Mt. Carmel Time:: Is Allah the God of the Bible?

[barnasha]

I agree that God does not contradict himself. Any book which says
he does is either corrupted or false. The bible says God changed his mind. Therefore, the bible is either corrupted or false. It is not false, therefore, it is corrupted.

to say a book, (or a collection of books, as is the bible). is "false" is utterly meaningless. how does one place a large book on a scale of truth/falsehood?

[Huguenot]

But Mohammad didn't qualify as a Biblical prophet!

God's word must remain consistent (unchanging) (Deuteronomy 4:1-2; Isaiah 8:20; Matthew 5:17-18; 24:35; and Revelation 22:18-20). In Psalms 89:35 we find that God cannot contradict

When we look at the Qur'an we find many stories which contradict the revelations which came before (the Biblical account).

Many contradictions are found concerning Abraham:

Abraham's father is called Azar, instead of Terah (An'am 6:74 vs. Genesis11:26

He did not raise his descendants in the valley of Mecca, but in Hebron (Genesis 13:14-18).

His hometown was not called Mecca but Ur in Chaldea (the secular Ebla tablets of Syria confirm the account of Genesis 11:31

He did not wander in the Meccan valley of Arabia, but through Haran and Canaan (Genesis 11:31 & Genesis 12:5

The Lord made His covenant with Isaac and not the son of the slave, Hagar (see Genesis 17:18-21 & Genesis 22:2



There is no record that he and Ishmael went to Arabia and built the Ka'bah in Mecca, though he did spend some time in Egypt (Genesis 12:10).

Muslims assume that Arabs are Ishmael's descendants.

Historically the first father of the Arabs was Qahtan or Joktan. Some of his sons' names are still found in geographical locations in Arabia today, such as Sheba, Hazarmaveth, Ophir, and Havilah.

Abraham's nephew Lot is another ancestor; as is Jacob's twin brother Esau, the father of the Edomites and the Moabites.

Finally, Keturah, Abraham's third wife (Genesis 25), had six sons who all became forefathers of Arabs (i.e. Sheba and Dedan located in Yemen).

Other contradictions of the Biblical account are found in the Qur'an.

Two of these are:

In the Qur'an, Mary is recorded as the sister of Aaron and the daughter of Imran, as well as the mother of Jesus (Surat Maryam [Mary] 19:28). Thus, the Mary the Qur'an depicts as the mother of Jesus is 1,570 years removed from the Mary of the Bible.

Haman, a Babylonian, not an Egyptian name, is mentioned as the "Wazir" of Pharaoh in Suras 28:5; 29:38: 40:25,38; yet the book of Esther correctly lists him as an official of king Xerxes, in Babylon.

http://debate.org.uk/topics/trtracts/t02.htm#1



Tears of allah?

Genesis11:26

Genesis 11 NIV

Why did this verse remain unlit?

I am hoping for a miracle of Tweb Tech'?

Is the allah god of Tweb in a state of darkness on the point of:

Genesis 11:26 NIV???

[smaneck]

But Mohammad didn't qualify as a Biblical prophet!

God's word must remain consistent (unchanging) (Deuteronomy 4:1-2; Isaiah 8:20; Matthew 5:17-18; 24:35; and Revelation 22:18-20). In Psalms 89:35 we find that God cannot contradict

Do you want me to go about demonstrating all the contradictions in the Bible? Because I'll be happy to do so if you want to pursue this line. But most of the passage you just cited don't say what you represent them as saying. For instance Deuteronomy refers to the laws given specifically to *Israel.* When Muhammad speaks of "corrupting the Word of God" He refers to the fact that the Jews were no longer following many of these laws. As for Isaiah 8:20, that refers to communication with familial spirits, not prophecy. As for Matthew 5:17-18, Jesus doesn't say the law will never change, He says it will not change until "till all be fulfilled." All is fulfilled with the coming of a new Manifestation. For Christianity it was fulfilled the moment Jesus said, "It is finished." As for Revelation 22:18, that is a curse placed on anyone who attempts to interpolate that text. It has nothing to do with continuing revelation. Psalms 89:35 is about God's faithfulness. It has nothing to do with His being 'unchanging.'

