Islam and liberty

[CuriousBob]

I had to tweak one of the points I made in haste.

It should read thus:

Typically, Islam (at its worst) and Christianity (at its best) might glorify a character like the Christ of Christianity a lot more so than it would of an outrageously intolerable character

[CuriousBob]

I had to tweak one of the points I made in haste.

It should read thus:

Typically, Islam (at its worst) and Christianity (at its best) might glorify a character like the Christ of Christianity a lot more so than it would of an outrageously intolerable character

That is, an outrageously intolerable character like Hitler

[CuriousBob]

we can clearly see what you want Islam to portray


(anyone have a reason to consider this person honest, sincere, or credible?)

I can clearly see what you want everyone here to think Islam is. Also, I can vividly see that you are speaking for yourself only. Also, I can see clearly that your religious discussions reek with the reasoning of a typical leftist / collectivist / Mohammedan.

I can see clearly that you don't like the fact that an ever increasing number of non-Muslims are beginning to do their own homework and are quickly discovering the truth behind everything I am saying about Islam.

Let me guess: If you are not a Mohammedan, then you are either a very ill-informed wishful thinker, a communist-like left-wing fanatic, or a fascist from the far right.

What prompted me to say this? Your words, perhaps, which lead me to believe that you are most at home with the anti-Jews and anti-Christians that all true Mohammedans have amply demonstrated themselves to be.

Islam portrays itself most accurately through the texts that settle all disputes among Mohammedans. All Mohammedans would agree with that statement because they all point to those texts whenever they discuss differences between their various beliefs.

I have studied those texts very carefully and my conclusions are based largely on that careful study.

You speak like a politically correct individual. And I don't agree with today's politically correct points of view because I am convinced, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that they are more in keeping with the most oppressive points of view that bullies, collectivists, or the worst of criminals have managed to legalize. These are the types of people that would make it a crime to snitch on them.

All I am attempting to do here is snitch on the ruthless and barbaric criminals or bullies behind the movement that seek to cause the whole world to submit to a certain mental disease called "Sharia" or "Islam". And politically correct people, like yourself, are doing everything they can to de-ligitimize the words of everything that snitches, like I, have to say against their politically correct, though actually incorrect ways of portraying Islam and other things that advance their corrupt and hidden agendas.

[barnasha]

saying islam is "at best" something that promotes "hatred" is an inarguably ignorant statement.

there are plenty of muslims out there saying the opposite, your stance just shows that you would prefer to ignore them or any other message of hope or peace and look for ways to divide mankind.

we will have no problem exposing that.

[Dan Zebiri]

Then you, barnasha, instead of being a wild-headed propogandist of the confused teachings of islam, gotta ALSO learn stick to the POINTS, and try to explain the bigotry that the QURAN ITSELF promotes and enjoins... :

Like the ones found here : Sura at-tauba v. 28 claims :

O ye who believe! Truly the Pagans are unclean; so let them not, after this year of theirs, approach the Sacred Mosque. And if ye fear poverty, soon will God enrich you, if He wills, out of His bounty, for God is All-knowing, All-wise.

This means that all the non-muslim pagans are najasun - they are ALL FILTH. This is a MOST BIGOTED Statement. And you muslims cannot prove otherwise..(can you, barnasha..? Try...)

And likewise sura 9/29 claims :

Fight those who believe not in God nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by God and His Apostle, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.

The muslims MUST ALWAYS fight, Kill and attack the people of the Book! That is the Jews and the Christians-Thats according to the teaching of THIS verse! (can you explain otherwise, muslims?)

WHY? What is their 'crime'??! Nothing much - ONLY Unbelief in islam and muhammad the founder of islam!

These people of the Book were not fighting or attacking the muslims AT ALL, WERE THEY???!?

Their 'sin' or 'crime' was only to CHOOSE to not follow islam. and to not believe in islam. THAT is enough for muslims to attack them and take them as the enemy.

So, islam is indeed the most BIGOTED religion in the world, too. As all this is taught and commanded in the quran itself.


Do STICK TO THE POINT, islamophile barnasha! And do all of us here a favor, explain to all here INTELLIGENTLY, that the above ayats (verses) from your quran are NOT Bigotry. And try not to deflect away from this by talking/writing about ME, instead..

