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  • End Times Evangelism Messages

    Where's our focus?

    The link can be found here.

    ------

    What is our focus in evangelism? Let's plunge into the Deeper Waters and find out.

    Last night, Allie and I were looking for a Christian movie to watch. (To which when she asked why we don't have a lot, I replied that most of them are just awful.) We had been watching The Gospel of Matthew put up on YouTube by The Two Preachers and so after looking for another movie there, we went to their channel to see what they had. One video was about Christmas, to which they gave the right answer. The overwhelming majority were all about end times.

    The ones that we saw began with usually reading a verse. Of course, no context was given to this verse. It was just assumed that this verse had to be fully literal and had to be about our times which would have to be the end times and could have no prior fulfillment. (The prophets obviously weren't interested in the present needs of the people. They just wanted to tell them about events over 2,000 years later.)

    Then there would be some sensational story which was meant to back the event. The last video we saw talked about how important this was because so many people are converting because of these end-times warnings. In fact, many of the skeptics have to be believing it somewhere because they keep watching the videos.

    By this logic, I must be believing atheist books since I read them so often.

    We were also given the challenge that if these aren't signs of the end times, then give what the signs are, using passages like Matthew 24. Of course, I would ask why Matthew 24 couldn't have already been fulfilled. You know, the whole "This generation will not pass away" thing. The futurist paradigm should not be assumed. It should be argued for, much as I would gladly argue for my orthodox Preterism viewpoint.

    Something that did catch me (Allie caught something else that she can write about if she chooses) was the claim that they are seeing many people convert to Jesus through end-times warnings. That could very well be true, yet I wonder is that truly the goal? I have my own problems with the idea of conversion. Making getting conversion to be the goal is like getting people to be married is the goal. Getting married is easy. Having a marriage is work. Getting converted can be easy. Being a disciple is difficult.

    First off, I have this big concern about so many end times predictions being made because they can so easily be found to be false. Anybody remember 88 reasons Jesus will return in 1988? Yep. That took the world by storm and now, it's an embarrassment to Christianity. What about people like Harold Camping and John Hagee and others? The response could normally be "Well yeah, all those people got it wrong, but we're the ones who have it right!"

    After all, you know, our generation is just so awesome that surely Jesus has to return for us!

    Second, let's look at an authoritative list of sermons that we have. How about the book of Acts?

    "Are you sure you want to do that? Don't you know that Peter's first sermon in the book is about the last days?"

    Yes. And those days were his own times right there. It wasn't some time off in the future. The same is found in Hebrews 1 as well. What does Peter go on to say? What is the sign of the last days? God has raised up His Son Jesus. The resurrection was the focus of the message. Because Jesus was resurrected, He is Lord and Christ. Peter didn't stay on the experience. He used the experience to get to Jesus.

    You can find a list of Acts sermons here. Go through. See how many times Paul spoke about the end times or anyone else. No. They spoke about the resurrection. One heading here even is "Paul proclaims his righteousness and judgment to come." That has to be it!" Well, no. You go there and Paul talks about the resurrection.

    Paul was a guy for whom the resurrection of Jesus was central. He built his faith on that. He built it on it so much that in 1 Cor. 15 he said that if Jesus was not raised, we above all men should be pitied. It was the resurrection that established the end times doctrines and what was that end times doctrine? Oh yes. Resurrection.

    When we make the focus be on something other than the resurrection, we are treating that as the foundation of our faith. You should believe in Jesus because of this end times doctrine. No. You should believe in Jesus because He rose from the dead. All the strange phenomena in the world doesn't matter if Jesus is not raised. It's just strange phenomena then.

    My challenge to the Two Preachers then is to focus on the resurrection. Go through the videos and see how many are about the end times and how many are about the resurrection. See if that seems to be a problem or not. It's also what I would recommend to other Christians. Some Christians major so much on end times that they have their charts and graphs all filled out, but they know nothing about how to show Jesus rose from the dead. I'm not saying the Two Preachers couldn't make a case. I hope they could. I'm saying we have a problem in our church when more people know about the end times than they do about the resurrection.

