God is "plural" in the Qu'ran?

[mitzi]

God said, "Where art thou?" (Genesis 3:10)

“Where did you come from?
I do not know your faces.
What are your names?” said Cabracan. (Popol Vuh).

Cabracan = Abel

Hence, God not Author of doubt.

LINK

To repeat: "If, then, any reader shall say, This is not well said, because I do not understand it; such an one finds fault with my language, not with my faith: and it might perhaps in very truth have been put more clearly; yet no man ever so spoke as to be understood in all things by all men. Let him, therefore, who finds this fault with my discourse, see whether he can understand other men who have handled similar subjects and questions, when he does not understand me: and if he can, let him put down my book, or even, if he pleases, throw it away; and let him spend labor and time rather on those whom he understands"

[mitzi]

Hi Mastralvarado:

In Genesis 1: 2 "Now the earth was [a] formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters. 3 And God said, "Let there be light," and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and He separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light "day," and the darkness he called "night." And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day." So as I read this passage I think that God created light (not the light from the sun, moon or stars) but light - God separated both the light and darkness - as the story of creation continues the sun governs the day as the moon governs the night. The separation starts - and ends with "And God saw the light, that it was good". A phrase "out of the darkness comes the light" which can mean a light that is present within the hidden essence of all existence. God formed light and created darkness. The meaning of the verse had dualism - 2 Corinthians 4:6

In Isaiah 45:7 (New International Version)

7 I form the light and create darkness,
I bring prosperity and create disaster;
I, the LORD, do all these things.

[OneSizeFit]

In Isaiah 45:7 (New International Version)

7 I form the light and create darkness,
I bring prosperity and create disaster;
I, the LORD, do all these things.

al-Mumît, God as the destroyer.

[mastralvarado]

Hi Mastralvarado:

In Genesis 1: 2 "Now the earth was [a] formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters. 3 And God said, "Let there be light," and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and He separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light "day," and the darkness he called "night." And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day." So as I read this passage I think that God created light (not the light from the sun, moon or stars) but light - God separated both the light and darkness - as the story of creation continues the sun governs the day as the moon governs the night. The separation starts - and ends with "And God saw the light, that it was good". A phrase "out of the darkness comes the light" which can mean a light that is present within the hidden essence of all existence. God formed light and created darkness. The meaning of the verse had dualism - 2 Corinthians 4:6

In Isaiah 45:7 (New International Version)

7 I form the light and create darkness,
I bring prosperity and create disaster;
I, the LORD, do all these things.

Salam Mitzi,

You basically mean: God creates good and evil (both in a generative sense and actually). If you read the bible in context, the book of Isaiah reads that God creates disaster but since that isn't stated in the book of Genesis it can't mean that it (disaster) is created as the original order of both living and non-living things. However, it is also true that the origin of evil is not written in the book of Genesis.

So to me, God both actually and in generative sense creates good and the illusion of evil. Evil's origins are irrational meant to create confusion and doubt as to the order of things. Numbers: you have rational and irrational ones. However, both these God creates. But to say a rational number is an irrational number is out of the natural order of things. If I always go against anything you say and you were God, that would go against order and law. Iblis and persons who are under its influence are evil and are not under any illusion that God would create. Hence, God allows chaos or evil to exist but it has no power over anything unless God wills (by keeping Iblis not-fully destroyed) and for a time God has allotted for it. But that time will come to pass and the promise of my Lord is true.

That reminds me, how is it that a non-angel (Iblis) can become an angel and yet still remain the author of evil? Has God forgiven satan? (Num. 22:21-22, 1 Kings 21-23; 2 Chron. 18:21-22) God cannot forgive opposition to His Will until it/he/she submits or forgives. God cannot go against His own nature. God cannot create something that goes against his or her own nature.

That is one of the consequences of creating free-will and it wasn't an illusion until Iblis made it so. Hence, only persons who have submitted wholly to God's Will are given a natural free-will.