When we look at the Qur'an we find many stories which contradict the revelations which came before (the Biblical account).

He did not raise his descendants in the valley of Mecca, but in Hebron (Genesis 13:14-18).

His hometown was not called Mecca but Ur in Chaldea (the secular Ebla tablets of Syria confirm the account of Genesis 11:31

The Qur'an does not say that Mecca was Abraham's hometown nor does it say He raised His descendents there. But I don't know how the Ebla tablets could possibly confirm where Abraham was born given that they are written in 2300 B.C., long before Abraham lived.

The Lord made His covenant with Isaac and not the son of the slave, Hagar (see Genesis 17:18-21 & Genesis 22:2

Then why was Ismael circumcized? Didn't that make you a party to the Covenant according to the Tanakh?

There is no record that he and Ishmael went to Arabia and built the Ka'bah in Mecca

All that proves is that there is no record.

[smaneck]

I agree that God does not contradict himself. Any book which says
he does is either corrupted or false. The bible says God changed his mind. Therefore, the bible is either corrupted or false.

Did God not change His mind about the Qiblih?

[Huguenot]

Do you want me to go about demonstrating all the contradictions in the Bible?

You are welcome to try, may I suggest under Apologetics? What are you going to name your thread? Biblical Contradictions alleged by a hypocritical Baha'i? Have you not read what Baha'u'llah said about the Christian scriptures? I will offer large cash rewards: Say: Biblical Contradictions for $100. I will donate funds to your favorite charity?

All alleged contradictions can be reconciled by reasonable and rational thinking students of the Bible.

Why not bring it on Professor? Start your thread with your best first shot!

Because I'll be happy to do so if you want to pursue this line. But most of the passage you just cited don't say what you represent them as saying. For instance Deuteronomy refers to the laws given specifically to *Israel.*

So you want an Arabian "prophet" to meet the standards of the Bible?

You want to create a new fictional Baha'i "manifestation" based on your own rules, or standards?

When Muhammad speaks of "corrupting the Word of God" He refers to the fact that the Jews were no longer following many of these laws. As for Isaiah 8:20, that refers to communication with familial spirits, not prophecy.

I didn't think that the Bible was translated into Arabic? Could Mohammad read, or was he quoting oral stories and Jewish fables? Heretical notions about Jesus told by excommunicated heretics?

As for Matthew 5:17-18, Jesus doesn't say the law will never change, He says it will not change until "till all be fulfilled."

Have you presented a straw woman?

Do not think that I came to destroy

Jesus rejected the Pharisees' charge that He was nullifying the law, and I have already proven that your false teachers of Baha'i were wrong! I will cut them a break, because I seriously doubt that Muslims Shi'a had the freedom to take classes in Christian Theology in the 19th century Iran? But, of course, they have been judged by their words and their Baha'i scriptures - Word of allah or recycled Islamic fables?

Now, get it right, the law was both temporary (Galatians 3:19; Ephesians 2:15; Hebrews 7:12) and eternal (Matthew 5:18; Romans 3:31; Romans 8:4). The word fulfill means "to fill out, expand, or complete." It does not mean to bring to an end. Jesus fulfills the law in several ways:

• He obeyed it perfectly and taught its correct meaning (Matthew 5:19,20)

• He will one day fulfill all of the OT types and prophecies; and

• He provides a way of salvation that meets all the requirements of the law (Romans 3:21; Romans 3:31).

Baha'is are under the heavy yoke or burden of your Bayan. Really just a new Islamic set of burdens.

Ephesians 2:14-15 NIV

The “law of commandments contained in ordinances” was “abolished” by the death of Jesus upon the cross. Not changed or annulled. The Greek term for “abolished” is katargeo, literally suggesting the idea of reducing something to a state of inactivity.

Paul uses this term twice in Romans 7:2-6 NIV showing that just as a wife is “discharged” from the law of her husband when he dies, even so, through the death of the body of Christ, men were “discharged” from the obligations of the Mosaic law.

So, where does Baha'i stand here, with the Jews or the Christian scriptures? Muslims?

See: Colossians 2:14 NIV



Colossians 2 NIV

See also:

Galatians 5:1-4 NIV

Baha'i is clearly under the yoke of the Law just like Muslims and Orthodox Jews.

