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Thread: If Evolution is True, why do Humans need a Savior but the Great Apes do Not?

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    If Evolution is True, why do Humans need a Savior but the Great Apes do Not?

    Many "moderate" and even some self-identified "conservative" Christians here on TW seem to be very comfortable with the theory of evolution and the natural selection of species. These same conservative/moderate Christians also believe that human beings are "sinners" who are in need of a savior. Are these two beliefs compatible? Here's the question:

    "If human beings are evolved from lower life forms, why do we need a Savior? If we and all other animals on earth have evolved from the same primordial slime, why do we humans need a Savior but the great apes, cows, and chickens do not?"

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    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    1. They don't have an immortal soul so there is nothing to save.
    2. They are not intelligent enough to be morally responsible for their actions. Animals are amoral.

  3. Amen DesertBerean, Adrift amen'd this post.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    1. They don't have an immortal soul so there is nothing to save.
    2. They are not intelligent enough to be morally responsible for their actions. Animals are amoral.
    How, when, and where did humans receive an immortal soul?

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    tWebber seer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary View Post
    How, when, and where did humans receive an immortal soul?
    God gave it to them, how else? And why do we have to know when?
    The settled happiness and security which we all desire, God withholds from us by the very nature of the world: but joy, pleasure, and merriment, He has scattered around. We are never safe, but we have plenty of fun, and some ecstasy. It is not hard to see why. The security we crave would teach us to rest our hearts in this world and pose an obstacle to our return to God” C.S. Lewis

  6. Amen Adrift, Rushing Jaws amen'd this post.
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    Quote Originally Posted by seer View Post
    God gave it to them, how else? And why do we have to know when?
    But how do you know that God gave humans a soul?

    And if God has given humans a soul, at what point in the evolutionary development of humans did God give them souls? I don't need an exact date or event, but basically: Did God give souls to our primate ancestors or only to the first humans as we are known today? Did God give souls to the primate ancestors from whom scientists believe both humans and the great apes descend?

    timeline_chart.gif

    Source: https://www.exploratorium.edu/eviden..._timeline.html
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by Gary; 07-18-2016 at 07:39 PM.

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    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary View Post
    But how do you know that God gave humans a soul?

    And if God has given humans a soul, at what point in the evolutionary development of humans did God give them souls? I don't need an exact date or event, but basically: Did God give souls to our primate ancestors or only to the first humans as we are known today? Did God give souls to the primate ancestors from whom scientists believe both humans and the great apes descend?
    You would probably have to ask Nick or Rogu06, but I would guess that they would say that God picked two homosapiens and gave them souls and called them Adam and Eve. Me? I just believe the bible story. what a nut, right?

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    tWebber seer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary View Post
    But how do you know that God gave humans a soul?
    Well Biblically we know that we have a "spirit."

    And if God has given humans a soul, at what point in the evolutionary development of humans did God give them souls? I don't need an exact date or event, but basically: Did God give souls to our primate ancestors or only to the first humans as we are known today? Did God give souls to the primate ancestors from whom scientists believe both humans and the great apes descend?
    But we are not apes, we are humans and only humans are ensouled. Created in image (spiritual/moral image) of God.
    The settled happiness and security which we all desire, God withholds from us by the very nature of the world: but joy, pleasure, and merriment, He has scattered around. We are never safe, but we have plenty of fun, and some ecstasy. It is not hard to see why. The security we crave would teach us to rest our hearts in this world and pose an obstacle to our return to God” C.S. Lewis

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    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary View Post
    How, when, and where did humans receive an immortal soul?
    Quote Originally Posted by seer View Post
    God gave it to them, how else? And why do we have to know when?
    He might be hinting at certain scenarios of "when" being impossible?

    At least on the Christian view he doesn't share.

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    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary View Post
    How, when, and where did humans receive an immortal soul?
    I am not an evolutionist so you would have to ask them. But regardless of #1, you still have #2. They are not intelligent enough to be moral actors and responsible for their actions. To put it simpler, they don't understand right from wrong in a moral way, so they are not responsible for their "sins" - if a Tiger eats a man, is he arrested for murder? Why not?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    I am not an evolutionist so you would have to ask them. But regardless of #1, you still have #2. They are not intelligent enough to be moral actors and responsible for their actions. To put it simpler, they don't understand right from wrong in a moral way, so they are not responsible for their "sins" - if a Tiger eats a man, is he arrested for murder? Why not?
    Interesting, but not the topic of this thread. This thread is addressed to Christians such as "Adrift" and Stein who believe in Evolution and also seem to believe that humans need a Savior. To me these positions are contradictory. I am trying to understand how so many "moderate" Christians can simultaneously hold these two positions.

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