Despite everything, God may leave something He created that almost-self destroyed alive that had gone against its/his/her own nature while keeping an ongoing nature against his/her/itself and God in an unrepentant way; God's way to keep other present and future creation from self-destruction and restoration in the dunya; that's God's love. But when the time for creation of "evil" has come to pass, He will punish Iblis and whosoever of mankind and Jinn that follows him with a punishment that's unheard of, and the promise of my Lord is true.

Allah knows best.

[mitzi]

mastralvarado;2968352]Salam Mitzi,

You basically mean: God creates good and evil (both in a generative sense and actually). If you read the bible in context, the book of Isaiah reads that God creates disaster but since that isn't stated in the book of Genesis it can't mean that it (disaster) is created as the original order of both living and non-living things. However, it is also true that the origin of evil is not written in the book of Genesis.

…speaking in the sense of the purity and impurities of the soul? At the beginning everything that was created was “Ki Tov”, (That It Was Good) or in a sense “pure”. In Genesis, the law was given, even within the garden and the first command was spoken, to Adam– How do we know this? God commanded man (the 1st commandment) not to eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil (origins of evil – the tree of knowledge of good and evil). So how did the serpent enter into the garden – through the tree? Jewish thinkers, like Maimonides and Nachmanides, accordingly understood Genesis (or this chapter) as a parable; and Saadyah regarded the Serpent as the personification of the sinful tendencies in man, the Yetzer hara, the Evil Imagination. LINK

Thus to say then: The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul. Psalm 19:7. God governs both the heavens and the earth. We know from creation that God is both about justice and mercy. Psalms reminds us that “the Lord is just in all His ways” reading from Isaiah 55 urges us to “turn to the Lord for mercy; to our God, who is generous in forgiving.” Like the Israelites in the desert, He (God) continually forgives man – and . If this wasn’t correct, then why deliver the Torah (Halakha – the law- the path in which to walk) or in another sense the Sharia, (the “way” or the “path refers to the "way" Muslims should live or the "path" they must follow), the sacred text of Islam (the Qur'an), and also the Traditions (Hadith). Giving the attributes:

10. who forgives iniquity ["noseh avon" - "avon" means crooked, bent, twisted, depraved, perverse. This is sin that has affected man's nature. God is willing to forgive this aspect of sin, which has corrupted our very nature],
11. transgression ["pesha" - this is a very strong term for sin. This is sin as open rebellion, deliberate trespass, active rebellion and enmity against God. God is willing to forgive even these high-handed kinds of sins],
12. and sin ["chata-ah" - this is sin that misses the mark. This is aiming for the bulls-eye but missing the target. This is a shortcoming due to not paying enough attention, carelessness, heedlessness and error. God is willing and able to forgive these kinds of sins]. LINK

When reading Genesis, God is giving them (both Adam and Eve) a choice - (blessing and curse) 17. But of the Tree of Knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat of it, for on the day that you eat thereof, you shall surely die." and comparing that with Deuteronomy 30 the passage, "17 If, however, you turn away your hearts and will not listen, but are led astray and adore and serve other gods, 18 I tell you now that you will certainly perish (Genesis 2:17); you will not have a long life on the land which you are crossing the Jordan to enter and occupy. Thus, like Adam and Eve - for disobedience to the law, they were banished from paradise - and in the flex - those who strayed from the law (Mosaic laws) then came the Diaspora. However, God never abandoned His people - nor - will He abandoned those of whom He has chosen.

So the take on this is "I tell you now that you will certainly perish" the verbiage "perish" as in The English word "perish - "to die" (Genesis 2:17) and in John 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish, but have eternal life" (NASB).

((Devarim) Deuteronomy 19, "I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life".....

Originally posted by mastralvarado

So to me, God both actually and in generative sense creates good and the illusion of evil. Evil's origins are irrational meant to create confusion and doubt as to the order of things. Numbers: you have rational and irrational ones. However, both these God creates. But to say a rational number is an irrational number is out of the natural order of things. If I always go against anything you say and you were God, that would go against order and law. Iblis and persons who are under its influence are evil and are not under any illusion that God would create. Hence, God allows chaos or evil to exist but it has no power over anything unless God wills (by keeping Iblis not-fully destroyed) and for a time God has allotted for it. But that time will come to pass and the promise of my Lord is true.

