The Evangelical Universalist - will everyone be saved?

[justinbrierley]

Check out the "Unbelievable?" show of 17 October 2009 dealing with Robin Parry, commissioning editor of Paternoster in the UK, "Coming out" of the evangelical closet to state his beliefs in universalism.

Fascinating discussion with Robin. Whether he can remain in the fold of an evangelical publisher holding the view he does remains to be seen.

Robin believes his view to be Biblically sound. How would some of our atheist friends feel about the idea that they too are bound for eternal glory, whether they feel like it in this life or not?

And what do Christians make of the idea? He proposes that everyone who goes to hell will ultimately choose to be redeemed from hell.

Two questions arise for me... Is there evidence biblically that redemption is still possible beyond the grave, and does this idea not transgress free will? Will everyone really ultimately choose to love God of their own free will? How can we know that?

Ok that was four questions.

[Abelard]

The problem with Universalism is that eternal life starts when one accepts Christ, and if you are in Christ eternal life is a present reality.

From an eschatalogical standpoint it would be a wonderful thing if Parry is right and the rest of Christianity is wrong, but I still prefer to enjoy the assurance and joy provided by the fruits of the spirit today.

Eternal life starts today and continues forever. Whatever "evidence" Parry has come up with, he still needs to address the part of eternal life I call "today".

[ApologiaPhoenix]

I thought Parry's opponent did a stellar job. It was clear that Parry had not thought through the implications of his position or any of the hard questions for it.

[R. Hoeppner]

Gee, I guess the martyrs should have just backed off and or kept silent since everyone is going to be saved. And think of how much money is being wasted on missions! And why worry about Islam...just let them do what they do and don't fret since they're going to go to heaven anyway?
What idiocy!

[Bernie]

The problem with Universalism is that eternal life starts when one accepts Christ, and if you are in Christ eternal life is a present reality.

This is popular Arminian doctrine, but not necessarily true. Jesus' teaching on being born of the Spirit (Jn 3:5-8) is essentially that man plays no more part in spiritual birth than he does controlling the wind. There are a number of logicial inconsistencies attached to the idea that man initiates his own spiritual birth (and thus controls his own spiritual destiny), which have been debated to death here and elsewhere. Point is, if this is the main "problem" you find with universalism is a logically defective doctrine, then the salvation of all suffers no real damage.

And an aside to AP, Parry's opponent did a "stellar job"? Of what? He barely spoke. Could the fact that you agree with him make such minor commentary sound 'stellar'?

IMHO, the real key to the issue was only touched upon by Robin Parry when he made a comment re one of his opponent's arguments (which were surprisingly trite and well-worn, given the information at the beginning of the show that he was about to publish what one would safely assume will be a refutation of Christian universalism) that his disagreement was more a "matter for interpretation". Interpretation is key to understanding how and where God shows in Scripture not only how, to whom and when salvation occurs, but what salvation actually consists in. Robin Parry, like virtually all contemporary Christian universalists, have been shown intuitively that God will save all, but only the rational estoericists have a workable, Scriptural universalist theology showing how God does it.

[lee_merrill]

Gee, I guess the martyrs should have just backed off and or kept silent since everyone is going to be saved. And think of how much money is being wasted on missions! And why worry about Islam...just let them do what they do and don't fret since they're going to go to heaven anyway?

I believe his view is that people do go to hell, and from there they may repent. This would give reason to speak to them.

Blessings,
Lee

[elija.wattson]

The Rich Man and Lazarus - by J. Patching -Contrary to the "traditional" interpretation of this parable, Hell is NOT the subject matter. Jesus, in this parable as well as others explains that the kingdom of God is about to be taken from Israel and to be given to another nation which will bring forth the fruits which Israel did not bring forth.Arguments in Favor of Christian Universalism - Chapter 20 of a book by E.E. Guild - Those who embrace Universal Salvation are often accused of believing in a doctrine which has no Biblical basis. This book excerpt will thoroughly refute such an opinion.

Why live a good life if all will be saved? -- Charles Slagle

[KingsGambit]

Evangelical Universalism is an oxymoron.