Book of Revelation

[37818]

The facts stand.

". . . I am the Alpha and the Omega, saith the Lord God, who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty. . . ." -- Revelation 1:8

". . . I am the first and the last, and the Living one; and I was dead, and behold, I am alive for evermore, . . ." -- Revelation 1:17-18.

". . . I am the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end. . . ."

There is that only one. Not two. [Two of three Persons, the One God. BTW]

[Unitarian101]

The facts stand.

". . . I am the Alpha and the Omega, saith the Lord God, who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty. . . ." -- Revelation 1:8

". . . I am the first and the last, and the Living one; and I was dead, and behold, I am alive for evermore, . . ." -- Revelation 1:17-18.

". . . I am the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end. . . ."

There is that only one. Not two. [Two of three Persons, the One God. BTW]

Rev. 1:8 could refer to the Father (rather than to Jesus), even according to Trinitarians. So it's possible that there are two individuals in these two verses. If there is nothing new next post, we'll just have to agree to disagree.

Thanks for your time,

[RGJesus]

The facts stand.

". . . I am the Alpha and the Omega, saith the Lord God, who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty. . . ." -- Revelation 1:8

". . . I am the first and the last, and the Living one; and I was dead, and behold, I am alive for evermore, . . ." -- Revelation 1:17-18.

". . . I am the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end. . . ."

There is that only one. Not two. [Two of three Persons, the One God. BTW]

I appears that Jesus is called the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, and the beginning and the ending. But it doesn't appear that he is called the Almighty God.

What does this tell us?

[Sparko]

I appears that Jesus is called the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, and the beginning and the ending. But it doesn't appear that he is called the Almighty God.

What does this tell us?

John 1:3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.

Col. 1:16-17 For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him. He is before all things, and in him all things hold together.

2 Peter 1:1 Simon Peter, a servant and apostle of Jesus Christ, To those who through the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ have received a faith as precious as ours:

Titus 2:13 while we wait for the blessed hope--the glorious appearing of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ

2 Timothy 3:16 Beyond all question, the mystery of godliness is great: He (1) appeared in a body (2), was vindicated by the Spirit, was seen by angels, was preached among the nations, was believed on in the world, was taken up in glory. NIV footnotes: (1) Some manuscripts God -- (2) Or in the flesh

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.

John 20:27 Then he said to Thomas, "Put your finger here; see my hands. Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and believe." 28 Thomas said to him, "My Lord and my God!"


any more questions?

[RGJesus]

John 1:3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.

Col. 1:16-17 For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him. He is before all things, and in him all things hold together.

2 Peter 1:1 Simon Peter, a servant and apostle of Jesus Christ, To those who through the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ have received a faith as precious as ours:

Titus 2:13 while we wait for the blessed hope--the glorious appearing of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ

2 Timothy 3:16 Beyond all question, the mystery of godliness is great: He (1) appeared in a body (2), was vindicated by the Spirit, was seen by angels, was preached among the nations, was believed on in the world, was taken up in glory. NIV footnotes: (1) Some manuscripts God -- (2) Or in the flesh

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.

John 20:27 Then he said to Thomas, "Put your finger here; see my hands. Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and believe." 28 Thomas said to him, "My Lord and my God!"


any more questions?

There is a place to discuss the passages you cited. But let's for now stick within the book of Revelation. Reposting, it appears that Jesus is called the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, and the beginning and the ending. But it doesn't appear that he is called the Almighty God.

What does this tell us?

[Sparko]

There is a place to discuss the passages you cited. But let's for now stick within the book of Revelation. Reposting, it appears that Jesus is called the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, and the beginning and the ending. But it doesn't appear that he is called the Almighty God.

What does this tell us?

The Bible calls him God in a lot of places, as I posted. Alpha and Omega, First and Last are also titles of God. The implication is clear, that Jesus is God.

YHWH is the "First and the Last":

Isaiah 44:6 "This is what the LORD says -- Israel's King and Redeemer, the LORD Almighty: I am the first and I am the last; apart from me there is no God."

Isaiah 48:12 "Listen to me, O Jacob, Israel, whom I have called: I am he; I am the first and I am the last."

Jesus is the "First and the Last":

Rev. 1:17 "When I saw him, I fell at his feet as though dead. Then he placed his right hand on me and said: ‘Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last.’"

Rev. 2:8 "To the angel of the church in Smyrna write: These are the words of him who is the First and the Last, who died and came to life again."

Rev. 22:13 "I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End."

[John Reece]

The Bible calls him God in a lot of places, as I posted. Alpha and Omega, First and Last are also titles of God. The implication is clear, that Jesus is God.

YHWH is the "First and the Last":

Isaiah 44:6 "This is what the LORD says -- Israel's King and Redeemer, the LORD Almighty: I am the first and I am the last; apart from me there is no God."

Isaiah 48:12 "Listen to me, O Jacob, Israel, whom I have called: I am he; I am the first and I am the last."

Jesus is the "First and the Last":

Rev. 1:17 "When I saw him, I fell at his feet as though dead. Then he placed his right hand on me and said: ‘Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last.’"

Rev. 2:8 "To the angel of the church in Smyrna write: These are the words of him who is the First and the Last, who died and came to life again."

Rev. 22:13 "I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End."

See here.

[RGJesus]

The Bible calls him God in a lot of places, as I posted. Alpha and Omega, First and Last are also titles of God. The implication is clear, that Jesus is God.

YHWH is the "First and the Last":

Isaiah 44:6 "This is what the LORD says -- Israel's King and Redeemer, the LORD Almighty: I am the first and I am the last; apart from me there is no God."

