A great grandmother has been praying to Elrond thinking he was Saint Anthony

[Jedidiah]

I am indeed a great grandfather. I have four great grand children.

[Raphael]

I am a great uncle (my eldest niece has two boys)

[mossrose]

I am a great uncle (my eldest niece has two boys)

Got you beat. I am a great great aunt.

My eldest great niece has two boys.

[Adrift]

I am a great uncle (my eldest niece has two boys)

I'm a great uncle cause my nieces told me so. That's how that works, right?

[Adrift]

Kasha says I am a great grandmother.

Let me guess...you pray to a Tom Bombadil figurine, right?

[Adrift]

This is actually 'specialer' than that. It was not ALLOWED to be used outside the Temple at all, at the penalty of being 'cut off' from the congregation.

Exodus 30:31 Say to the Israelites, ‘This is to be my sacred anointing oil for the generations to come.
32 Do not pour it on anyone else’s body and do not make any other oil using the same formula. It is sacred, and you are to consider it sacred.
33 Whoever makes perfume like it and puts it on anyone other than a priest must be cut off from their people.’

It's a pretty interesting study.

That's the the oil concoction, not the incense though, right? Still, I get you're point. Hmm.

[mossrose]

Let me guess...you pray to a Tom Bombadil figurine, right?

I pray to no man made figurine, nor do I pray to any mere human, dead or alive.

[Adrift]

I pray to no man made figurine, nor do I pray to any mere human, dead or alive.

I meant it as a joke of course. But speaking of praying to humans.

In this blog post (and in the comments) New Testament Professor Larry Hurtado pointed out how that, though Paul typically prays to God the father in his epistles, on a few clear occasions he also prays to Jesus.

Jesus is also pictured as recipient of prayers in some NT texts. Mainly, of course, the NT depicts prayers as addressed to God. But in several cases Jesus is recipient or co-recipient. The most common instance seems to have been the corporate acclamation/invocation by which the corporate worship event was constituted, which involved a “calling upon” Jesus. Likewise, in early Christian baptism, one called upon Jesus, invoking him over the baptized person. Indeed, in 1 Cor. 1:2 Paul refers to fellow believers simply as those who everywhere “call upon the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.” Perhaps our earliest reference, however, is 1 Thess. 3:11-13, where God and Jesus are jointly called upon to enable Paul to re-visit the Thessalonian church. Other instances can be cited (e.g., 2 Thess. 2:16-17), and in 2 Cor. 12:6-10 Paul refers to his repeated appeals to Jesus to relieve him of the “thorn in the flesh.” The oft-cited “maranatha” in 1 Cor. 16:22 indicates that the liturgical invocation of Jesus was practiced in Aramaic-speaking circles of believers as well as in Greek-speaking circles.

Scripture Verse: 1 Thessalonians 3:11

Now may our God and Father himself, and our Lord Jesus, direct our way to you, 12 and may the Lord make you increase and abound in love for one another and for all, as we do for you, 13 so that he may establish your hearts blameless in holiness before our God and Father, at the coming of our Lord Jesus with all his saints.

© Copyright Original Source

Scripture Verse: 2 Thessalonians 2:16-17

Now may our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God our Father, who loved us and gave us eternal comfort and good hope through grace, 17 comfort your hearts and establish them in every good work and word.

© Copyright Original Source

Scripture Verse: 2 Corinthians 12:8

Three times I pleaded with the Lord about this, that it should leave me. 9 But he said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness.” Therefore I will boast all the more gladly of my weaknesses, so that the power of Christ may rest upon me. 10 For the sake of Christ, then, I am content with weaknesses, insults, hardships, persecutions, and calamities. For when I am weak, then I am strong.

© Copyright Original Source

Personally, I usually pray in the name of Jesus, but it doesn't seem completely out there to pray to Jesus. I thought that was interesting. What are your thoughts?

[mossrose]

I meant it as a joke of course.

I knew you meant it as a joke. And I also know who TB is.

But speaking of praying to humans.

In this blog post (and in the comments) New Testament Professor Larry Hurtado pointed out how that, though Paul typically prays to God the father in his epistles, on a few clear occasions he also prays to Jesus.

