Interpretation the Trinity is polytheistic

[JimL]

Then it remains a nonsensical question.

Simple question really mike, just nonsensical to you because you can't make sense of it for some strange reason. It's really very simple, is only the son embodied in flesh named Jesus, or is the father and the holy spirit also embodied in Jesus ? Because if Jesus is only the son, then the son is distinct from the father, not a member of a trinity, a 3 in 1 unified God.

[mikewhitney]

Simple question really mike, just nonsensical to you because you can't make sense of it for some strange reason. It's really very simple, is only the son embodied in flesh named Jesus, or is Jesus also the father and the holy spirit? Because if Jesus is only the son, then the son is distinct from the father, not a member of a trinity, a 3 in 1 unified God.

You should come back after studying the doctrine more. You have to work through the different heresies until you can ask questions from an orthodox understanding ...even if you haven't been convinced of the Trinitarian understanding.

[JimL]

You should come back after studying the doctrine more.

But your supposed to give the answer. Shall I take it that you can't answer?

[mikewhitney]

But your supposed to give the answer. Shall I take it that you can't answer?

The question is too convoluted to answer it reasonably. You need to study a bit more before you can start asking logical questions.

[JimL]

The question is too convoluted to answer it reasonably. You need to study a bit more before you can start asking logical questions.

Okay, I'll try once more. iI the triune god 3 person in 1 god, or are they 3 distict persons in which 1, the son can by himself, alone, without the other 2, be embodied in the fleshly body we know as Jesus.

[mikewhitney]

Okay, I'll try once more. iI the triune god 3 person in 1 god, or are they 3 distict persons in which 1, the son can by himself, alone, without the other 2, be embodied in the fleshly body we know as Jesus.

You have stated it correctly, more or less.

I'm bored. So I will tell you a little bit more.

Our understanding of the Trinity is the reconciling of different things said about the 3 persons of the Godhead. They are three distinct persons within the unity of the Godhead. They share the same will -- except that Jesus, as God incarnate, also operated within the limits of humanity. There is nothing in scriptures to say that this is not possible. We actually have instances in the Old Testament where God has interacted with men in a physical way.

This is a bit like describing Quantum Mechanics (inasmuch that I just have heard it superficially) where we can describe what is happening but we don't understand exactly how it works. However, there are obvious things that conflict with our normal experiences. Yet we know when something has been incorrectly stated about the Godhead because it does not conform with the whole image of God.

[JimL]

You have stated it correctly, more or less.

I'm bored. So I will tell you a little bit more.

Our understanding of the Trinity is the reconciling of different things said about the 3 persons of the Godhead. They are three distinct persons within the unity of the Godhead. They share the same will -- except that Jesus, as God incarnate, also operated within the limits of humanity. There is nothing in scriptures to say that this is not possible. We actually have instances in the Old Testament where God has interacted with men in a physical way.

This is a bit like describing Quantum Mechanics (inasmuch that I just have heard it superficially) where we can describe what is happening but we don't understand exactly how it works. However, there are obvious things that conflict with our normal experiences. Yet we know when something has been incorrectly stated about the Godhead because it does not conform with the whole image of God.

Right, so what you believe is that the 3 persons making up the 1 god are not necessarily a unified and indivisable whole, but 1 of the persons, the son, can seperate from the supposedly indivisable triperson god and do his own thing here on earth separate and apart from the other 2 persons?

[mikewhitney]

Right, so what you believe is that the 3 persons making up the 1 god are not necessarily a unified and indivisable whole, but 1 of the persons, the son, can seperate from the supposedly indivisable triperson god and do his own thing here on earth separate and apart from the other 2 persons?

How do you say they are separated?
You are finding an unjustified pair of opposites. If by unified you mean the oneness of God ... you just use oneness. I'm not sure where you get the supposed idea of indivisibility. This concept is not what is addressed in the comprehension of God. So maybe you can clarify what you are asking.

[JimL]

How do you say they are separated?
You are finding an unjustified pair of opposites. If by unified you mean the oneness of God ... you just use oneness. I'm not sure where you get the supposed idea of indivisibility. This concept is not what is addressed in the comprehension of God. So maybe you can clarify what you are asking.

Well, Jesus is the son, correct? Is the father also Jesus, is the holy spirit also jesus? or is just the son Jesus?

[mikewhitney]

Well, Jesus is the son, correct? Is the father also Jesus, is the holy spirit also jesus? or is just the son Jesus?

That's why you need to study some theology behind this. After you have study the issues leading to the Trinity, you can begin to discuss the Trinity without asking a thousand preliminary questions.

It's like with Quantum Mechanics, you first have to understand basic physics before you can understand the issues raised at the quantum level.

[JimL]

That's why you need to study some theology behind this. After you have study the issues leading to the Trinity, you can begin to discuss the Trinity without asking a thousand preliminary questions.

It's like with Quantum Mechanics, you first have to understand basic physics before you can understand the issues raised at the quantum level.

That's a cop out, mike. I'm only asking you one question, not a thousand questions. If you haven't the answer, if you can't think of a logical answer, then just say so.

[mikewhitney]

That's a cop out, mike. I'm only asking you one question, not a thousand questions. If you haven't the answer, if you can't think of a logical answer, then just say so.

This is a cop out Jim. you are unwilling to study to understand the background of what you are asking.

What is it that you are really seeking here?

This situation is like surfing. You have to start paddling with the wave before you can be poised to catch the wave. Start paddling, sir.

Otherwise, any answers to your question would not accomplish anything.

[JimL]

This is a cop out Jim. you are unwilling to study to understand the background of what you are asking.

What is it that you are really seeking here?

This situation is like surfing. You have to start paddling with the wave before you can be poised to catch the wave. Start paddling, sir.

Otherwise, any answers to your question would not accomplish anything.

Ok, nice chatting with you, mike.

[mikewhitney]

Ok, nice chatting with you, mike.

that is the friendliest thing I have ever seen in any of your posts. There is hope for you.

[Tassman]

There is no mechanism to understand the Deity of Christ except that it was understood in the first century.

What was assumed in the first century was that Jesus was God. And there was no mechanism to understand the “deity of Christ” in relation to the deity of the father in the first century. This didn't become an issue until later.

There is no reason that God cannot exist in the Trinitarian identity.

No reason except that God the Father, the Son of God and the Holy Spirit are claimed to be ‘one god’ but simultaneously three distinct persons – each fully God. This a logical contradiction.

As Christians, we are working with the information revealed through scriptures. This Trinitarian form is the way that God has revealed himself.

What you are working with is a political compromise arrived at as a result of political maneuvering in the fourth century between the two dominant Christology’s. It could have just as easily gone the other way (i.e. Arianism - where the Son is subordinate to the Father). This Christology was very widespread throughout much of the Eastern and Western Roman empires at the time, even after it was denounced as a heresy by the Council of Nicaea.