They deny the Grace under Jesus and lack the fruit of the Holy Spirit in Galatians 5. Your "fruit" is another "gospel" condemned in Galatians 1:8 NIV.

All is fulfilled with the coming of a new Manifestation.

Still spinning your Non-Biblical fictions & Fables Why have you rejected the New Covenant?

1 Peters 1:20 " No prophecy is of any private interpretation" Bahá'u'lláh applies prophecy's of Christ to himself, which makes him a false prophet and a lying sinner! The New Covenant is where God promises to Man eternal salvation based upon the sacrifice of Jesus on the cross! We are under Grace and you are condemned by the Law(s)! Over and over again - daily you are condemned when you attempt to preach another "gospel' - See Galatians 1:8 NIV.

You never knew Jesus Christ and you're eternally lost! Why do you reject the offer of Jesus Christ?

1 John 2:23

Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father; the one who confesses the Son has the Father also.

Can't you discern false prophets? Stuck on stupid?

Test The Spirits! (1 John 4:1-6 NIV)

"DO NOT BELIEVE EVERY SPIRIT"

[Huguenot]

Here's the Baha'i shrines on Mt. Carmel: http://community.beliefnet.com/photos/839

But all I see is light, not fire.

BTW, you missed my Mt. Carmel joke, and the FIRE of Elijah, and really the fame of Mount Carmel is Elijah and the Baal challenge!



Elijah now orders that the altar of Yahweh, and its sacrifice, be drenched with water (twelve barrels of water). He asks God to accept the sacrifice.



Fire falls from the sky, igniting the sacrifice.



The people who witness this immediately begin worshiping Yahweh. Elijah seizes the moment and orders the death of the prophets of Baal. This episode ends with the return of rains to Israel, signaling the end of the famine.

Mount Carmel time means that I am ROASTING you and your false teachers of Baha'i!

Why have you rejected the Holy Word of God?

Luke 1:16-17NIV

...."in the spirit and power of Elijah.

Jesus said" All the prophets and the law prophesied until John and that John fulfilled being the messenger to prepare the people preceding the one and only messiah. Jesus said John was the greatest prophet, but Jesus was a prophet. But he was more than just a prophet as Paul writes that Jesus is the last revelator of God -being the fullness of God himself (Colossians 2:9).

I have a divine suggestion! You can travel to Mt. Carmel and REPENT in the cave of Elijah! And it is a Christian Church and not a Baha'i momument to vanity and your fictional "glory".

The real Elijah reveals the truth that passed by Baha'i.

1 Kings 18:42: "...And Elijah went up to the top of Carmel; and he cast himself down upon the earth, and put his face between his knees"

http://www.biblewalks.com/Photos16/Elijahscave1.jpg

[smaneck]

You are welcome to try, may I suggest under Apologetics? What are you going to name your thread? Biblical Contradictions alleged by a hypocritical Baha'i? Have you not read what Baha'u'llah said about the Christian scriptures?

Baha'u'llah attested to the integrity of the Bible. He never suggested it contained no contradictions, only that it faithfully conveyed God's message.

But I'm not moving this to another thread. As I said, I think it should be shown here that the Bible cannot meet the criteria you are setting forth for the Qur'an.

I will offer large cash rewards: Say: Biblical Contradictions for $100. I will donate funds to your favorite charity?

Okay, we will start with some simple ones, ones I've mentioned before. The Gospel of Matthew 2:16-18 applies the following verse to the so-called slaughter of the innocents by King Herod.

"A voice was heard in Ramah, weeping and great mourning, Rachel weeping for her children; and she refused to be comforted, because they were no more." (Jeremiah 31:15)

Leaving aside for a moment the question of whether such a slaugter ever took place (since there is no collaborating evidence for this) it is very clear from the context of Jeremiah's statement that he was talking about the Babylonian captivity which he himself witnessed. (There are *some* eyewitnesses in the Bible.)

Then we have this passage in Matthew:

27:3 Then Judas, which had betrayed him, when he saw that he was condemned, repented himself, and brought again the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and elders, 27:4 Saying, I have sinned in that I have betrayed the innocent blood. And they said, What is that to us? see thou to that.