    Some of you will disagree with me on my view of the end times. God bless you. I have no problem with futurists as people. Why would I? I'm married to one. I have a problem with futurism being the focus. (I would have a problem with Preterism being the focus instead of Jesus in fact.) I would say the same with YEC or OEC or inerrancy or any other doctrine.

    Focus on the resurrection. That's your foundation.

    In Christ,
    Nick Peters

  • #2
    Originally posted by Apologiaphoenix View Post
    snip

    After all, you know, our generation is just so awesome that surely Jesus has to return for us!

    snip

    That's like the opposite of any futurist views I've ever encountered. It should be awful instead of awesome.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Cerebrum123 View Post

      That's like the opposite of any futurist views I've ever encountered. It should be awful instead of awesome.
      I think it's actually a bit of both. I think it's that "Yeah. Those others were bad, but we're the exception." Or else it could be some people just can't imagine Jesus not returning in their lifetimes so they can avoid this death and persecution stuff.

      Comment


      • #4
        Jesus can't return in our lifetime. Too many people wouldn't even look up from their phones.
        If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

        Comment


        • #5
          What part of "only the father knows" do people not get.
          The white thrown will come when the timing is right. Some prophecies point to the destruction of the second temple. Jesus is the third temple.
          sigpic

          Comment


          • #6
            Since the day will come like a thief in the night(why does that make me think of a ninja?), maybe people are expecting Jesus to return imminently, so that He doesn't. Because it isn't a surprise if we're expecting it! So, we need to all forget about the idea that Jesus could return in the next 10/20/30/40 years and then He might return! Or keep expecting Him.
            If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

            Comment


            • #7
              He is the divine son of God. He can plan in actuall infinites. When he comes everyone will know. Foe now we just have to pray, dealing with daily temptations and loving our enemies and neighbors. Who often are the same people.
              sigpic

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Apologiaphoenix View Post
                First off, I have this big concern about so many end times predictions being made because they can so easily be found to be false. Anybody remember 88 reasons Jesus will return in 1988? Yep. That took the world by storm and now, it's an embarrassment to Christianity. What about people like Harold Camping and John Hagee and others? The response could normally be "Well yeah, all those people got it wrong, but we're the ones who have it right!"

                After all, you know, our generation is just so awesome that surely Jesus has to return for us!
                Some people alive in 1988 are alive today, so that generation has not passed away.

                Originally posted by Cerebrum123 View Post

                That's like the opposite of any futurist views I've ever encountered. It should be awful instead of awesome.
                I agree, our generation is in many ways awful.

                It's 100 years since Russian Revolution, back then abortion was illegal almost everywhere (except some cases when liberal and anti-Catholic states like Italy allowed it or did not punish it), and now nearly no country in Christendom has a ban on abortion!

                Russia has spread its - post-Revolutionary - error through the world.

                Mussolini banned abortion in Italy after 4 years in power, in 1926 (that is how I came to know liberal Italy had allowed it in the first place) and it seems Putin who as president, or as prime minister of Medvedev, has been in power 12 years has "not been able" to ban abortion yet.

                Our generation is awful.
                http://notontimsblogroundhere.blogspot.fr/p/apologetics-section.html

                Thanks, Sparko, for telling how I add the link here!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Apologiaphoenix View Post
                  Or else it could be some people just can't imagine Jesus not returning in their lifetimes so they can avoid this death and persecution stuff.
                  Yes, I feel somewhat persecuted (like on this site I had two threads in the "padded room") and ... the bad thing is of course, if the apocalyptic end times are coming, as the Fatima revelation indicates, there will be worse persecution ahead.
                  http://notontimsblogroundhere.blogspot.fr/p/apologetics-section.html

                  Thanks, Sparko, for telling how I add the link here!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Christianbookworm View Post
                    Jesus can't return in our lifetime. Too many people wouldn't even look up from their phones.
                    I think that confirms "awful generation" meme ... and I think there could be ways for God to arrange that.

                    Like, what if two persons meet at Harmageddon and Antichrist is the one not looking up ... because he is too busy slaughtering or preparing to slaughter the other ... or take a call in his cell phone?
                    http://notontimsblogroundhere.blogspot.fr/p/apologetics-section.html

                    Thanks, Sparko, for telling how I add the link here!

                    Comment

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