Wasallaam.

According to you, hardly a level-headed commentator. I put you in that category along with the extremist muslim preachers... people who have their own agendas and use religion to further it.

[barnasha]

we know YOU advocate violence dan, not all do.

[Dan Zebiri]

Do I REALLY,...?? LOLLL...Advocate violence!??

Well now, when you are desperate to avoid giving a logical and sensible answer to the points raised, Or cannot do so, its always nice to throw up some non-sense like that, barnasha..:-))

Now, just Why don't you REALLY learn to stick to the facts, and give a thoughtful, intelligent reply to what I raised about the LIBEL of the q

[Dan Zebiri]

Now, just Why don't you REALLY learn to stick to the facts, and give a thoughtful, intelligent reply to what I raised about the LIBEL of the quran against Non-Muslims?

That the quran denigrates non-muslims and maligns them with bigoted labels that is totally UNCALLED FOR? Like :-

Like the ones found here : Sura at-tauba v. 28 claims :

O ye who believe! Truly the Pagans are unclean; so let them not, after this year of theirs, approach the Sacred Mosque. And if ye fear poverty, soon will God enrich you, if He wills, out of His bounty, for God is All-knowing, All-wise.

This means that all the non-muslim pagans are najasun - they are ALL FILTH. This is a MOST BIGOTED Statement. And you muslims cannot prove otherwise..(can you, barnasha..? Try...)

And likewise sura 9/29 claims :

Fight those who believe not in God nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by God and His Apostle, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.

The muslims MUST ALWAYS fight, Kill and attack the people of the Book! That is the Jews and the Christians-Thats according to the teaching of THIS verse! (can you explain otherwise, muslims?)

WHY? What is their 'crime'??! Nothing much - ONLY Unbelief in islam and muhammad the founder of islam!

These people of the Book were not fighting or attacking the muslims AT ALL, WERE THEY???!?

Their 'sin' or 'crime' was only to CHOOSE to not follow islam. and to not believe in islam. THAT is enough for muslims to attack them and take them as the enemy.

So, islam is indeed the most BIGOTED religion in the world, too. As all this is taught and commanded in the quran itself. WHY oh why does the quran need to malign and denigrate the non-muslims as 'najasoon' / najis' ie. as 'faeces'??

This is 20 percent of the world, mocking the Other 80 percent of the world and labelling them as 'najis'! Ie.as human and animal refuse!! WHY does islam and the quran, muhamad & Allah need to demean and denigrate people in that way?

If THAT is not the bigotry of islam, then show us what really is!

Do STICK TO THE POINT, islamophile barnasha! And do all of us here a favor, explain to all here INTELLIGENTLY, that the above ayats (verses) from your quran are NOT Bigotry. And try not to deflect away from this by talking/writing about ME, instead..

Wasallaam.

Do I REALLY,...?? LOLLL...Advocate violence!??

Well now, when you are desperate to avoid giving a logical and sensible answer to the points raised, Or cannot do so, its always nice to throw up some non-sense like that, barnasha..:-))

Now, just Why don't you REALLY learn to stick to the facts, and give a thoughtful, intelligent reply to what I raised about the LIBEL of the q

[barnasha]

plenty of people use the authentic Islamic traditions to speak out against domestic violence, but sadly, you are not on their side.

and you will refuse to be, since you don't care about women's issues, you care about BADMOUTHING.

remove the venom from your tongue

[CuriousBob]

plenty of people use the authentic Islamic traditions to speak out against domestic violence, but sadly, you are not on their side.

and you will refuse to be, since you don't care about women's issues, you care about BADMOUTHING.

remove the venom from your tongue

This is another prime example of what I mean when I suggest that "the last and the greatest of the prophets" along with those who pay the most respect to him and his blasphemously ridiculous doctrines cannot help but reason like spoiled, hurt, or emotionally disturbed children. They can't answer objections to the lunacy that is most sacred to them any more brilliantly than a spoiled, hurt, or emotionally child ever could.

