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How did you as a Christian come to the understanding . . .

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  • #16
    Originally posted by 37818 View Post
    Thank you Bill.
    Gy0e_f-maxage-0.gif
    That's what
    - She

    Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
    - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

    I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
    - Stephen R. Donaldson

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by 37818 View Post
      OK. How by that did you come to the understanding .that the one and only Son of God was eternally begotten of the Father from eternity?
      It was not “by that” (wimping-out/surrendering/giving up) that “I” came to an understanding, but by being willing to humbly accept pure charity, God through Christians presented the Good News. My part was just in wanting something better, even if it meant accepting charity.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by 37818 View Post
        For those of you who are allowed to post in the [two] "Christian Only" forums, please explain how you came to the understanding that the one and only Son of God was eternally begotten of the Father from eternity. [Moderators, and please everyone, this is not to be a debate thread, but questions are to be allowed, Thanks.]
        We know of the deity, preexistence, and eternality of the Word particularly from John 1 (amongst other NT texts). As for the eternal sonship doctrine, the scriptural foundations for this teaching are not so certain. It may be that the NT language of sonship applies exclusively to the Word made flesh: Jesus Christ in his incarnate state. Was the divine Logos always a Son or did he assume the role of sonship at some point in human history (i.e. approximately two thousand years ago)?
        Last edited by The Remonstrant; 07-09-2016, 05:57 AM.
        For Neo-Remonstration (Arminian/Remonstrant ruminations): <https://theremonstrant.blogspot.com>

        Comment


        • #19
          Hebrews 1:3 is one passage that can be read as supporting the doctrine of eternal generation:

          Source: Hebrews 1:3 ESV

          3 He is the radiance of the glory of God and the exact imprint of his nature, and he upholds the universe by the word of his power.

          © Copyright Original Source



          What's interesting is that Hebrews 1:3 seems to refer back to Wisdom 7:25-26, lending further support that the writers of the New Testament viewed Jesus as the personified Wisdom of God:

          Source: Wisdom 7:25-26, NKJV


          25So she is the exhalation of the power of God And the emanation of the pure glory of the Almighty; Therefore nothing defiled enters her. 26For she is the radiance of eternal light, A spotless mirror of the operative power of God And the image of His goodness.

          Nelson, Thomas. NKJV, The Orthodox Study Bible, eBook: Ancient Christianity Speaks to Today's World (Kindle Locations 52320-52326). Thomas Nelson. Kindle Edition.

          © Copyright Original Source

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          • #20
            Originally posted by The Remonstrant View Post
            We know of the deity, preexistence, and eternality of the Word particularly from John 1 (amongst other NT texts). As for the eternal sonship doctrine, the scriptural foundations for this teaching are not so certain. It may be that the NT language of sonship applies exclusively to the Word made flesh: Jesus Christ in his incarnate state. Was the divine Logos always a Son or did he assume the role of sonship at some point in human history (i.e. approximately two thousand years ago)?
            How do you understand Proverbs 30:4, '"Who hath ascended up into heaven, or descended? who hath gathered the wind in his fists? who hath bound the waters in a garment? who hath established all the ends of the earth? what is his name, and what is his son's name, if thou canst tell?"?'
            . . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV

            . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV

            Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV

            Comment


            • #21
              The Eternal Generation of the Son: Maintaining Orthodoxy in Trinitarian Theology by Kevin Giles is a pretty good book in support of the doctrine of the Eternal Generation of the Son.

              Comment


              • #22
                Another reason I hold to the doctrine of the eternal generation of the Son (and the eternal procession of the Holy Spirit) is that if you deny these two doctrines and say that the Son and the Spirit are the source of their own godhood and being (which you have to do if you deny these doctrines) ISTM that you're coming perilously close to affirming polytheism.

                Comment


                • #23
                  I don't know. I've believed that Jesus was fully God and fully man after the incarnation for as long as I had the cognitive ability to affirm that. I thought the scriptures were pretty clear that Jesus is/was/always will be God and that the Son is begotten of the Father(whatever that means, sapient attribute???).
                  If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Chrawnus View Post
                    Another reason I hold to the doctrine of the eternal generation of the Son (and the eternal procession of the Holy Spirit) is that if you deny these two doctrines and say that the Son and the Spirit are the source of their own godhood and being (which you have to do if you deny these doctrines) ISTM that you're coming perilously close to affirming polytheism.
                    Admittedly, there does appear to be a logical difficulty in affirming that the Word and the Spirit are autotheos. The eternal generation doctrine has always sought to protect against the implication that there are three deities.
                    For Neo-Remonstration (Arminian/Remonstrant ruminations): <https://theremonstrant.blogspot.com>

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by 37818 View Post
                      How do you understand Proverbs 30:4, '"Who hath ascended up into heaven, or descended? who hath gathered the wind in his fists? who hath bound the waters in a garment? who hath established all the ends of the earth? what is his name, and what is his son's name, if thou canst tell?"?'
                      I honestly cannot think of any wisdom to impart on this text at present.
                      For Neo-Remonstration (Arminian/Remonstrant ruminations): <https://theremonstrant.blogspot.com>

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Chrawnus View Post
                        The Eternal Generation of the Son: Maintaining Orthodoxy in Trinitarian Theology by Kevin Giles is a pretty good book in support of the doctrine of the Eternal Generation of the Son.
                        In a comment from the link on a reason for this book, ". . . the eternal generation of the Son is routinely rejected by some evangelicals as unbiblical, . . . "
                        . . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV

                        . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV

                        Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Chrawnus View Post
                          Another reason I hold to the doctrine of the eternal generation of the Son (and the eternal procession of the Holy Spirit) is that if you deny these two doctrines and say that the Son and the Spirit are the source of their own godhood and being (which you have to do if you deny these doctrines) ISTM that you're coming perilously close to affirming polytheism.
                          The Father, the Son of God and the Holy Spirit are the One LORD God, ". . . The LORD our God is one LORD: . . ." -- Deuteronomy 6:4. ". . . I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour. . . ." -- Isaiah 43:11.
                          . . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV

                          . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV

                          Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by 37818 View Post
                            In a comment from the link on a reason for this book, ". . . the eternal generation of the Son is routinely rejected by some evangelicals as unbiblical, . . . "
                            I'd like to know who these "some evangelicals" are...
                            That's what
                            - She

                            Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
                            - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

                            I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
                            - Stephen R. Donaldson

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post
                              I'd like to know who these "some evangelicals" are...
                              Here is a link to a PDF: https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...soz_LDdneMWDrA
                              . . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV

                              . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV

                              Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by 37818 View Post
                                The Father, the Son of God and the Holy Spirit are the One LORD God, ". . . The LORD our God is one LORD: . . ." -- Deuteronomy 6:4. ". . . I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour. . . ." -- Isaiah 43:11.
                                I'm not sure what point you're trying to make with this.

                                Comment

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