Abortion

[Darth Ovious]

the only valid point is the tip of your dunce hat.

He doesn't even have that. He ruined the tip of the dunce hat by putting it on the wrong way all the time.

[Challenger Grim]

He doesn't even have that. He ruined the tip of the dunce hat by putting it on the wrong way all the time.

You mean he was trying to wear it on his other end?

[Darth Ovious]

You mean he was trying to wear it on his other end?

Probably why he always in a grumpy mood. Sore head.

[Cybelle Hawke]

Yo Lunch, you first say that the baby of a pregnant woman does not count and is considered insignificant in the bible (exodus).... you say that in the bible they do not care about the baby, just the mother.

Now you say that the prosecutor in the mentioned homocide case who does count the baby of a pregnant woman must be a christian, and you oppose to that as well.

On top of this, you state that abortion is something between the physician and the patient only... but what about the baby? is it in the room? And how about its father does he have rights?

When the life we carry in our body has not come to live yet, does not make it dead. If the mother is murdered, the baby is mudered as well. I do not see why this fact has to be denied during the process. Does not the father loose both his wife and his baby?

I also do not understand why you fight christians for it, as one does not have to be a christian to be against abortion. Nor does one have to be an atheist to be pro choice.

[yo lunch]

No, no it's not.

True, and your point was absurd!

[yo lunch]

Yo Lunch, you first say that the baby of a pregnant woman does not count and is considered insignificant in the bible (exodus).... you say that in the bible they do not care about the baby, just the mother.

Now you say that the prosecutor in the mentioned homocide case who does count the baby of a pregnant woman must be a christian, and you oppose to that as well.

On top of this, you state that abortion is something between the physician and the patient only... but what about the baby? is it in the room? And how about its father does he have rights?

When the life we carry in our body has not come to live yet, does not make it dead. If the mother is murdered, the baby is mudered as well. I do not see why this fact has to be denied during the process. Does not the father loose both his wife and his baby?

I also do not understand why you fight christians for it, as one does not have to be a christian to be against abortion. Nor does one have to be an atheist to be pro choice.

Non-Christians do not, for the most part, try to put their religious views in legislation and inflict their moral values on those who do not share their views.

The laws, in most states, do not consider the fetus a person! Let the Christian legislators have their way and that will change. Other than an antiquated mandate intended for a tribe of Jews, I don't think, based on the Bible, that you have a leg to stand on! Just go to church and leave others alone! Don't bring it to civil matters. After all, the Bible says to render unto Caesar...

[Challenger Grim]

True, and your point was absurd!

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

[joel]

Non-Christians do not, for the most part, try to put their religious views in legislation and inflict their moral values on those who do not share their views.

That's ridiculous. Name one bit of legislation that someone argues for that is not based on their understanding of morality.
How can we know what laws we ought to pass without considering morality? The very question is self-contradictory.

The laws, in most states, do not consider the fetus a person! Let the Christian legislators have their way and that will change. Other than an antiquated mandate intended for a tribe of Jews, I don't think, based on the Bible, that you have a leg to stand on! Just go to church and leave others alone! Don't bring it to civil matters. After all, the Bible says to render unto Caesar...

Pro-lifers do not typically hold their position due to an explicit reference from the Bible. There are many athiest pro-lifers. The pro-life argument is sound and does not require the Bible to make the case. It is misconception to think that this is just a religious doctrine.

[yo lunch]

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

Your posts are the epitome of the word!

[yo lunch]

Originally posted by Joel

That's ridiculous. Name one bit of legislation that someone argues for that is not based on their understanding of morality.
How can we know what laws we ought to pass without considering morality? The very question is self-contradictory.

The key words are morality based on religious inculcation from the Bible. Of course, everyone has moral values that they bring to any decisions.

Originally posted by Joel

Pro-lifers do not typically hold their position due to an explicit reference from the Bible. There are many athiest pro-lifers. The pro-life argument is sound and does not require the Bible to make the case. It is misconception to think that this is just a religious doctrine.