Jesus is also pictured as recipient of prayers in some NT texts. Mainly, of course, the NT depicts prayers as addressed to God. But in several cases Jesus is recipient or co-recipient. The most common instance seems to have been the corporate acclamation/invocation by which the corporate worship event was constituted, which involved a calling upon Jesus. Likewise, in early Christian baptism, one called upon Jesus, invoking him over the baptized person. Indeed, in 1 Cor. 1:2 Paul refers to fellow believers simply as those who everywhere call upon the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. Perhaps our earliest reference, however, is 1 Thess. 3:11-13, where God and Jesus are jointly called upon to enable Paul to re-visit the Thessalonian church. Other instances can be cited (e.g., 2 Thess. 2:16-17), and in 2 Cor. 12:6-10 Paul refers to his repeated appeals to Jesus to relieve him of the thorn in the flesh. The oft-cited maranatha in 1 Cor. 16:22 indicates that the liturgical invocation of Jesus was practiced in Aramaic-speaking circles of believers as well as in Greek-speaking circles.

Scripture Verse: 1 Thessalonians 3:11

Now may our God and Father himself, and our Lord Jesus, direct our way to you, 12 and may the Lord make you increase and abound in love for one another and for all, as we do for you, 13 so that he may establish your hearts blameless in holiness before our God and Father, at the coming of our Lord Jesus with all his saints.

© Copyright Original Source

Scripture Verse: 2 Thessalonians 2:16-17

Now may our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God our Father, who loved us and gave us eternal comfort and good hope through grace, 17 comfort your hearts and establish them in every good work and word.

© Copyright Original Source

Scripture Verse: 2 Corinthians 12:8

Three times I pleaded with the Lord about this, that it should leave me. 9 But he said to me, My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness. Therefore I will boast all the more gladly of my weaknesses, so that the power of Christ may rest upon me. 10 For the sake of Christ, then, I am content with weaknesses, insults, hardships, persecutions, and calamities. For when I am weak, then I am strong.

© Copyright Original Source

Personally, I usually pray in the name of Jesus, but it doesn't seem completely out there to pray to Jesus. I thought that was interesting. What are your thoughts?

I believe we can pray at any time to any member of the Trinity. I found myself, when my kids were little, and now with my girl, praying with them to Jesus, because it seemed to be an easier concept for them for some reason.

Most of my own prayer is directed to the Father, and like you, I pray asking in Jesus name. I think I need to pray MORE to Christ and the Spirit, though.

A funny thing that has happened since The Girl came along......I am so used to closing my prayer with, "in Jesus' name", that my husband pointed out to me that I was doing the same in my simple prayers with her.

So, "Dear Jesus..........in Jesus' name, amen".

Nothing wrong with it, but he thinks it might be confusing to the girlie, so I just try to end with a simple amen.

[rogue06]

http://www.independent.ie/entertainm...-35343480.html

A great grandmother has accidentally been praying to a Lord of the Rings figure, thinking it was Saint Anthony.

The discovery was made by a woman whose daughter's great grandmother prays to the figurine each day.
Upon inspection, however, the woman, who lives in Brazil, realised that the figurine was of Elrond, an elf from Lord of the Rings, and not Saint Anthony.

She posted the realisation to Facebook, and it has since gone viral with over 3.5k shares.



"The funniest discovery of 2016," she wrote.

When Elrond and Saint Anthony are compared to each other, we can kind of see how she got confused. Kind of.

Supposedly a number of people have confused pictures of Ewan McGregor as Obi-Wan Kenobi for pictures of Jesus.

maxresdefault.jpg 04b92dd1633e33ffec2c7501cc20dd75.jpg

[rogue06]

I am a great uncle (my eldest niece has two boys)

I'm a great uncle




And a pretty good great uncle as well.

[Jedidiah]

Got you best. I am a great great aunt.

My eldest great niece has two boys.

I am a great uncle several times over, but no great great to my knowledge. Yet.

[Bisto]

Supposedly a number of people have confused pictures of Ewan McGregor as Obi-Wan Kenobi for pictures of Jesus.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]20384[/ATTACH] [ATTACH=CONFIG]20385[/ATTACH]

Depending on how recent this is, it may have to do with the fact that Ewan McGregor portrayed Jesus in the movie 'Last Days in the Desert'. Or his casting . I haven't watched it, but it sounds interesting.