Agree, like Sodom and Gomorrah. God will allow a time for people to change their ways. In Genesis 18 & 19 - Abraham defended the righteous, "5 Far be it from you to do such a thing—to kill the righteous with the wicked, treating the righteous and the wicked alike. Far be it from you! Will not the Judge [g] of all the earth do right?"

Originally posted by mastralvarado
That reminds me, how is it that a non-angel (Iblis) can become an angel and yet still remain the author of evil? Has God forgiven satan? (Num. 22:21-22, 1 Kings 21-23; 2 Chron. 18:21-22) God cannot forgive opposition to His Will until it/he/she submits or forgives. God cannot go against His own nature. God cannot create something that goes against his or her own nature.

If the angels are not physical, and I know some have stated this; but beings of pure light then the angels, would be considered the radiate/ or the light of Gd's glory, "wherever the angel appears the shechina (the divine Presence) appears (Exodus Rabbah 32:9)." Once a angel has lost their statue then doesn't that pure light become full of darkness-the fallen ones (**the Nephilim and are mention twice in the Torah both in Genesis 6 and Numbers 13) no longer have the light of Gd in them and their spiritual appearance (or make up) would change/or change in form, wouldn't this be correct? What make humans so unique is that we have the opportunity to repent (Teshuvah (Return, or Repentance)) which then G-d allows us to erase our sins and also to return back to him, a very generous gift that Gd has given to us. It's the ability to correct our actions and regain our relationship to him.

** The Targum Yerushalmi, which is a Midrash, explains that they were Angels who descended to the Earth. According to this they were called fallen ones because they fell from their heavenly stature. The Ramban explains otherwise, that they were the other children of Adam. Because Adam, the First Man, was the handiwork of G-d, his children were of greater physical stature than their descendants. Because these people were so close to the Creator, they knew that they had no grandfather, they should have been spiritually elevated. Because they didn't live up to their potential they were considered "fallen ones."

Allah knows best.

Yes. Agreed. Take Care

[mitzi]

al-Mumît, God as the destroyer.

Al Muhyi (المحيى) The Giver of Life
Al Mumit (المميت) The Bringer of Death, the Destroyer
# Al Mubdi' (المبدئ) The Producer, Originator, and Initiator of all
# Al Mu'id (المعيد) The Reinstater Who Brings Back All

You're looking at one aspect of God - God is sovereign, meaning He is supreme; all of His creation put together, whether knowingly or unknowingly, cannot thwart His purposes (Psalm 93:1; 95:3; Jeremiah 23:20).

In Isaiah 45:7 (New International Version)

7 I form the light and create darkness,
I bring prosperity and create disaster;
I, the LORD, do all these things.

In the verse "I bring prosperity and create disaster" - this verse could have the same meaning as the Song of Hannah or the Magnificent or Canticle of Mary (Song of Mary - Luke 1:46-55) -

1 Samuel 2:6 "The LORD killeth, and maketh alive: he bringeth down to the grave, and bringeth up."

"The LORD kills, and he gives life. ]He makes people go down to the grave, and he raises them up again."

The above verse list all "4" aspects of God - as down on this list:

Al Muhyi (المحيى) The Giver of Life
Al Mumit (المميت) The Bringer of Death, the Destroyer
Al Mubdi' (المبدئ) The Producer, Originator, and Initiator of all
Al Mu'id (المعيد) The Reinstater Who Brings Back All

****
Al Rahim (الرحيم) The Most Merciful
Al Malik (الملك) The King, The Sovereign
Al Ghafur (الغفور) The All Forgiving
Al Muqit (المقيت) The Nourisher
# Al Basir (البصير) The All Seeing
# Al Hakam (الحكم) The Judge, the Arbitrator
# Al-'Adl (العدل) The Utterly Just
# Al Latif (اللطيف) The Subtly Kind
# Al Khabir (الخبير) The All Aware
# Al Halim (الحليم) The Forbearing, the Indulgent
# Al 'Azim (العظيم) The Magnificent, the Infinite


ALLAH (الله) The God


"The LORD maketh poor, and maketh rich: he bringeth low, and lifteth up."