27:5 And he cast down the pieces of silver in the temple, and departed, and went and hanged himself.

27:6 And the chief priests took the silver pieces, and said, It is not lawful for to put them into the treasury, because it is the price of blood.

27:7 And they took counsel, and bought with them the potter's field, to bury strangers in.

27:8 Wherefore that field was called, The field of blood, unto this day.

27:9 Then was fulfilled that which was spoken by Jeremy the prophet, saying, And they took the thirty pieces of silver, the price of him that was valued, whom they of the children of Israel did value; 27:10 And gave them for the potter's field, as the Lord appointed me.

(King James Bible, Matthew)

The first problem with this is that Jeremiah never made such a prophecy. What Matthew appears to be alluding to is something Zechariah did:

Zechariah 11:12-13 And I said unto them, If ye think good, give me my price; and if not, forbear. So they weighed for my price thirty pieces of silver. And the Lord said unto me, Cast it unto the potter: a goodly price that I was prised at of them. And I took the thirty pieces of silver, and cast them to the potter in the house of the Lord.

That wasn't a prophecy at all, it was something Zechariah did. And there is no mention of buying field here.

Matthew also quotes Jesus as saying:

Matthew 23:35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.

The allusion here is to the following passage from II Chronicles 24:20-21

"And the Spirit of God came upon Zechariah the son of Jehoiada the priest, which stood above the people, and said unto them, Thus saith God, Why transgress ye the commandments of the Lord, that ye cannot prosper? because ye have forsaken the Lord, he hath also forsaken you. And they conspired against him, and stoned him with stones at the commandment of the king in the court of the house of the Lord. "

Problems is, this Zechariah was the son of Jehoidah, not Berechiah. Berechiah was actually the father of the prophet Zechariah, who lived several decades after the death of his namesake. He was not killed in this manner.

That's three for now. My favorite charity of the day can be found here:
http://www.mideastyouth.com/projects/

All alleged contradictions can be reconciled by reasonable and rational thinking students of the Bible.

Let's see you do it.

Why not bring it on Professor? Start your thread with your best first shot!

This thread is fine, thank you.

Baha'is are under the heavy yoke or burden of your Bayan

.

Shows what you know. The laws of the Bayan were abrogated with the Baha'i Dispensation.

You never knew Jesus Christ

a

Au contraire, I was a Christian before I became a Baha'i.

Stuck on stupid?

whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

(King James Bible, Matthew)

Still playing with fire, I see.

You owe me (or mideastyouth.com) $300.

Keep this up and you'll go bankrupt.

[smaneck]

BTW, you missed my Mt. Carmel joke, and the FIRE of Elijah, and really the fame of Mount Carmel is Elijah and the Baal challenge!

I didn't miss your joke, but obviously you missed my point. If the Baha'i revelation were false, why would God allow all this on the very mountain where Elijahn challenged the priests of Baal? But rather than send fire down to consume our holy places we have instead caused the desert to bloom.

Mount Carmel time means that I am ROASTING you and your false teachers of Baha'i!

Oh my, delusions of grandeur now.

Why have you rejected the Holy Word of God?

Not me:

"he who turns away from this Beauty hath also turned away from the Messengers of the past and showeth pride towards God from all eternity to all eternity."

(Compilations, Baha'i Prayers, p. 210)

I have a divine suggestion! You can travel to Mt. Carmel and REPENT in the cave of Elijah! And it is a Christian Church and not a Baha'i momument to vanity and your fictional "glory".

Actually it is a monastery. Been there, but I said prayers of gratitude not repentance. Might even stay there next time I'm in Haifa. I understand they have a guest hostel there.

[Huguenot]

Baha'u'llah attested to the integrity of the Bible. He never suggested it contained no contradictions, only that it faithfully conveyed God's message.

I do understand that Christian ministers gave him copies of the Bible, and as I recall the Presbytarians had translated the Bible to Persian in and around 1845?

But I'm not moving this to another thread. As I said, I think it should be shown here that the Bible cannot meet the criteria you are setting forth for the Qur'an.

But, you could join in with the Atheistic curmudgeons?

Okay, we will start with some simple ones, ones I've mentioned before. The Gospel of Matthew 2:16-18 applies the following verse to the so-called slaughter of the innocents by King Herod.

"A voice was heard in Ramah, weeping and great mourning, Rachel weeping for her children; and she refused to be comforted, because they were no more." (Jeremiah 31:15)

Sorry, Matthew apllies the verse to what happened and the contradiction is what? And, why the empty conjecture? Everyone knws how evil King Herod was, right?

Then we have this passage in Matthew:

27:3 Then Judas, which had betrayed him, when he saw that he was condemned, repented himself, and brought again the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and elders, 27:4 Saying, I have sinned in that I have betrayed the innocent blood. And they said, What is that to us? see thou to that.

27:5 And he cast down the pieces of silver in the temple, and departed, and went and hanged himself.

27:6 And the chief priests took the silver pieces, and said, It is not lawful for to put them into the treasury, because it is the price of blood.

27:7 And they took counsel, and bought with them the potter's field, to bury strangers in.

27:8 Wherefore that field was called, The field of blood, unto this day.

27:9 Then was fulfilled that which was spoken by Jeremy the prophet, saying, And they took the thirty pieces of silver, the price of him that was valued, whom they of the children of Israel did value; 27:10 And gave them for the potter's field, as the Lord appointed me.

The first problem with this is that Jeremiah never made such a prophecy. What Matthew appears to be alluding to is something Zechariah did:

Zechariah 11:12-13 And I said unto them, If ye think good, give me my price; and if not, forbear. So they weighed for my price thirty pieces of silver. And the Lord said unto me, Cast it unto the potter: a goodly price that I was prised at of them. And I took the thirty pieces of silver, and cast them to the potter in the house of the Lord.

That wasn't a prophecy at all, it was something Zechariah did. And there is no mention of buying field here.

Matthew also quotes Jesus as saying:

Matthew 23:35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.

The allusion here is to the following passage from II Chronicles 24:20-21

"And the Spirit of God came upon Zechariah the son of Jehoiada the priest, which stood above the people, and said unto them, Thus saith God, Why transgress ye the commandments of the Lord, that ye cannot prosper? because ye have forsaken the Lord, he hath also forsaken you. And they conspired against him, and stoned him with stones at the commandment of the king in the court of the house of the Lord. "

Problems is, this Zechariah was the son of Jehoidah, not Berechiah. Berechiah was actually the father of the prophet Zechariah, who lived several decades after the death of his namesake. He was not killed in this manner.

Let's see you do it.

Matthew 23:35 NIV

(yawn)

Berekiah? Which one?



These are classics and I have seen hundreds of posts wrangling over these. Each assertion or each set of verses requires it's own thread IMO.

Can you donate $300 to my favorite charity? Do you have the money to lose? (Hint: what if J.P. Holding comes back from vacation and wins? What if he already wrote 100 pages on these "contradictions"?)

[smaneck]

I do understand that Christian ministers gave him copies of the Bible, and as I recall the Presbytarians had translated the Bible to Persian in and around 1845?

Baha'u'llah did not meet with any Christian ministers and He always quoted the Bible in Arabic, not Persian.

But, you could join in with the Atheistic curmudgeons?

I'm interested in defending Islam and the Baha'i Faith, not attacking Christianity.

Sorry, Matthew apllies the verse to what happened and the contradiction is what? And, why the empty conjecture? Everyone knws how evil King Herod was, right?

Enough is known about King Herod to know whether he ever ordered the slaughter of babies in Bethelehem. He didn't. But even if he did, that still doesn't change the fact that the verse from Jeremiah was talking about something entirely different. Or are you suggesting that a passage from scripture can mean two things at once? Like Deut. 18 applying to *both* Jesus and Muhammad (and maybe even Baha'u'llah)? Or the Paraclete meaning Jesus, the Holy Spirit, Muhammad and Baha'u'llah?

If so, I let you pass. Otherwise you owe mideastyouth.com $100.

Matthew 23:35 NIV

(yawn)

Berekiah? Which one?[

Not a reasonable or rational answer that makes $200.

These are classics and I have seen hundreds of posts wrangling over these. Each assertion or each set of verses requires it's own thread IMO.

Still not reasonable or rational answer. $300.

