Flood in 3500 B.C.

[Macgawd]

Occam's Razor says there is a common origin.

Occam's Razor says that explaining phenomena should require as few assumptions as possible.

Argument A: That all the flood myths from the various cultures around the world stem from a common origin. One must first assume that there was in fact an historical Great Flood. Then, one must assume that over the millennium of conquering, being conquered and cultural assimilation, the memory of this Great Flood somehow managed to remain in the collective consciousness of human civilization as it spread out across the earth, and that despite the centuries of independent cultural evolution of these various civilizations over time, all of their mythologies still retained the basic framework of the original experience, thousands of years removed from their present culture.

Argument B: Devastating floods are a common experience for ancient civilizations around the world, which tended to establish themselves along coastal regions and other waterways, and over centuries have established mythologies which recount these experiences, often as evidence of divine retribution.

All things being equal, I think that the common origin argument is the least believable.

=M=

[John Goddard]

I believe the flood was universal, but didn't cover everything. I believe that mankind was localized in an area at sea level, which was once not covered by sea water. Wouldn't it make sense that as mankind spread out, they would have naturally found higher elevations a little more safer?

I believe in evolution, man evolved from animals, but Adam was the first to have consciousness of the true God.

Those God-conscious people were concentrated in his region of Mesopotamia, became rotten, and were wiped out locally save for Noah's family.

All other humans on the earth were still there, but not being God-conscious yet, were still counted as beasts.

That's my current take on it.

[John Goddard]

Occam's Razor says that explaining phenomena should require as few assumptions as possible. ... All things being equal, I think that the common origin argument is the least believable.

I'd say more like this:

Argument A: Sumerian was the language of ancient Sumer, spoken in Southern Mesopotamia since at least the 4th millennium BC. The Sumerian language is the earliest known written language. The biblical flood took place in Mesopotamia and was preserved and retold to those of other cultures in writings and by word of mouth.

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Argument B: Other far-removed cultures have myths which almost exactly mirror the biblical account. But they are not at all related.

Pawnee tale: the sun God Tirawa created all life including men, animals, and monsters, they were giants and thought they were as good as the gods and disrespected Tirawa, so Tirawa destroyed them with a flood and created new people for the earth. He also sent a little bird as well as a crow to check the waters.

Genesis 6-8: There were giants in the earth in those days...And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually...And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth, to destroy all flesh, wherein is the breath of life, from under heaven; and every thing that is in the earth shall die...And he sent forth a raven, which went forth to and fro, until the waters were dried up from off the earth....Also he sent forth a dove from him, to see if the waters were abated from off the face of the ground...

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I think A is still more convincing, with fewest assumptions.

[fm93]

Well, I'm not expert on this, but...

I have come across an article that lists missionary accounts where pagans seem to have received revelations from God. http://net-burst.net/hot/miracle.htm

Could not all those people have received revelations of the flood? Or perhaps there's a way that the flood did occur, and accounts of it were spread all across the globe? I hold to a local flood myself.

[John Goddard]

Well, I'm not expert on this, but...

I have come across an article that lists missionary accounts where pagans seem to have received revelations from God. http://net-burst.net/hot/miracle.htm

Could not all those people have received revelations of the flood? Or perhaps there's a way that the flood did occur, and accounts of it were spread all across the globe? I hold to a local flood myself.

Yeah I agree.