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Prepubescent "Transgender Activist"

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  • Originally posted by JimL View Post
    Dysphoria is mental in nature yes, but dysphoria in itself, since in itself it is not the cause of suffering, is not a mental d/o. The cause of the dysphoric's suffering is you.
    So feeling like you are trapped in another body is not stressful or causes suffering? Great. then they don't need treatment. As long as society accepts them as women trapped in men's bodies or vice versa, they can live a normal life without surgery. And as far as I can tell, society accepts that a lot more than it accepts someone who has surgery. I mean how many men would want to date a "woman" who used to be a man? How many dates do you think Caitlin Jenner has gotten compared to Bruce Jenner? Bruce was accepted by society much more than Caitlin. And since society didn't even know about his affliction, they did not treat him badly at all. He was treated like a celebrity! So no suffering! After all you said the only suffering comes from outside, right? But now that he is a she, I bet she gets a lot more negative views and comments from society, which causes more suffering.

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    • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
      Its obvious you didn't even look at these links. Where did you google them from? They don't prove what you claimed. Many are just abstract stubs. The second one is not even about transgendering but about anorexa in those that also are transgender. Well duh. A lot of times mental illness comes in groups. I am sure the guy who wants to be a chicken will be happier if he is treated like a chicken by society, and even gets his feathers. Does that mean the correct treatment is to turn him into a chicken? No.
      The abstracts summarize the papers so you don't need to read/purchase them. Haven't you ever done academic research? The second paper shows how transitioning is treatment. I will not engage with your chicken analogy, as I have explained time and again how it is inapplicable.

      The one about the androgen receptor? That is one of the RARE genetic defects I already mentioned. The body doesn't respond to testosterone and the male develops female secondary sexual characteristics and reduced male genitalia. It is pretty freaking rare and not something that you see in all cases as you were suggesting.
      Right, so are we agreed that genetic abnormalities can result in gender dysphoria, for which treatment may include transitioning through HRT/SRS?

      Your second genetic study:
      "The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders defines transsexualism as the desire to be of the opposite sex or the assertion that one is of the sex opposite from the one assigned at birth (2). It is a rare condition, with incidence rates between 1:12,000 to 1:40,000 (3, 4). The etiology of transsexualism is unknown, but it has been speculated that the influence of sex steroids on early brain development may play an important role (5, 6). Transsexualism may also have a genetic component, based on rare reports of twin–twin concordance and families with several affected members (7). Chromosomal aberrations are not found at an increased rate among both male-to-female (MtF) and female-to-male (FtM) transsexuals based on a study in 30 and 31 affected individuals, respectively (8). In a small series of 29 Swedish MtF transsexuals, however, Henningsson et al. (9) observed an association between MtF transsexualism and a CA repeat polymorphism in the estrogen receptor (ER) beta gene.
      I don't see your point. Nothing you highlighted contradicts my argument.

      At this point it is clear you are just trying to flood with argument by weblinks (which isn't allowed) and haven't even bothered to check your own links. Or maybe you just got a list of links from some other page. Either way, you have not proven anything you claimed.
      You asked for proof of my claims, so I gave you a sampling of the papers that have resulted in the medical consensus on the most probable cause of gender dysphoria and its treatment. You have failed to show any flaw in my sources, and you have refused to provide sources of your own. You're living in a fantasy world.

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      • Originally posted by Jedidiah View Post
        Where is the evidence that gender dysphoria is based on abnormal gene expression and not some emotional reaction like other mental illnesses?
        I linked to two studies that involved genetic correlations. We can also look at how genes result in human sexual dimorphism and how some abnormalities that require HRT/SRS are already genetically established and see how this can theoretically result in gender dysphoria.

        Originally posted by Jedidiah View Post
        And we all know that Psychiatrists and other doctors are immune to having any agenda that would make it worthwhile to be paid to do useless and harmful surgery.
        Somehow I doubt that there's a worldwide conspiracy involving all the medical, scientific, sociological, and psychiatric professional organizations to wring money out of a tiny percentage of the population through useless and harmful surgery that they nonetheless restrict access to, opening themselves up to massive malpractice cases.

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        • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
          So feeling like you are trapped in another body is not stressful or causes suffering? Great. then they don't need treatment. As long as society accepts them as women trapped in men's bodies or vice versa, they can live a normal life without surgery. And as far as I can tell, society accepts that a lot more than it accepts someone who has surgery. I mean how many men would want to date a "woman" who used to be a man? How many dates do you think Caitlin Jenner has gotten compared to Bruce Jenner? Bruce was accepted by society much more than Caitlin. And since society didn't even know about his affliction, they did not treat him badly at all. He was treated like a celebrity! So no suffering! After all you said the only suffering comes from outside, right? But now that he is a she, I bet she gets a lot more negative views and comments from society, which causes more suffering.
          Society didn't accept Bruce Jenner, society, like you, accepted the facade that Bruce Jenner portrayed in order that they accept him. Thats the source of the mental distress sufferred by dysphorics. If people were accdepted for who they are rather than having to play a specific role as dictatated to them by their physical gender and by society then there would be less suffering and less surgery. I believe that the reason behind ones decision for the surgury, the physical change, is because of the harshness on the part of society in regard to gender roles, the unacceptance and the bullying of people who don't fit into those mental, emotional, sexual orientation, societal norms.
          Last edited by JimL; 01-16-2017, 07:22 AM.

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          • Originally posted by Psychic Missile View Post
            The abstracts summarize the papers so you don't need to read/purchase them.
            wait. what? That is your evidence?



            OK I am done here. Thanks for playing.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by JimL View Post
              Society didn't accept Bruce Jenner, society, like you, accepted the facade that Bruce Jenner portrayed in order that they accept him. Thats the source of the mental distress sufferred by dysphorics. If people were accdepted for who they are rather than having to play a specific role as dictatated to them by their physical gender and by society then there would be less suffering and less surgery. I believe that the reason behind ones decision for the surgury, the physical change, is because of the harshness on the part of society in regard to gender roles, the unacceptance and the bullying of people who don't fit into those mental, emotional, sexual orientation, societal norms.
              If society didn't KNOW about Bruce Jenner wanting to be a girl, then society accepted him as he presented himself. He got married, had children, had a life of fame and celebrity. He had a better life than you or I have had. So if he felt any mental distress, it was from himself, wanting to be a girl but not being able to be one. Not from society. So your theory that the mental suffering is imposed from without and not caused from within, is wrong. You just destroyed your own claim. And now that he is a girl, society is still mocking him and not accepting him, so how is that any better mentally for him?

              Nice job JimL. Keep up the good work.

              Comment


              • http://www.breitbart.com/london/2016...m-court-hears/

                Source: http://www.breitbart.com/london/2016/10/22/boy-treated-as-a-girl-by-his-mother-suffered-significant-emotional-harm-court-hears/

                A seven-year-old boy has been removed from his mother’s care by the high court, after he was found to be suffering “significant emotional harm” due to his mother raising him as a girl.
                The judge in the case slammed social services who had simply accepted that the boy should be treated as a girl.

                The High Court judge hearing the case, Mr Justice Hayden, told the court that he believed the mother had been “absolutely convinced” that the boy “perceived himself as a girl” and was therefore determined to treat him as a girl, according to reports.

                However, the boy, who cannot be named and is now living with his father, has naturally reverted to having masculine interests since leaving the care of his mother, the court heard.

                © Copyright Original Source

                “I didn’t go to religion to make me happy. I always knew a bottle of Port would do that. If you want a religion to make you feel really comfortable, I certainly don’t recommend Christianity.” - C.S. Lewis

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