(Hint: what if J.P. Holding comes back from vacation and wins?

In other words, you can't explain them.

[Huguenot]

Baha'u'llah did not meet with any Christian ministers and He always quoted the Bible in Arabic, not Persian.

Hmmm, if I had not referred to the Bab, let me do so now, Sayyid Ali'Mohammad was visited by Christian teachers, and/or a Minister and received a copy of the Bible. I would like to find the source, but it is my understaing that he received much comfort reading about the suffering of Christ. So, before 1850 most assuredly in that case.

Now, As to a Bible in Arabic, I find that interesting but sure, in Iraq or Baghdad 1853-1863, sure.

I'm interested in defending Islam and the Baha'i Faith, not attacking Christianity.

Good luck, and how this serves God's purpose(s) is beyond me. Neither Religion has saved anyone including Mohammad, who had no idea of his eternal destiny and loudly proclaimed that he could not save anyone from Hell fire.

Enough is known about King Herod to know whether he ever ordered the slaughter of babies in Bethelehem.

The argument from silence (also called argumentum ad silentio in Latin.

Not enough is known about Mohammad's private meetings with his "angel'.

...... that still doesn't change the fact that the verse from Jeremiah was talking about something entirely different. Or are you suggesting that a passage from scripture can mean two things at once?

There are four possible answers, and in ancient times the Books were arranged differently and sometimes a Book could be referred to by the first in a series - e.g. Jeremiah - may be considered as a set of books, and that have loosely referred to Zechariah?

Like Deut. 18 applying to *both* Jesus and Muhammad (and maybe even Baha'u'llah)? Or the Paraclete meaning Jesus, the Holy Spirit, Muhammad and Baha'u'llah?

Ah back to your metaphors again? Is truth relative? The Bible is clear, and Moses is clear. Moses spoke of a Jewish prophet and the ONE prophet that would come.

Your bias is obvious, I might as well be debating Moonies, or Shi'a Mullahs in Karbala. (sp?)

If so, I let you pass. Otherwise you owe mideastyouth.com $100.

There is NO condiction(s) and if there are reasonable and rational reconcilations. Alleging such, does not prove your case.

You need to "defend" your Baha'u'llah and Baha'i, and because both the Bab and Baha'u'llah were Muslims or accepted the Islamic "prophet" Mohammad - it is clear and presently obvious - that you have a full plate.

Additionally, when time permits, I will enter the Lion's den under Apologetics and will enjoy watching you team with the most mindless atheistic curmudgeons and the most vile Anti-Theistic minions that the internet forum(s) can offer up on the binary alter of their vain imagtinations.

[Huguenot]

Elijah now orders that the altar of Yahweh, and its sacrifice, be drenched with water (twelve barrels of water). He asks God to accept the sacrifice.



Fire falls from the sky, igniting the sacrifice.



The people who witness this immediately begin worshiping Yahweh. Elijah seizes the moment and orders the death of the prophets of Ba'al or Ba'allah.

This episode ends with the return of rains to Israel, signaling the end of the famine.

Mount Carmel time means that I am ROASTING you and your false teachers of Baha'i!

Why have you rejected the Holy Word of God?

Luke 1:16-17NIV

...."in the spirit and power of Elijah.

Jesus said" All the prophets and the law prophesied until John and that John fulfilled being the messenger to prepare the people preceding the one and only messiah. Jesus said John was the greatest prophet, but Jesus was a prophet. But he was more than just a prophet as Paul writes that Jesus is the last revelator of God -being the fullness of God himself (Colossians 2:9).

I have a divine suggestion! You can travel to Mt. Carmel and REPENT in the cave of Elijah! And it is a Christian Church and not a Baha'i momument to vanity and your fictional "glory".

The real Elijah reveals the truth that passed by Baha'i.

1 Kings 18:42: "...And Elijah went up to the top of Carmel; and he cast himself down upon the earth, and put his face between his knees"

http://www.biblewalks.com/Photos16/Elijahscave1.jpg



The Baha'i scrolls and if the wet ocean(s) of Words are burning up on the metaphorical high alters of Mount Carmel.

(Note, Elijah's cave holds the key to the mystical unreason leaving behind the Seven Valleys of misunderstandings;)

[Ibn Abu Talib]

Hugenot, I think you are just as old as the kid in your profile.