Isaiah 48:12 "Listen to me, O Jacob, Israel, whom I have called: I am he; I am the first and I am the last."

Jesus is the "First and the Last":

Rev. 1:17 "When I saw him, I fell at his feet as though dead. Then he placed his right hand on me and said: ‘Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last.’"

Rev. 2:8 "To the angel of the church in Smyrna write: These are the words of him who is the First and the Last, who died and came to life again."

Rev. 22:13 "I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End."

Where does it say Jesus is called Almighty God? Nowhere. Is it possible that "the Alpha and the Omega," etc. are derivative titles given to Jesus? Jesus said in Matthew 28:19 "all authority is given" to him. Could it be that part and parcel of that authority entails his being given the title "the Alpha and the Omega"?

[RGJesus]

See here.

Although Jesus is called "the Alpha and the Omega," etc., he is never called Almighty God. What does this tell us?

[John Reece]

Although Jesus is called "the Alpha and the Omega," etc., he is never called Almighty God. What does this tell us?

Your premise is questionable.

Revelation 11:17 λέγοντες·
εὐχαριστοῦμέν σοι, κύριε ὁ θεὸς ὁ παντοκράτωρ, ὁ ὢν καὶ ὁ ἦν, ὅτι εἴληφας τὴν δύναμίν σου τὴν μεγάλην καὶ ἐβασίλευσας.

NRSV: Rev. 11:17 singing,
“We give you thanks, Lord God Almighty,
who are and who were,
for you have taken your great power
and begun to reign.

Who was it that had "begun to reign" in Revelation 11:17?

According to the text, it was the "Lord God Almighty" (κύριε ὁ θεὸς ὁ παντοκράτωρ).

What is the difference between "Almighty God" and "God Almighty"?

[RGJesus]

Your premise is questionable.

Revelation 11:17 λέγοντες·
εὐχαριστοῦμέν σοι, κύριε ὁ θεὸς ὁ παντοκράτωρ, ὁ ὢν καὶ ὁ ἦν, ὅτι εἴληφας τὴν δύναμίν σου τὴν μεγάλην καὶ ἐβασίλευσας.

NRSV: Rev. 11:17 singing,
“We give you thanks, Lord God Almighty,
who are and who were,
for you have taken your great power
and begun to reign.

Who was it that had "begun to reign" in Revelation 11:17?

According to the text, it was the "Lord God Almighty" (κύριε ὁ θεὸς ὁ παντοκράτωρ).

What is the difference between "Almighty God" and "God Almighty"?

Rev. 11:15-17 (NRSV):
Then the seventh angel blew his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven, saying,

“The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord
and of his Messiah,
and he will reign forever and ever.”
Then the twenty-four elders who sit on their thrones before God fell on their faces and worshiped God, singing,

“We give you thanks, Lord God Almighty,
who are and who were,
for you have taken your great power
and begun to reign."

"Lord God Almighty" is in reference to "our Lord" and "God" in the preceding passage, not to the Messiah.

[John Reece]

Rev. 11:15-17 (NRSV):
Then the seventh angel blew his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven, saying,

“The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord
and of his Messiah,
and he will reign forever and ever.”
Then the twenty-four elders who sit on their thrones before God fell on their faces and worshiped God, singing,

“We give you thanks, Lord God Almighty,
who are and who were,
for you have taken your great power
and begun to reign."

"Lord God Almighty" is in reference to "our Lord" and "God" in the preceding passage, not to the Messiah.

You do well in expanding the context. Thanks.

What is the difference in what is said here with regard to "our Lord" and with regard to "his Messiah"? Do they not share the same almighty reign as one?

“The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord
and of his Messiah, and he will reign forever and ever.”

[Sparko]

Where does it say Jesus is called Almighty God? Nowhere. Is it possible that "the Alpha and the Omega," etc. are derivative titles given to Jesus? Jesus said in Matthew 28:19 "all authority is given" to him. Could it be that part and parcel of that authority entails his being given the title "the Alpha and the Omega"?

Why are you insisting that he has to be called "Almighty God" in Revelation when it is clear he is God by several other passages in the bible (which I already gave you)? Are you trying to divide the bible into isolated books to claim he is not God, just because it is not specific enough for you in Revelation? Jesus claiming the titles of God in Revelation, like Alpha and Omega and First and Last would be blasphemous if Jesus was not God.

God speaking: Rev 1:8 “I am the Alpha and the Omega,” says the Lord God, “who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty.”
21:6 He said to me: “It is done. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. To the thirsty I will give water without cost from the spring of the water of life. 7 Those who are victorious will inherit all this, and I will be their God and they will be my children.


Jesus Speaking: 12 “Look, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to each person according to what they have done. 13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End.

[One Bad Pig]

Why are you insisting that he has to be called "Almighty God" in Revelation when it is clear he is God by several other passages in the bible (which I already gave you)? Are you trying to divide the bible into isolated books to claim he is not God, just because it is not specific enough for you in Revelation? Jesus claiming the titles of God in Revelation, like Alpha and Omega and First and Last would be blasphemous if Jesus was not God.

Pretty much. Revelation quotes or alludes to the OT more often than any other NT book. Reading Revelation without referring back to those contexts is useless.

[John Reece]

Rev. 12:9 The great dragon was thrown down, that ancient serpent, who is called the Devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world—he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him. 10 Then I heard a loud voice in heaven, proclaiming, “Now have come the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God and the authority of his Messiah, for the accuser of our comrades has been thrown down, who accuses them day and night before our God.

The salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God and the authority of his Messiah are indivisible.