"He raiseth up the poor out of the dust, and lifteth up the beggar from the dunghill, to set them among princes, and to make them inherit the throne of glory: for the pillars of the earth are the LORD's, and he hath set the world upon them."


Again, there is a dualism in each verse that is being mentioned. But the end statement tells all - I, the LORD, do all these things. Isn't that the point of Rosh HaShanah and Yom Kippur

Not to be repetitive: "Further, it is difficult to contemplate and fully know the substance of God; who fashions things changeable, yet without any change in Himself, and creates things temporal, yet without any temporal movement in Himself. And it is necessary, therefore, to purge our minds, in order to be able to see ineffably that which is ineffable; whereto not having yet attained, we are to be nourished by faith, and led by such ways as are more suited to our capacity, that we may be rendered apt and able to comprehend it. And hence the Apostle says, that "in Christ indeed are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge;" [Colossians 2:3]"

[OneSizeFit]

Al Muhyi (المحيى) The Giver of Life
Al Mumit (المميت) The Bringer of Death, the Destroyer
# Al Mubdi' (المبدئ) The Producer, Originator, and Initiator of all
# Al Mu'id (المعيد) The Reinstater Who Brings Back All

You're looking at one aspect of God - God is sovereign, meaning He is supreme; all of His creation put together, whether knowingly or unknowingly, cannot thwart His purposes (Psalm 93:1; 95:3; Jeremiah 23:20).

In Isaiah 45:7 (New International Version)

7 I form the light and create darkness,
I bring prosperity and create disaster;
I, the LORD, do all these things.

In the verse "I bring prosperity and create disaster" - this verse could have the same meaning as the Song of Hannah or the Magnificent or Canticle of Mary (Song of Mary - Luke 1:46-55) -

1 Samuel 2:6 "The LORD killeth, and maketh alive: he bringeth down to the grave, and bringeth up."

"The LORD kills, and he gives life. ]He makes people go down to the grave, and he raises them up again."

The above verse list all "4" aspects of God - as down on this list:

Al Muhyi (المحيى) The Giver of Life
Al Mumit (المميت) The Bringer of Death, the Destroyer
Al Mubdi' (المبدئ) The Producer, Originator, and Initiator of all
Al Mu'id (المعيد) The Reinstater Who Brings Back All

****
Al Rahim (الرحيم) The Most Merciful
Al Malik (الملك) The King, The Sovereign
Al Ghafur (الغفور) The All Forgiving
Al Muqit (المقيت) The Nourisher
# Al Basir (البصير) The All Seeing
# Al Hakam (الحكم) The Judge, the Arbitrator
# Al-'Adl (العدل) The Utterly Just
# Al Latif (اللطيف) The Subtly Kind
# Al Khabir (الخبير) The All Aware
# Al Halim (الحليم) The Forbearing, the Indulgent
# Al 'Azim (العظيم) The Magnificent, the Infinite


ALLAH (الله) The God


"The LORD maketh poor, and maketh rich: he bringeth low, and lifteth up."

"He raiseth up the poor out of the dust, and lifteth up the beggar from the dunghill, to set them among princes, and to make them inherit the throne of glory: for the pillars of the earth are the LORD's, and he hath set the world upon them."


Again, there is a dualism in each verse that is being mentioned. But the end statement tells all - I, the LORD, do all these things. Isn't that the point of Rosh HaShanah and Yom Kippur

Not to be repetitive: "Further, it is difficult to contemplate and fully know the substance of God; who fashions things changeable, yet without any change in Himself, and creates things temporal, yet without any temporal movement in Himself. And it is necessary, therefore, to purge our minds, in order to be able to see ineffably that which is ineffable; whereto not having yet attained, we are to be nourished by faith, and led by such ways as are more suited to our capacity, that we may be rendered apt and able to comprehend it. And hence the Apostle says, that "in Christ indeed are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge;" [Colossians 2:3]"

No offense but what is your point? I believe in a just God, sometimes justice requires destruction. Sometimes to build you have to destroy, etc, etc.

