America, a Socialist Oligarchy?

[FreezBee]

Originally posted by Da Blonde

Socialist oligarchy = a fancy term for government. All governments are socialist oligarchies.

Men invented government because God required mankind to be accountable for the bloodshed of his fellow man. See Genesis 9:5-6

What has government got to do with that?

The point of government is certainly not to keep anyone accountable for anything considering that most people killed have been killed by governments; the point of government is death and taxes, both obvious inventions of the Devil.

Surely for your lifeblood I will demand an accounting. I will demand an accounting from every animal. And from each man, too, I will demand an accounting for the life of his fellow man.
Whoever sheds the blood of man, by man shall his blood be shed;
for in the image of God has God made man.

Yes, the Devil inderted this into Genesis, while God was busy polishing his toe nails (God's toe nails, not the Devil's).

Up to this point in the Bible there was no mention of any form of government.
Soon after this edict from God, we see that mankind has its first kingdom.

Cush was the father of Nimrod, who grew to be a mighty warrior on the earth. He was a mighty hunter before the Lord; that is why it is said, "Like Nimrod, a mighty hunter before the Lord."
The first centers of his kingdom were Babylon, Erech, Akkad and Calneh, in Shinar. Genesis 10:8-10

Exactly, "a mighty warrior"; that is, one who subdues others, so he can enforce taxation on them.


- FreezBee

[TyRockwell]

What has government got to do with that?

The point of government is certainly not to keep anyone accountable for anything considering that most people killed have been killed by governments; the point of government is death and taxes, both obvious inventions of the Devil.



Yes, the Devil inderted this into Genesis, while God was busy polishing his toe nails (God's toe nails, not the Devil's).



Exactly, "a mighty warrior"; that is, one who subdues others, so he can enforce taxation on them.


- FreezBee

Are you jokingly being silly, or is this normal, for you?

[FreezBee]

Are you jokingly being silly, or is this normal, for you?

I am not joking, and I am not being silly, and that's normal for me.

- FreezBee

[TyRockwell]

What has government got to do with that?

The point of government is certainly not to keep anyone accountable for anything considering that most people killed have been killed by governments; the point of government is death and taxes, both obvious inventions of the Devil.

The point of government is exactly what God said it was to be in Genesis 9:5-6.
He demanded that mankind must be accountable for the bloodshed of his fellow man. It follows, by necessity, that mankind had to punish unjust bloodshed by bloodshed. This requires a systematic finding of facts and a fair judgment to be made, in short, a legal system.

Judicial punishments were in proportion to the severity of bloodshed. For example, death was not administered to a perpetrator who wounded another person's eyes or teeth. The amount of punishment was "an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth."

Taxes were only levied to cover the costs of administering justice, capturing evil-doers, and funding an armed military and civilian defence against agressors.

This system was approved and anointed by God, as Paul said in Romans 13:1-8.

1 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God. 2 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation. 3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same: 4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil. 5 Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake. 6 For for this cause pay ye tribute also: for they are God's ministers, attending continually upon this very thing. 7 Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due; custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour.
Romans 13:1-7 (KJV)

Yes, the Devil inderted this into Genesis, while God was busy polishing his toe nails (God's toe nails, not the Devil's).

Genesis is the word OF God. In this usage, "OF" means "From." The word from God is not the word from the devil, nor was a word from the devil inserted into God's word overtly or secretly.

The record, thoroughly attested to by many witnesses, is that Genesis and the rest of the Law was delivered by God to Moses, who wrote what he was instructed to write.

You are not equal to, or greater than Moses.

Exactly, "a mighty warrior"; that is, one who subdues others, so he can enforce taxation on them.

The word "warrior" is not the meaning in the Hebrew text. It says he was a giant, or a mighty man. Then it goes on to say, twice, that Nimrod was a "mighty hunter before the Lord."

His skill as a "hunter" was integral to the role of capturing or defeating men to bring them to justice. The fact that he was "before the Lord," shows God's approval. God ordained government as a means of establishing order and justice, protection and defence against bloodshed and evil-doers.God is the author of order, and not of chaos.

Genesis chapter 6 explains God's reasons for the "Flood of Noah." God explains that He was grieved with men's "evil thoughts continually," men's unrighteousness and corruption. God said that His Spirit will not put up with mankind's evil, wickedness and corruption. God is the author of order, and not of chaos, and ordained government to deter bloodshed and corruption and to punish those who do evil and who unjustly shed men's blood; for men were created in the image of God.

