospel will hear it. Nobody will be able to say "well if I only knew.." at the judgment. Because God knows.

God is indeed Sovereigh, but it also depends on what ones view of what is a sovereigh God is. If you take this view of God as a selective arbitrary God who knows before hand who will reject him and who will accept him, well ah . . . okay, but this is still very much a problem from a more universal perspective. This leaves little or no room for anybody on the face of the earth ever making a free will decision concerning their destiny. Most of the people of the earth were not even informed by the 15th century, and many tribes and cultures were not given the choice until the 19th century. If God is a universal God that created all humanity with salvation in the plan that they may freely chose.

I take the more universal perspective and believe that revelation is universal and salvation is determined by the sincerity of the individual within the cultural and time perspective the person live, and includes all humanity through out history.

[Sparko]

God is indeed Sovereigh, but it also depends on what ones view of what is a sovereigh God is. If you take this view of God as a selective arbitrary God who knows before hand who will reject him and who will accept him, well ah . . . okay, but this is still very much a problem from a more universal perspective. This leaves little or no room for anybody on the face of the earth ever making a free will decision concerning their destiny. Most of the people of the earth were not even informed by the 15th century, and many tribes and cultures were not given the choice until the 19th century. If God is a universal God that created all humanity with salvation in the plan that they may freely chose.

I take the more universal perspective and believe that revelation is universal and salvation is determined by the sincerity of the individual within the cultural and time perspective the person live, and includes all humanity through out history.

and I just go by what the bible says....

John 3:16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. 18Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son. 19This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but men loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. 20Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed. 21But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what he has done has been done through God.

[Pumbelo]

I don't think he needs or wants it, but he derserves it.

[shunyadragon]

and I just go by what the bible says....

John 3:16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. 18Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son. 19This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but men loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. 20Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed. 21But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what he has done has been done through God.

Nice slide or duck, bob and weave out the stage door. You view still allows no free will choice to 'live by the truth.' That has already been determined for everyone, and the names recorded in the book.