[OneSizeFit]

Salam Mitzi,

That reminds me, how is it that a non-angel (Iblis) can become an angel and yet still remain the author of evil? Has God forgiven satan? (Num. 22:21-22, 1 Kings 21-23; 2 Chron. 18:21-22) God cannot forgive opposition to His Will until it/he/she submits or forgives. God cannot go against His own nature. God cannot create something that goes against his or her own nature.

What is Iblis? A Jinn or Angel?

[mitzi]

No offense but what is your point? I believe in a just God, sometimes justice requires destruction. Sometimes to build you have to destroy, etc, etc.

No offense taken....but, when you brought up that particular verse out of Isaiah, it's not so much as taking a look at one of the verses and saying that He (God) is the God of destruction - but looking at the other verses in Isaiah as well- and knowing that God restores back to life. Again, there is a dualism in each verse that is being mentioned. But the end statement tells all - I, the LORD, do all these things.

Yes, I agree, that sometimes justice requires destruction but also God restores back to life again. He is not the God of the dead but the God of the living - many prophets have written this about Him. The Resurrection - is a good example. God's power is to raise the dead from the grave in a resurrection - the resurrection can be in a sense from sin, the soul. 1 Cor 15:55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory? 1 Cor 15:56 The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law. 1 Cor 15:57 But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

[mitzi]

What is Iblis? A Jinn or Angel?

Iblis
by Alan G. Hefner
Iblis is the name for the devil in the Qur'an. Although the term "devil" comes from the Greek diabolos, the Muslims derived the name from the Arabic, balasa, "he despaired," which can be interpreted "despaired of the mercy of God" but he is also al-Shairan, Satan, and "the enemy of God." The latter aspect of Satan is a commonly shared belief of both Muslims and Christians. According to one tradition, when Allah ordered the angels to bow down to the newly created man, Adam, Iblis refused to do so because he, being made of fire, thought himself superior to a creature made of earth. He continues tempting humans, especially through the whisper (waswas, "he whispered") and false suggestion (haiif). In the end, it is believed, he will be cast into Jahannam (Hell). Another commonly shared belief held by both religions is that the universal existence of evil in personal lives is usually experienced as a consequence of a personal agent, the devil.

Although both Satan and al-Shairan are identified, Shairan also has a distinct existence, perhaps as the leader of the jinns, a personification of temptation. This coincides with the Muslim belief that each individual is accompanied by two personal spiritual entities; an angel records all the good deeds the person performs, and a shairan who records the bad deeds.

************

Information for those who don't know.

[mitzi]

What is Iblis? A Jinn or Angel?

If the angels are not physical, and I know some have stated this; but beings of pure light then the angels, would be considered the radiate/ or the light of Gd's glory, "wherever the angel appears the shechina (the divine Presence) appears (Exodus Rabbah 32:9)." Once an angel has lost their statue then doesn't that pure light become full of darkness-the fallen ones (**the Nephilim and are mention twice in the Torah both in Genesis 6 and Numbers 13) no longer have the light of Gd in them and their spiritual appearance (or make up) would change/or change in form, wouldn't this be correct? What make humans so unique is that we have the opportunity to repent (Teshuvah (Return, or Repentance)) which then G-d allows us to erase our sins and also to return back to him, a very generous gift that Gd has given to us. It's the ability to correct our actions and regain our relationship to him.

[mitzi]

No offense but what is your point? I believe in a just God, sometimes justice requires destruction. Sometimes to build you have to destroy, etc, etc.

One more point:


So the take on this is "I tell you now that you will certainly perish" the verbiage "perish" as in The English word "perish - "to die" (Genesis 2:17) or to destroy and in John 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish, but have eternal life" (NASB).

In ((Devarim) Deuteronomy 19, Mose states "I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life"...