[FreezBee]

The point of government is exactly what God said it was to be in Genesis 9:5-6.
He demanded that mankind must be accountable for the bloodshed of his fellow man. It follows, by necessity, that mankind had to punish unjust bloodshed by bloodshed.

Why? Was the blood of Cain shed as punishment for Cain killing Abel? No; rather God protected Cain!

This requires a systematic finding of facts and a fair judgment to be made, in short, a legal system.

And where does a government fit in here?

Does a government systematically find facts? No; a government systematically hides facts!

Does a government make fair judgments? No; a government does not make fair judgment: it makes the judgments that will increase its own power over the people.


Ty, I know you sell coffee, and appareently you drink it yourself too. I don't know, what you put inhto that coffee, but it appears to be some strong stuff that makes you hallucinate.

Stop drinking and wake up!

Governments ar of the Devil. Just wake up and look around you. Each and every government spreads death and taxes to the extent that the people do not oppose it!

Get your gun and let's go out and liberate the world from the curse of governments! When will you be ready to join the revolution?


- FreezBee

[Da Blonde]

Does a government systematically find facts? No; a government systematically hides facts!

Does a government make fair judgments? No; a government does not make fair judgment: it makes the judgments that will increase its own power over the people.

In those things, a government is no different from a corporation or a church.

[FreezBee]

In those things, a government is no different from a corporation or a church.

Of course it isn't, and that's the key point.

A government may, officially, be instituted to sort out problems between the citizenry, but you cannot prevent it from getting interests of its own.

I live in Denmark, and according to Danish law, a citizen that causes the government to loose capital is punishable. What capital interests can a government have towards the citizens? When a government has interests of its own, it is no longer a government, but a private enterprise with no more right to exact taxes than any other private enterprise.


- FreezBee

[Da Blonde]

Of course it isn't, and that's the key point.

A government may, officially, be instituted to sort out problems between the citizenry, but you cannot prevent it from getting interests of its own.

I live in Denmark, and according to Danish law, a citizen that causes the government to loose capital is punishable. What capital interests can a government have towards the citizens? When a government has interests of its own, it is no longer a government, but a private enterprise with no more right to exact taxes than any other private enterprise.


- FreezBee

Those Danes are pretty smart, all right.

[FreezBee]

Those Danes are pretty smart, all right.

Well, actually the Germans call us "Die dumme Dänen" ("The dumb Danes").

- FreezBee

[Da Blonde]

Well, actually the Germans call us "Die dumme Dänen" ("The dumb Danes").

- FreezBee

What do you expect from a culture overcome with a cleanliness fetish?

[FreezBee]

What do you expect from a culture overcome with a cleanliness fetish?

Yeah, I had thought about it that way

- FreezBee

[TyRockwell]

A government may, officially, be instituted to sort out problems between the citizenry, but you cannot prevent it from getting interests of its own.

I live in Denmark, and according to Danish law, a citizen that causes the government to loose capital is punishable. What capital interests can a government have towards the citizens? When a government has interests of its own, it is no longer a government, but a private enterprise with no more right to exact taxes than any other private enterprise.


- FreezBee

You've just made a good case for LIMITED government, and against the current 'progress' toward socialism; oligarchy or otherwise.

[Da Blonde]

Freezbee said "When a government has interests of its own, it is no longer a government, but a private enterprise with no more right to exact taxes than any other private enterprise." I'm not so sure this is accurate. It may not be your favored type of government but it remains a government nevertheless. Governments have been entraprenneurial since Noah built the ark at least.

[TyRockwell]

Freezbee said "When a government has interests of its own, it is no longer a government, but a private enterprise with no more right to exact taxes than any other private enterprise." I'm not so sure this is accurate. It may not be your favored type of government but it remains a government nevertheless. Governments have been entraprenneurial since Noah built the ark at least.

Governments only began in Genesis 10:10, with Nimrod's kingdom, after the Flood. They had a very limited mandate; to deter and punish murder, bloodshed and violence. God had required that mankind be accountable for the life of his fellow man. Genesis 9:5-6

There was a self-evident need for protection, defence, and punishment; nothing entraprenneurial about it; at least in its God-given mission.

[Kelp]

How do you figure, "Nimrod began a kingdom" translates to 1. "There was no government before the flood" 2. "God supported Nimrod's endeavor." and 3. "God intended guilt of murder to be exacted by a government."?