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If Evolution is True, why do Humans need a Savior but the Great Apes do Not?

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  • If Evolution is True, why do Humans need a Savior but the Great Apes do Not?

    Many "moderate" and even some self-identified "conservative" Christians here on TW seem to be very comfortable with the theory of evolution and the natural selection of species. These same conservative/moderate Christians also believe that human beings are "sinners" who are in need of a savior. Are these two beliefs compatible? Here's the question:

    "If human beings are evolved from lower life forms, why do we need a Savior? If we and all other animals on earth have evolved from the same primordial slime, why do we humans need a Savior but the great apes, cows, and chickens do not?"

  • #2
    1. They don't have an immortal soul so there is nothing to save.
    2. They are not intelligent enough to be morally responsible for their actions. Animals are amoral.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Sparko View Post
      1. They don't have an immortal soul so there is nothing to save.
      2. They are not intelligent enough to be morally responsible for their actions. Animals are amoral.
      How, when, and where did humans receive an immortal soul?

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Gary View Post
        How, when, and where did humans receive an immortal soul?
        God gave it to them, how else? And why do we have to know when?
        Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

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        • #5
          The scriptures teach that people are in the image of God. There's nothing said about what image animals have. And God said animals were the domain of people. There's no teaching of the people and animals being equal.
          Watch your links! http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/fa...corumetiquette

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Gary View Post
            How, when, and where did humans receive an immortal soul?
            I am not an evolutionist so you would have to ask them. But regardless of #1, you still have #2. They are not intelligent enough to be moral actors and responsible for their actions. To put it simpler, they don't understand right from wrong in a moral way, so they are not responsible for their "sins" - if a Tiger eats a man, is he arrested for murder? Why not?

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            • #7
              Originally posted by seer View Post
              God gave it to them, how else? And why do we have to know when?
              But how do you know that God gave humans a soul?

              And if God has given humans a soul, at what point in the evolutionary development of humans did God give them souls? I don't need an exact date or event, but basically: Did God give souls to our primate ancestors or only to the first humans as we are known today? Did God give souls to the primate ancestors from whom scientists believe both humans and the great apes descend?

              timeline_chart.gif

              Source: https://www.exploratorium.edu/eviden..._timeline.html
              Attached Files
              Last edited by Gary; 07-18-2016, 02:39 PM.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Gary View Post
                But how do you know that God gave humans a soul?

                And if God has given humans a soul, at what point in the evolutionary development of humans did God give them souls? I don't need an exact date or event, but basically: Did God give souls to our primate ancestors or only to the first humans as we are known today? Did God give souls to the primate ancestors from whom scientists believe both humans and the great apes descend?
                You would probably have to ask Nick or Rogu06, but I would guess that they would say that God picked two homosapiens and gave them souls and called them Adam and Eve. Me? I just believe the bible story. what a nut, right?

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by DesertBerean View Post
                  The scriptures teach that people are in the image of God. There's nothing said about what image animals have. And God said animals were the domain of people. There's no teaching of the people and animals being equal.
                  This discussion is addressed to Christians who believe in "theistic evolution". I am trying to understand how someone who believes in Darwin's Evolution of Species can also believe that humans need a Savior. You do not seem to believe in Evolution, so I am confused why you are choosing to enter this discussion.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                    I am not an evolutionist so you would have to ask them. But regardless of #1, you still have #2. They are not intelligent enough to be moral actors and responsible for their actions. To put it simpler, they don't understand right from wrong in a moral way, so they are not responsible for their "sins" - if a Tiger eats a man, is he arrested for murder? Why not?
                    Interesting, but not the topic of this thread. This thread is addressed to Christians such as "Adrift" and Stein who believe in Evolution and also seem to believe that humans need a Savior. To me these positions are contradictory. I am trying to understand how so many "moderate" Christians can simultaneously hold these two positions.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Gary View Post
                      This discussion is addressed to Christians who believe in "theistic evolution". I am trying to understand how someone who believes in Darwin's Evolution of Species can also believe that humans need a Savior. You do not seem to believe in Evolution, so I am confused why you are choosing to enter this discussion.
                      Because I don't think it matters, although I believe in the literal creation of Man. The PURPOSE behind our existance is the key
                      Watch your links! http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/fa...corumetiquette

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                        You would probably have to ask Nick or Rogu06, but I would guess that they would say that God picked two homosapiens and gave them souls and called them Adam and Eve. Me? I just believe the bible story. what a nut, right?
                        No, I do not believe that you are a "nut". In my interactions with you I perceive you to be very intelligent and thoughtful. I believe that you are simply mistaken.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by DesertBerean View Post
                          Because I don't think it matters, although I believe in the literal creation of Man. The PURPOSE behind our existance is the key
                          So you believe that there is no contradiction in believing that humans developed from lower life forms over a process of millions of years, just as did all other animals, but yet only humans need a Savior?

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Gary View Post
                            So you believe that there is no contradiction in believing that humans developed from lower life forms over a process of millions of years, just as did all other animals, but yet only humans need a Savior?
                            But why should there be a contradiction?
                            Watch your links! http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/fa...corumetiquette

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Gary View Post
                              Interesting, but not the topic of this thread. This thread is addressed to Christians such as "Adrift" and Stein who believe in Evolution and also seem to believe that humans need a Savior. To me these positions are contradictory. I am trying to understand how so many "moderate" Christians can simultaneously hold these two positions.
                              yeah I know. and I know what they believe in part, thus my answers.

                              I don't know the details about "when they got souls" and I suspect belief that varies from person to person. I gave you one answer I heard before, about ensouling two homosapiens and they became "Adam and Eve"

                              But I do know that even Theistic Evolutionists believe man has an immortal soul and animals don't, and that they are not sentient enough to understand morality and therefore are not held morally responsible for their actions, not by man or by God. So even if they did have an immortal soul, it would not need saving because they cannot actually sin, being amoral. The same with small children and adults who have mental deficiencies that keep them from being moral agents. Like someone who has the IQ of 75. Or a 5 year old. They don't understand right from wrong in a way that makes them responsible morally for their choices.

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