In the last sentence in that verse, Moses tells the Israelites to chose "Life" - and in John 3, doesn't it say the same thing?Don't just choose "life" but choose the "Eternal Life" -"Choose life, not death!" (2 Kings 18:32)

[OneSizeFit]

If the angels are not physical, and I know some have stated this; but beings of pure light then the angels, would be considered the radiate/ or the light of Gd's glory, "wherever the angel appears the shechina (the divine Presence) appears (Exodus Rabbah 32:9)." Once an angel has lost their statue then doesn't that pure light become full of darkness-the fallen ones (**the Nephilim and are mention twice in the Torah both in Genesis 6 and Numbers 13) no longer have the light of Gd in them and their spiritual appearance (or make up) would change/or change in form, wouldn't this be correct? What make humans so unique is that we have the opportunity to repent (Teshuvah (Return, or Repentance)) which then G-d allows us to erase our sins and also to return back to him, a very generous gift that Gd has given to us. It's the ability to correct our actions and regain our relationship to him.

My point was, in the Quran, in the Cow Surah, Allah commands the Angels to worship Adam, but according to Islamic doctrine Iblis/Satan was a Jinn, so why was he punished for not prostrating to Adam? Additionally, Iblis then complains that Allah deceived him, hence he will deceive men in turn...strange.

What's also odd in the same Surah, is that is supposed to be the angel Gabriel speaking, saying "we commanded the angels", so then there is a division of angels that are one with Allah, and another that have some sort of free will?

[mitzi]

My point was, in the Quran, in the Cow Surah, Allah commands the Angels to worship Adam, but according to Islamic doctrine Iblis/Satan was a Jinn, so why was he punished for not prostrating to Adam? Additionally, Iblis then complains that Allah deceived him, hence he will deceive men in turn...strange.

What's also odd in the same Surah, is that is supposed to be the angel Gabriel speaking, saying "we commanded the angels", so then there is a division of angels that are one with Allah, and another that have some sort of free will?

Hi One Size Fit:

Right now, I'm running some errands so I'll be back on line later. If you read Deuteronomy 32 and 33 - this doesn't speak about the division of angels but about the division of men (people) and nations. The controversy is over the last line "according to the sons of Israel". I always understood this to be that angels (or was it archangel) were assigned to oversee man - Remember the verse out of Genesis (Genesis 11:1-9) "7 Come, let us go down and confuse their language so they will not understand". See the verse that I'm referring too:


8 When the Most High gave the nations their inheritance,
when he divided all mankind,
he set up boundaries for the peoples
according to the number of the sons of Israel.

[mastralvarado]

Auzubillahi minash shaytaan nir rajeem, Bismillah Hir-rahman Nir-raheem,

What is Iblis? A Jinn or Angel?

Iblis is a Jinn. It may be that Iblis is a two-fold entity whose materialistic side is Satan and the morally evil side is Iblis. Look at www.overlordsofchaos.com. There, evil is two-fold also. See also surah Al-Hijr, 40-41 and Al-Baqarah, 102, 103.

My point was, in the Quran, in the Cow Surah, Allah commands the Angels to worship Adam, but according to Islamic doctrine Iblis/Satan was a Jinn, so why was he punished for not prostrating to Adam?

Iblis was punished for what came out of his mouth and not because he did not pay heed. For example, if God commanded you to do something but you weren't paying attention to God, you would have grounds to hide your intentional disobedience because God is fully ware of every living thing only on Judgment Day (Yawmid Deen). This is sort of what some Israelis did when they received commands from God (See Surah Ali-Imran 77-80)


He went against Allah (subhanna wa ta'ala)'s spirit of the Hereafter (i.e. Gabriel). Allah (swt) can make better existences than His creatures can dream or imagine. Iblis thought and intentioned otherwise. Hence, in a sense, Iblis is the spirit that antagonizes the "good against evil" dilemma. This "good and evil" in Allah's (swt) purpose of Good is for the grace of His creation . But for Iblis, it is for creation's deception as to God's wisdom and grace.

Grace is forgiveness if you forgive those who offend you. Wisdom is knowing good or bad is from Allah in order to test you and purify you.

Additionally, Iblis then complains that Allah deceived him, hence he will deceive men in turn...strange.

I don't understand why you state this. Please try again.

What's also odd in the same Surah, is that is supposed to be the angel Gabriel speaking, saying "we commanded the angels", so then there is a division of angels that are one with Allah, and another that have some sort of free will?