[Huguenot]

Hugenot, I think you are just as old as the kid in your profile.

Thanks! I like to feel young!

Life is lived between your ears! Just for the record, when I was ten years old, my baby brother died.

That is in truth, his picture and it reminds me that children are innocent!

My pictures lack that kind of innocence! Lord God have mercy on me.

[smaneck]

Hmmm, if I had not referred to the Bab, let me do so now, Sayyid Ali'Mohammad was visited by Christian teachers, and/or a Minister and received a copy of the Bible

.

Uh, no. He was visited by a American doctor at the request of the Shah. He noted that the Bab already had Bible. He certainly had no opportunity to teach Him about Christianity. Once again, here is Dr. Cormick's testimony:

"Nothing of any importance transpired in this interview, as the Báb was aware of my having been sent with two other Persian doctors to see whether he was of sane mind or merely a madman, to decide the question whether he was to be put to death or not. With this knowledge he was loth to answer any questions put to him. . . . He only deigned to answer me, on my saying that I was not a Musulman and was willing to know something about his religion, as I might perhaps be inclined to adopt it. He regarded me very intently on my saying this, and replied that he had no doubt of all Europeans coming over to his religion. Our report to the Shah at that time was of a nature to spare his life. He was put to death some time after by the order of the Amir-Nizam, Mirza Taqi Khan. On our report he merely got the bastinado, in which operation a farrash, whether intentionally or not, struck him across the face with the stick destined for his feet, which produced a great wound and swelling of the face. On being asked whether a Persian surgeon should be brought to treat him, he expressed a desire that I should be sent for, and I accordingly treated him for a few days, but in the interviews consequent on this I could never get him to have a confidential chat with me, as some government people were always present, he being a prisoner. He was a very mild and delicate-looking man, rather small in stature and very fair for a Persian, with a melodious soft voice, which struck me much. . . In fact his whole look and deportment went far to dispose one in his favour. Of his doctrine I heard nothing from his own lips, although the idea was that there existed in his religion a certain approach to Christianity. He was seen by some Armenian carpenters, who were sent to make some repairs in his prison, reading the Bible, and he took no pains to conceal it, but on the contrary told them of it. Most assuredly the Musulman fanaticism does not exist in his religion, as applied to Christians, nor is there that restraint of females that now exists."

(Shoghi Effendi, The Dawn-Breakers, p. xxxii)

Dr. Cormick's brother, incidentally, was a famous Presbyterian missionary, but the Bab never met him.

Good luck, and how this serves God's purpose(s) is beyond me. Neither Religion has saved anyone including Mohammad, who had no idea of his eternal destiny and loudly proclaimed that he could not save anyone from Hell fire.

For some of us religion is about more than fire insurance.

The argument from silence (also called argumentum ad silentio in Latin.

Not enough is known about Mohammad's private meetings with his "angel'.

Sorry, not having collaborating evidence for someone's private meeting with an angel out in the desert is not the same as not having collaborating evidence for the massacre of all the infants in an entire town. Not even the other Gospels mention this.

There are four possible answers, and in ancient times the Books were arranged differently and sometimes a Book could be referred to by the first in a series - e.g. Jeremiah - may be considered as a set of books, and that have loosely referred to Zechariah?

And your evidence for this is?

You are still avoiding the fact that this passage as presented in Matthew completely changes the meaning of the original.

In any case, whatever methodology you use to explain such contradictions between the New Testament and the Old, go ahead and apply it to the Qur'an. It will work just fine.

Is truth relative?

The only truth that relates to us as human beings is.

There is NO condiction(s) and if there are reasonable and rational reconcilations.

So far you haven't presented any.

Alleging such, does not prove your case.

Exactly. Saying there are reasonable and rational reconciliations is not providing reasonable and rational reconciliations.

Additionally, when time permits, I will enter the Lion's den under Apologetics and will enjoy watching you team with the most mindless atheistic curmudgeons and the most vile Anti-Theistic minions that the internet forum(s) can offer up on the binary alter of their vain imagtinations.

I've never gone there and see no reason why I should. Certainly not to spend more quality time with you.