Page 4 of 4 FirstFirst ... 234
Results 31 to 37 of 37

Thread: The End of Protestantism...?

  1. #31
    tWebber Thoughtful Monk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    569
    Amen (Given)
    209
    Amen (Received)
    222
    Quote Originally Posted by Rushing Jaws View Post
    Protestantism will survive, even if the vast majority of Protestants cease to be Protestant. People have been consigning it to the grave for at least 200 years. But it always manages to survive. Even if the US and Europe come to be plunged into darkest night, Protestantism can thrive elsewhere. If I were a Protestant, I would have no fears whatever for its survival. God is Faithful, even if Protestants lack faith in Him. As for feasible hopes, God is not restricted by those - the Cross shows that. The 'defeat' of the Cross was how God brought about victory over sin, death, hell and the devil.
    I see your point. Maybe what is plunging into darkness is white Euro-centric Protestantism. God will always have worshippers even if the numbers are small. In the end, we all have to look to God for our salvation and hope.
    "For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings." Hosea 6:6

    My time to be on TWeb is unpredictable. It may take a few days for me to see your post and respond.

  2. #32
    tWebber Darth Executor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Kazakhstan
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    6,918
    Amen (Given)
    1699
    Amen (Received)
    2604
    Quote Originally Posted by Meh Gerbil View Post
    What is a Catholic who doesn't submit to the authority of the pope?
    What is a Catholic who doesn't hold to the sacraments?
    What is a Catholic who doesn't believe that confession to a priest is necessary for forgiveness?

    It seems to me that the author is willing to throw essential/defining elements of Catholicism under the bus to extend an invitation to Protestants to be a part of what they already are, which is Protestants.
    Protestantism is the Misc. section of Christianity anyway, it's the least likely to unify to anything simply because there'll always be some whackjob who gets butthurt about something and starts a church in his garage.

  3. #33
    tWebber Meh Gerbil's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Faith
    circular balloonist
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    4,164
    Amen (Given)
    1438
    Amen (Received)
    2349
    Quote Originally Posted by Darth Executor View Post
    Protestantism is the Misc. section of Christianity anyway, it's the least likely to unify to anything simply because there'll always be some whackjob who gets butthurt about something and starts a church in his garage.
    This is true.

    That said, I don't know how unified Catholics really are in practice.
    The Catholicism practiced in Central America is probably quite a bit different than that practiced in the Middle East.
    Actually YOU put Trump in the White House. He wouldn't have gotten 1% of the vote if it wasn't for the widespread spiritual and cultural devastation caused by progressive policies. There's no "this country" left with your immigration policies, your "allies" are worthless and even more suicidal than you are and democracy is a sick joke that I hope nobody ever thinks about repeating when the current order collapses. - Darth_Executor striking a conciliatory note in Civics 101

  4. #34
    tWebber Rushing Jaws's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    Near my best friend (see photo above)
    Faith
    Ultramontane Papist XPian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    441
    Amen (Given)
    1426
    Amen (Received)
    87
    Quote Originally Posted by JB DoulosChristou View Post
    Leithart spends most of his original "The End of Protestantism" article explaining where he sees the distinctions between Protestantism and Reformational Catholicism. In brief, Protestantism is defined over-and-against Roman Catholicism, whereas Reformational Catholicism isn't, and retains healthy aspects of Roman Catholicism that Protestantism has at times jettisoned or forgotten.
    That sounds like an argument for Anglicanism, or for certain strata of Anglicanism. And Anglicanism is a form of Protestantism.

  5. #35
    Must...have...caffeine One Bad Pig's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Inside the beltway
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    16,067
    Amen (Given)
    5063
    Amen (Received)
    9301
    Quote Originally Posted by Rushing Jaws View Post
    That sounds like an argument for Anglicanism, or for certain strata of Anglicanism. And Anglicanism is a form of Protestantism.
    Not especially. It was more or less a unilateral move by King Henry VIII because the pope wouldn't grant him an anullment. Henry was certainly not in favor of the Reformation, having been granted the title Fidei Defensor for his attacks on it.
    Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

    Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio

    I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

  6. #36
    tWebber Rushing Jaws's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    Near my best friend (see photo above)
    Faith
    Ultramontane Papist XPian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    441
    Amen (Given)
    1426
    Amen (Received)
    87
    Quote Originally Posted by One Bad Pig View Post
    Not especially. It was more or less a unilateral move by King Henry VIII because the pope wouldn't grant him an anullment. Henry was certainly not in favor of the Reformation, having been granted the title Fidei Defensor for his attacks on it.
    Its theology was Protestant from at least the time of Edward VI, its canon of the OT is the Protestant canon, it is referred to, in the Coronation Oath, as “the Protestant Reformed Religion by law established”, its Erastianism, its doctrine of the “godly prince” as “nursing father” of the Church “in this realm of England” were understood in a typically Protestant way, and so on. Its sacramental doctrine is Protestant. And for much of life it was Calvinistically-inclined.

    Henry VIII received that title in 1521 - before the break with Rome in 1534. So his receiving (and retaining) it, is no argument that he did not become a Protestant. Henrician Protestantism had more Catholic ingredients than the Protestantism of his son Edward VI; and the 1559 “settlement of religion” under Elizabeth (1558-1603) was a compromise between the Protestantisms of her father (1509-47) and her half-brother (1547-53). Her rejection of the Catholicism of her half-sister Mary (1553-8), and the replacement of it by Protestant worship and doctrine (as well as a body of legislation making the practice of her sister’s religion illegal, and impossible) shows that Elizabeth was a Protestant. As were, and have been, all her successors save one (who lost his throne as a result).

    The C of E is unequivocally a Protestant Church, not a “Papist” or “Orthodox” one. Having “Catholic” features no more makes it Catholic, than its having “Orthodox” features makes it “Orthodox”. It is neither. Its ethos has always been Protestant, positively as well as negatively. Its Articles, Homilies, Creeds discipline, doctrine and structures are Protestant in matter or tone or both.

  7. #37
    tWebber Rushing Jaws's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    Near my best friend (see photo above)
    Faith
    Ultramontane Papist XPian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    441
    Amen (Given)
    1426
    Amen (Received)
    87
    Quote Originally Posted by Darth Executor View Post
    Protestantism is the Misc. section of Christianity anyway, it's the least likely to unify to anything simply because there'll always be some whackjob who gets butthurt about something and starts a church in his garage.
    At the risk of being “ecumenical”, I don’t think that does justice to the unity of Protestantism. It is primarily a “bearing witness to” certain theological and existential values; only secondarily is it a “bearing witness against” certain other phenomena; as, in the 1520s, it was. The Protestant “impulse” can be defended, even from a Catholic POV, as a legitimate and necessary aspect of a healthy Christianity; what is problematic from that POV is not the impulse itself, but the social form of Protestantism as a body “against” the CC.

    Several of the OT Prophets can be seen as Protestants. The doctrine of biological evolution makes a lot of sense if seen as an example of Protestantism. Rudolf Bultmann’s theology was essentially a development of Lutheranism. The critical study of the Bible follows the logic of Protestantism. It can be argued that these are examples of the Protestant evangelisation of the surrounding culture; of the “cultural mandate” valued by Calvinism.

    ISTM that the unity of Protestantism is as real, in the same way, as forensic righteousness: both can be real, in the eyes of God, without being empirically discernible by man. If it is real in God’s eyes, it is real in the one sense that matters; that it may seem not to be real, or not accessible as a reality, on Earth, is of no importance or relevance whatsoever.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •