Hell. A Poor Motivation For Conversion?

[mickiel]

The Bible does teach that no man is worthy of unquestioning trust. I agree that Satan can attack leaders, but no more or less than Satan will attack you as your own leader. As a member of a church, if I have a bad idea, I have the other members of the church, including some very godly men and women, to help me get back on course. What kind of error-correction safeguards do you have if you walk alone? The Bible gives many examples of how important it is for the people of God to gather and sit under the teaching of qualified men. What makes you exempt?

Well I think people should fellowship, those driven to do that. And those who need to be taught by others, thats just their need. Once you have experienced being taught by the Spirit, there is no longer a need to be taught by others. So thats two different areas one can exist in, if you need to be taught, I see nothingelse that you can do if your in that mode but listen to others.

I am not exempt from anything, I am not called to be a part of a church, my destiny is to walk alone. Its a good thing to know and understand where God wants you. I wish I was called to be in a church or an atmosphere of fellowship, but that just is not for me. My correction comes from God, as does my forgiveness. I don't know him yet, but I know he is there.

Peace.

[mickiel]

hey mick, should we trust completely everything you say?

No, I don't believe we should trust any human complettely in Spiritual matters. Myself included, and I NEVER have asked people to do that with what I say. Never! I NEVER have lifted myself up, and never will. I don't have Gods Spirit, I am not converted, I am nobody, why listen to me?

Peace.

[lilpixieofterror]

Call it what you wish, Christian Pastors complettely rule their churchs, and its important to them to do that.

Funny, many church’s I’ve been to (including the one my parents attend) have a church Constitution and issues such as the budget or hiring a new pastor is discussed and debated, in a public forum. Few, if any, pastors I know ‘rule’ their church’s and many are held accountable by either the other members of their congregation or by a larger church body. Few church’s run like a dictatorship, in which the pastor is the king and everybody has to do what he says.

There may be a few exceptions, but most of them traditionally are " Overlords", and they know it if you don't. This is the funnel that satan uses to pour deception into their membership.

And you know this because you attended a small fraction of the church’s in an area and have determined that all of them are used by ‘Satan’. Humm… interesting.

[Pilgrim]

Well thats three, you said I met a dozen. Admit to exaggeration, or produce the other 9. Full trust should be reserved for God and God alone in Spiritual matters. I maintain that most of Christianity places full trust in their pastors, its traditional. Its an inbred crutch, that they need to help them walk.

Peace.

By producing one I've already shown your assertion was wrong on it's face as you had already met all three of us when you made the assertion. But for the sake of argument: Rogue, Dee Dee Warren, ApologiaNick, Jaltus, The thread started UK Apologist and then Philosophical, The horney, I mean Manwe..., Then there was Ghar, and Mossy, and ZGuy, shall I continue?

You cast people, and in particular Christians, in the image of your own apriori, not as they actually are. To do otherwise would mean you'd have to re evaluate a position your ego won't let you budge on. I feel sorry for you. You are a classic example of a close mind. And the funny thing is you probably think you're a pretty good example of critical thinking.

[mickiel]

By producing one I've already shown your assertion was wrong on it's face as you had already met all three of us when you made the assertion. But for the sake of argument: Rogue, Dee Dee Warren, ApologiaNick, Jaltus, The thread started UK Apologist and then Philosophical, The horney, I mean Manwe..., Then there was Ghar, and Mossy, and ZGuy, shall I continue?

You cast people, and in particular Christians, in the image of your own apriori, not as they actually are. To do otherwise would mean you'd have to re evaluate a position your ego won't let you budge on. I feel sorry for you. You are a classic example of a close mind. And the funny thing is you probably think you're a pretty good example of critical thinking.

I don't think I am a good example of ANY thinking. But I stand by what I believe, and I believe most Christian pastors rule their congregations. And you can " Show" how wrong I am all you wish, pacify yourself. I am not right all the time. My mind is not closed, its just not influenced by Christians.

Peace.

[RBerman]

Well I think people should fellowship, those driven to do that. And those who need to be taught by others, thats just their need. Once you have experienced being taught by the Spirit, there is no longer a need to be taught by others. So thats two different areas one can exist in, if you need to be taught, I see nothingelse that you can do if your in that mode but listen to others.

I am not exempt from anything, I am not called to be a part of a church, my destiny is to walk alone. Its a good thing to know and understand where God wants you. I wish I was called to be in a church or an atmosphere of fellowship, but that just is not for me. My correction comes from God, as does my forgiveness. I don't know him yet, but I know he is there.

I am constantly taught by the Spirit, who teaches me in Scripture that the assembly of the saints is not just my peculiar need, but rather is the universal need of Christians everywhere. That's why the Bible describes us as "members of a body" and cautions each member not to imagine that they can do well without the others. If you think God wants something different for you, you are simply mistaken and/or rebelling against the person God has created you to be.

[lilpixieofterror]

Your the one deluted and deceptive, as of this moment, 6 have responded, and • Edited by a Moderator •

Your puffing yourself up, you can't be trusted to be truthful. Neither can your pastors.

Peace.

Do you even know how to read because I never said that.

[mickiel]

Do you even know how to read because I never said that.

Well I apoligise if I misquoted you, I don't like doing that, or it being done to me.

Peace.

[mickiel]

I am constantly taught by the Spirit, who teaches me in Scripture that the assembly of the saints is not just my peculiar need, but rather is the universal need of Christians everywhere. That's why the Bible describes us as "members of a body" and cautions each member not to imagine that they can do well without the others. If you think God wants something different for you, you are simply mistaken and/or rebelling against the person God has created you to be.

I admit to being a rebel. And you have no ideal what God wants for me, thats between me and God.

Peace.

[mickiel]

I am constantly taught by the Spirit, who teaches me in Scripture that the assembly of the saints is not just my peculiar need, but rather is the universal need of Christians everywhere. That's why the Bible describes us as "members of a body" and cautions each member not to imagine that they can do well without the others. If you think God wants something different for you, you are simply mistaken and/or rebelling against the person God has created you to be.

I am not Christian, and I cannot be confined to what Christians do and believe.

Peace.

[supton]

What's 100% trust?

I trust my pastor not to repeat what I tell him in private (well, save for potentially illegal activities--but I can't see why I'd tell him those things); I'd also trust him to keep his hands to himself while around my wife and kids. And that he'd not intentionally mislead me. Yet, he's YEC and I'm OEC; I'm undecided on end times theology but I lean towards preterism--he's definately pre-trib. So I don't 100% agree with what he preaches. Yet, if I was hurt, or the house was burning down, I'd have no problem giving him a call, as I know I can "trust" him.



As for the kingdom of God and kingdom of heaven, how do we know Jesus was talking about an other-world in his various pericopes? Certainly there was "treasures in heaven" we were to work towards; but I'm not sure all the stories were about things to come after death. Wide is the road that leads to destruction in this life, too.

[RBerman]

I admit to being a rebel. And you have no ideal what God wants for me, thats between me and God. I am not Christian, and I cannot be confined to what Christians do and believe.

It is between you and God in the sense that I am not accountable for you, or vice versa. That doesn't mean that God has not spoken on these issues, however. I encourage you to read the Bible, 1 John might be a good place for you to start if you'd like to see what God has to say not only to me, but to you, and to everyone.

[mickiel]

It is between you and God in the sense that I am not accountable for you, or vice versa. That doesn't mean that God has not spoken on these issues, however. I encourage you to read the Bible, 1 John might be a good place for you to start if you'd like to see what God has to say not only to me, but to you, and to everyone.

I do not take advice from Christians, but thank you for your concern. The way God deals with me is different, I only need to understand that, nobodyelse. You have no ideal how much I read the bible, nor do you know what God is doing with me.

Nor is it your business. I do not like the way Christians assume they know how others should deal with God, or how he is dealing with them.

Peace.

[rogue06]

And yet it is fine when you're the one doing the assuming and presuming?

[Teluog]

not to mention that we have the Scriptures that give us principles about how the Spirit works in the lives of everyone

hint: God wants the same for all of us, to be remade into the Image of God (through Christ His Son)