[Spartacus]

"Pray" is actually the word the Brazilian granddaughter-in-law, Gabriela Brandão uses. "A bisavó da minha filha reza pra esse Santo Antônio todos os dias/My daughter's great-grandmother prays to this Saint Anthony every day". In my experiences, especially among the poor lay Catholics I knew growing up in a Portuguese and Irish neighborhood in New England, the distinction between praying to a figurine/statue, and using a figurine/statue as a devotional aid was fuzzy at best. I know there's official Church doctrine on the subject that goes into it in depth, but the lines seem to get crossed a bit in the pew.

The statue or painting may represent the saint, but it's not ACTUALLY the saint. Iconoclasm is not murder, and I defy you to find someone who thinks it is. And yet if I were to take a picture of my grandmother out of its frame on the wall and tear it up, that action means more than just tearing up a piece of paper, doesn't it?

I don't have a problem with someone saying the phrase "praying to" with respect to a statue or image- it's a workable shorthand- but don't assume a simplistic interpretation, especially one that acribes to them both stupidity and idolatry, can actually adequately explain or describe someone else's spiritual life and relationship with God. Besides, if y'all protestants ever actually want to accuse Catholics of idolatry, you'd have much better luck focusing on the Eucharist than on the saints.

I didn't know that Harry Potter was deliberately Christian. Someone in another comment chain suggested that St. Anthony is the patron saint of lost articles, and that a lot of Irish pray to him when they lose something, and in the same way, Elrond could be said to be the patron saint of lost rings.

I meant to say the former two. Narnia is the most obviously Christian allegory, and Tolkien draws on a number of Christian themes. Rowling arguably does as well, though I don't know if that interpretation of HP is as commonly accepted.

[Adrift]

The statue or painting may represent the saint, but it's not ACTUALLY the saint.

Oh, Of course, and I understand that's how it's supposed to be understood, and is likely understood by many pious Catholics, especially those who've had any sort of parochial upbringing.

Iconoclasm is not murder, and I defy you to find someone who thinks it is. And yet if I were to take a picture of my grandmother out of its frame on the wall and tear it up, that action means more than just tearing up a piece of paper, doesn't it?

True, and that's an interesting way of looking at it, yet, the sanctification of icons, relics, and the like means more than that, doesn't it? It's not simply sentimental value attributed to these things, but something...divine, right?

I don't have a problem with someone saying the phrase "praying to" with respect to a statue or image- it's a workable shorthand- but don't assume a simplistic interpretation, especially one that acribes to them both stupidity and idolatry, can actually adequately explain or describe someone else's spiritual life and relationship with God. Besides, if y'all protestants ever actually want to accuse Catholics of idolatry, you'd have much better luck focusing on the Eucharist than on the saints.

In your experience as a Catholic, have you ever come across a fellow Catholic that had what you would consider an...unhealthy understanding and devotion towards religious statues and figurines? I certainly have run across people like that on the Protestant side. For instance, I know a lot of people who would consider themselves Christian because they believe in what basically amounts to a sort of cosmic karma. Their understanding of Christianity is essentially limited to the idea that if they're relatively good people (compared to those really bad people out there) then they'll go to heaven one day, and meet a God who has a white beard, and wears white robes, and they'll float into the sky and sit on clouds talking to their family members for all eternity. The significance of the cross, their own sin, and Jesus' death is completely lost on them. I think this sort of karmic version of Christianity-lite that they believe in his potentially damning, yet, I don't think they're stupid for holding these views, only misinformed. I know other people who would consider themselves a sort of Protestant who believe in a sort of New Age angelology, and have a very unhealthy devotion towards angels. In fact, some of that devotion can get downright demonic in my opinion. Again, I don't think these people are stupid, just ignorant of the truth.

I meant to say the former two. Narnia is the most obviously Christian allegory, and Tolkien draws on a number of Christian themes. Rowling arguably does as well, though I don't know if that interpretation of HP is as commonly accepted.

Oh, ok. That makes a lot more sense.