I know they don't use the Bible exclusively because no prohibition is in there about abortion. However, they do use religion as a basis for their beliefs about morals.

Certainly many who do not condone abortion are not Christians. My point is that most of those who are against it are not standing outside abortion clinics protesting the issue the way Christians do. Neither are they the ones who are killing doctors over the matter!

[Challenger Grim]

The key words are morality based on religious inculcation from the Bible. Of course, everyone has moral values that they bring to any decisions.

So I'm guessing you had a real problem with the abolition movement huh? Does it eat you up every day that those slaves got free because of the religious folks?

[Darth Ovious]

I know they don't use the Bible exclusively because no prohibition is in there about abortion. However, they do use religion as a basis for their beliefs about morals.

A religious belief =/= mean a false belief.

The Bible also teaches that murder is wrong, are you going to deny that just because religious people affirm it?

How about I use Science instead. Here are two Scientidic facts about a fetus.

1) It is 100% human DNA. It's not Chicken DNA, it's not Dog DNA. It doesn't start off with some other DNA structure and then magically becomes human DNA. It is human DNA from conception.

2) The fetus stage of the human life cycle is a stage that every human being goes through. You were a fetus, I was a fetus, everybody who posts on this forum was a fetus at one point. It is a normal stage of human development. In fact it is the only stage that every human being goes through. Not every human being reaches old age, not every human being reaches middle age but every human being was/is at one point a fetus.

These two facts show one thing. A fetus is a human being. It's only a short inference from here to suggest that they should be entitled to human rights like every other human being.

[yo lunch]

So I'm guessing you had a real problem with the abolition movement huh? Does it eat you up every day that those slaves got free because of the religious folks?

What slaves are you referring to? Many ethinc groups and countries had slavery. Even the OT Jews were subjects of many rulers.

If you are talking about the Blacks, then perhaps you should review your history and you will see that many factions extricated them from slavery. It was the Civil War the did the deed!

[yo lunch]

A religious belief =/= mean a false belief.

The Bible also teaches that murder is wrong, are you going to deny that just because religious people affirm it?

How about I use Science instead. Here are two Scientidic facts about a fetus.

1) It is 100% human DNA. It's not Chicken DNA, it's not Dog DNA. It doesn't start off with some other DNA structure and then magically becomes human DNA. It is human DNA from conception.

2) The fetus stage of the human life cycle is a stage that every human being goes through. You were a fetus, I was a fetus, everybody who posts on this forum was a fetus at one point. It is a normal stage of human development. In fact it is the only stage that every human being goes through. Not every human being reaches old age, not every human being reaches middle age but every human being was/is at one point a fetus.

These two facts show one thing. A fetus is a human being. It's only a short inference from here to suggest that they should be entitled to human rights like every other human being.

Many a fetus starts out in a lab dish, aborted and never see a womb! In fact, man has created a living organism in the lab! So, does that make man a Creator, a God? Would it be "murder" to terminate the existence of his creation?

[Darth Ovious]

Many a fetus starts out in a lab dish, aborted and never see a womb! In fact, man has created a living organism in the lab! So, does that make man a Creator, a God? Would it be "murder" to terminate the existence of his creation?

So some fetus' start in a lab, so what? How does this relate to those who are pregnant and decide to abort? Perhaps you can explain further on this. Do they start off alive in the lab and then end up dead?

It would be murder because scientists in a lab are not responsible for the creation of the human race. All they have done is create an equal to themselves. You forget that my argument with God has 2 things and then an added 3rd for your argument to boot.

1) God is creator of everything, human beings and Universe included. His domain, his rules buster. If you don't like his rules then you know where to go.

2) God is higher than us on the hierarchy of being

3) Your critique on my previous explanation for God does nothing to justify people in society who decide to have abortions.

Perhaps you should try again.