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Thread: Causal Determinism?

  1. #11
    tWebber guacamole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shunyadragon View Post
    An interesting point to consider is Theists may believe in 'Determinism' in that they believe God is the Creator and agent of Determinism.
    Indeed there's a hearty component of determinism in some christianities.
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  2. #12
    tWebber shunyadragon's Avatar
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    From the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy this section clarifies what is "fixed" and to what degree the outcomes are "fixed" in the basic definition provided in this source. Basically there is not just only one outcome that is fixed, but all the possible outcomes are "fixed" based on natural laws.

    Source: https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/determinism-causal/



    Determinism: The world is governed by (or is under the sway of) determinism if and only if, given a specified way things are at a time t, the way things go thereafter is fixed as a matter of natural law.
    Causal Determinism (Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy)

    "2.4 Laws of nature
    In the loose statement of determinism we are working from, metaphors such as “govern” and “under the sway of” are used to indicate the strong force being attributed to the laws of nature. Part of understanding determinism—and especially, whether and why it is metaphysically important—is getting clear about the status of the presumed laws of nature.

    In the physical sciences, the assumption that there are fundamental, exceptionless laws of nature, and that they have some strong sort of modal force, usually goes unquestioned. Indeed, talk of laws “governing” and so on is so commonplace that it takes an effort of will to see it as metaphorical. We can characterize the usual assumptions about laws in this way: the laws of nature are assumed to be pushy explainers. They make things happen in certain ways , and by having this power, their existence lets us explain why things happen in certain ways. (For a defense of this perspective on laws, see Maudlin (2007)). Laws, we might say, are implicitly thought of as the cause of everything that happens. If the laws governing our world are deterministic, then in principle everything that happens can be explained as following from states of the world at earlier times. (Again, we note that even though the entailment typically works in the future→past direction also, we have trouble thinking of this as a legitimate explanatory entailment. In this respect also, we see that laws of nature are being implicitly treated as the causes of what happens: causation, intuitively, can only go past→future.)"

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    Last edited by shunyadragon; 04-13-2017 at 02:05 PM.
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  3. #13
    tWebber 37818's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shunyadragon View Post
    . . . Causal determinism is, roughly speaking, the idea that every event is necessitated by antecedent events and conditions together with the laws of nature.. ..
    From your citation source.

    I am surprised you did not mention quantum mechanics it its role.
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  4. #14
    tWebber shunyadragon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 37818 View Post
    From your citation source.

    I am surprised you did not mention quantum mechanics it its role.
    I am most willing to discuss Quantum Mechanics in its roll in determinism, because ultimately Quantum Mechanics 'determine' the predictable nature of the atomic structure of our physical existence, which is the basis of the predicable nature of the objective evidence used in falsifiable theories and hypothesis in Methodological Naturalism.

    Quantum Mechanics determines that in the macro world that every event is necessitated by antecedent events and conditions together with the laws of nature.
    Last edited by shunyadragon; 04-20-2017 at 02:53 AM.
    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

    go with the flow the river knows . . .

    Frank

    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

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