[CuriousBob]

Muhammadans simply can't reply to a post like Dan's last one without resorting to the reasoning of a spoiled, hurt, or emotionally disturbed child. It is beyond the capacity of their gullible, heavily brainwashed, minds to reason any better than a wishful thinker or brainless puppet when it comes to owning up to the cursed and outrageously ridiculous lunacy that Islam's lone prophet introduced to the world, through his obviously ridiculous recitations, through his favorite wives, through his closest companions, through his official biographer, and through his official Islamic historian.

[barnasha]

because we don't play along with smear jobs, that makes us above the "rabble rousers".

you're welcome to join us up here any time. i sincerely welcome you to join us in honest and open discussion. some of us will not take part in hateful or slanderous behavior.

I suggest to those who do, to read the book of Proverbs instead of typing fingers on this site.

[Dan Zebiri]

The real and true rabble-rouser here, barnasha, is the quran - for instance in sura at-tauba (9).

Why does the quran need to deneigrate other people?? JUST answer that question without any more of your senseless waffling, barney!

Now, just Why don't you REALLY learn to stick to the facts, and give a thoughtful, intelligent reply to what I raised about the LIBEL of the quran against Non-Muslims?

That the quran denigrates non-muslims and maligns them with bigoted labels that is totally UNCALLED FOR? Like :-

Like the ones found here : Sura at-tauba v. 28 claims :

O ye who believe! Truly the Pagans are unclean; so let them not, after this year of theirs, approach the Sacred Mosque. And if ye fear poverty, soon will God enrich you, if He wills, out of His bounty, for God is All-knowing, All-wise.

This means that all the non-muslim pagans are najasun - they are ALL FILTH. This is a MOST BIGOTED Statement. And you muslims cannot prove otherwise..(can you, barnasha..? Try...)

And likewise sura 9/29 claims :

Fight those who believe not in God nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by God and His Apostle, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.

The muslims MUST ALWAYS fight, Kill and attack the people of the Book! That is the Jews and the Christians-Thats according to the teaching of THIS verse! (can you explain otherwise, muslims?)

WHY? What is their 'crime'??! Nothing much - ONLY Unbelief in islam and muhammad the founder of islam!

These people of the Book were not fighting or attacking the muslims AT ALL, WERE THEY???!?

Their 'sin' or 'crime' was only to CHOOSE to not follow islam. and to not believe in islam. THAT is enough for muslims to attack them and take them as the enemy.

Thus, islam is indeed the most BIGOTED religion in the world, too.

As all this is taught and commanded in the quran itself. WHY oh why does the quran need to malign and denigrate the non-muslims as 'najasoon' / najis' ie. as 'faeces'??

This is 20 percent of the world, mocking, insulting and leering at the Other 80 percent of the world and labelling them as 'najis'! Ie.as human and animal refuse!!

WHY does islam and the quran, muhamad & Allah need to demean, insult and denigrate non-muslim people in that way?

If THAT is not the bigotry of islam, then show us what really is!

Do STICK TO THE POINT, islamophile barnasha! And do all of us here a favor, explain to all here INTELLIGENTLY, that the above ayats (verses) from your quran are NOT Bigotry. And try not to deflect away from this by talking/writing about ME, instead..

Wasallaam.

[beanfarmer]

Would you write a letter of protest to the government in Malaysia or a letter to sudan to protest the genocide in darfur? Imagine if thousands of Muslims wrote letters. It would surely count for more than threats from nonMuslims. If not all your statements about peace loving Muslims are moot because none of you peaceful Muslims will do a thing to stop it.

[CuriousBob]

saying islam is "at best" something that promotes "hatred" is an inarguably ignorant statement.

there are plenty of muslims out there saying the opposite, your stance just shows that you would prefer to ignore them or any other message of hope or peace and look for ways to divide mankind.

we will have no problem exposing that.

I say that the "plenty of Muslims" to which you refer are either grossly ignorant or deliberate liars when it comes to owning up to the fact that Islam places a whole lot more emphasis upon hatred of all who oppose Islam than it does upon love of everyone. After all, the texts that settle all disputes among Muslims clearly do a lot more to inspire Muslims to lie about their outrageous, ridiculous, and blasphemous ideology when they have little or no military/political might than it does anything to the contrary.