Angels don't have free will. Some angels might know things before others. Archangels are the one's nearest to Allah (swt).

Hi One Size Fit:

Right now, I'm running some errands so I'll be back on line later. If you read Deuteronomy 32 and 33 - this doesn't speak about the division of angels but about the division of men (people) and nations. The controversy is over the last line "according to the sons of Israel". I always understood this to be that angels (or was it archangel) were assigned to oversee man - Remember the verse out of Genesis (Genesis 11:1-9) "7 Come, let us go down and confuse their language so they will not understand". See the verse that I'm referring too:


8 When the Most High gave the nations their inheritance,
when he divided all mankind,
he set up boundaries for the peoples
according to the number of the sons of Israel.

See this is why the bible cannot be considered fully authorative. God is not the author of confusion nor of doubt. Iblis causes God to question His intention and why do you think this is so?

The only reason why God would confuse the tongues is to disperse a tyrant/despot such as Nimrod. Nations will someday destroy all attempts to enslave them to false gods.

Hence, Babel/Babylon was a test from God to know whether the inhabitant's had learned to believe in the hefty price by resisting temptation that must be paid and in the spirit of the Hereafter, but no so much as to confuse the tongues.

If it's purpose was to confuse the tongues as in Babylon, it can therefore be said that God intentionally divided mankind's languages by allowing them to be divided in order that only one language would prevail, but not to cause confusion.

Which language do you think this is?

Hence tyrants and power-hungry ruler first try to divide even further what God what has allowed to be divided. But in Islam, we all share, despite our language barriers, the belief in true monotheism, true equality and true fraternity unlike freemasonry which just claims to do this and through progressive revelation having at the top and throughout its whole embodiment a negative energy and the one-world government/ religion/ bank whilst thirsting for immortality through alternative means other than a moral nature of high standards, repentance and heavenly Law.

Abdulrahman.org

When Sulaiman lost his kingdom, great numbers from among mankind and the jinn renegaded and followed their lusts. But, when Allah restored to Sulaiman his kingdom and the renegade came to follow the Straight Path once again, Sulaiman seized their holy scriptures which he buried underneath his throne. Shortly after, Sulaiman (Peace be upon him) died. In no time, the men and the Jinn uncovered the buried scriptures and said: This was a book revealed by Allah to Sulaiman who hid it from us. They took it as their religion and Allah the Almighty revealed His Saying: {And when there came to them a Messenger from Allah confirming what was with them, a party of those who were given the Scripture threw away the Book of Allah behind their backs as if they did not know!}. (Al-Baqarah, 101) and they followed what the devils gave out, i.e. musical instruments, play and all that blocks the remembrance of Allah.

© source where applicable

[source: http://abdurrahman.org/character/harut-marut.html]

Because Harut and Marut [102 Al-Baqarah] always warned those who inquired them to learn magic by threatening them with no portion in paradise, this knowledge about a return to paradise came from the Garden of Eden [Genesis 3].

Allah (swt) is the only god in the universe. He is the Sublime, the Majestic, and other ninety-seven attributes plus one that the Madhi will reveal and, in total, one hundred. This leads any person to not confuse jinn with the only true god because jinn can pretend to possess the attributes of God especially omniscience, omnipotence, and omnipresence. Non-Islamic people at the time of Babel, Babylon and today don't have the sufficient wisdom to determine the difference between the occult demons and the true Power of a god that can create the whole earth with just a word.

"Re: God is "plural" in the Qu'ran?"

This leads one to question the morality of this thread because it seeks to question the unicity of the only god of the universe with it's "plural" headline. This headline is more of a statement than a question because no one in their right mind would ask such a question.

However, I'm going to refrain to question the purpose of this thread. But to answer my own questions such as how did angels and demons become synonomous with servanthood to Allah (swt) in the biblical chronicles, here's my answer:

The scribes did not have a word for to differentiate the two or they were deluded into believing that even the origin of evil is from God.

I don't know if dibuk should have been the appropriate reference to the Arabic jinn.




Allah knows best.