Originally posted by Starlight
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Apologetics 301 Guidelines
If you think this is the area where you tell everyone you are sorry for eating their lunch out of the fridge, it probably isn't the place for you
This forum is open discussion between atheists and all theists to defend and debate their views on religion or non-religion. Please respect that this is a Christian-owned forum and refrain from gratuitous blasphemy. VERY wide leeway is given in range of expression and allowable behavior as compared to other areas of the forum, and moderation is not overly involved unless necessary. Please keep this in mind. Atheists who wish to interact with theists in a way that does not seek to undermine theistic faith may participate in the World Religions Department. Non-debate question and answers and mild and less confrontational discussions can take place in General Theistics.
Forum Rules: Here
This forum is open discussion between atheists and all theists to defend and debate their views on religion or non-religion. Please respect that this is a Christian-owned forum and refrain from gratuitous blasphemy. VERY wide leeway is given in range of expression and allowable behavior as compared to other areas of the forum, and moderation is not overly involved unless necessary. Please keep this in mind. Atheists who wish to interact with theists in a way that does not seek to undermine theistic faith may participate in the World Religions Department. Non-debate question and answers and mild and less confrontational discussions can take place in General Theistics.
Forum Rules: Here
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Pascal's Wager: What Have I Lost?
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostThere are numerous self-aware species.
All self-aware creatures, including dolphins, are aware of what behaviours will or will not be tolerated by the group, and this constitutes the group's moral code of right and wrong. So why don’t dolphins get redeemed?
Even little children know what behaviors will be tolerated or not, but they don't understand "right and wrong" in a morally culpable sense. Christians believe that children until they reach an age of accountability where they are morally culpable are automatically saved. And they are more intelligent than a dolphin.
Animals will not be condemned to hell, so they do not require redemption. There will be dolphins and other animals in heaven and the new earth, but they are not immortal, so they come and go. They have no eternal soul.
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Originally posted by Sea of red View PostWhat is it with all of these deities so concerned about whether they're worshiped or not? What kind of conciseness could be so ego centered and obsessed with themselves, that they are more concerned with whether they are loved and adored than even the most basic welfare of the world they are responsible for - look around. No person is entitled to love and worship. Not your partner, not your parents, not your friends, not your children, and not even God. Every relationship is based on each persons presence within that relationship, and what they bring to the table - not if they are related in some way.
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostBehaviour that consciously chooses between what is acceptable or unacceptable to the group shows the existence of a moral code within that group.
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostWhat is ridiculous is that the "Creator and Upholder and Sustainer" of the universe DEMANDS love and worship.
Well I'm sure that Hume would have been be devastated by your assessment.
Do parents demand their children love them? Are the children happier when they do love their parents and live in harmony in the family?
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Amen, Sparko! God does not need nor crave our worship. Just like most atheists I would not be comfortable with a god who needed my praise and worship. It is to our benefit to worship and praise the true loving God. This is true for a few reasons.Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?
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Originally posted by Jedidiah View PostAmen, Sparko! God does not need nor crave our worship. Just like most atheists I would not be comfortable with a god who needed my praise and worship. It is to our benefit to worship and praise the true loving God. This is true for a few reasons.Middle-of-the-road swing voter. Feel free to sway my opinion.
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Originally posted by Yttrium View PostOut of curiosity, with that statement in mind, I'm interested in hearing your take on Jesus' first commandment. If God doesn't crave worship, why would He command it?Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?
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Originally posted by Jedidiah View PostAmen, Sparko! God does not need nor crave our worship. Just like most atheists I would not be comfortable with a god who needed my praise and worship. It is to our benefit to worship and praise the true loving God. This is true for a few reasons.
Mere mortal fathers don't "command" their children to love, it has to be earned.Last edited by Tassman; 04-26-2017, 11:06 PM.“He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostHe demands it. "Teacher, which commandment is the greatest in the Law?” Jesus declared, “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’
Mere mortal fathers don't "demand" love, it has to be earned.
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Originally posted by Sparko View PostBecause dolphins are not under the Law and don't require redemption.
They also don't have immortal souls
and are not created in the image of God.
They are not condemned so they don't require redemption.
Even little children know what behaviors will be tolerated or not, but they don't understand "right and wrong" in a morally culpable sense.
Christians believe that children until they reach an age of accountability where they are morally culpable are automatically saved. And they are more intelligent than a dolphin.
Animals will not be condemned to hell, so they do not require redemption. There will be dolphins and other animals in heaven and the new earth, but they are not immortal, so they come and go.
They have no eternal soul.“He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostWhy aren’t dolphins under the Law?
Neither do humans. Dualism is logically incoherent.
Gods are created in our own image, always have been.
You mean they didn’t eat forbidden fruit.
Children are socially conditioned as to what society considers “right or wrong, just as are lesser social species. Same process! All social species are genetically predisposed to learn and obey the rules of the group.
Nice of God.
You know there will be dolphins in heaven do you?
What is your evidence for the existence of “eternal souls’?
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Originally posted by Sparko View Postbecause of your admission in the other thread that no evidence is good enough for you, I won't be wasting my time arguing with your trolling.Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.
MM: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
MM on covid-19: We're talking about an illness with a better than 99.9% rate of survival.
seer: I believe that so called 'compassion' [for starving Palestinian kids] maybe a cover for anti Semitism, ...
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Originally posted by Roy View PostDoes that mean you won't be expounding on Heaven's dolphinarium?
Heaven is not going to be us flying around on clouds in the sky playing harps. The bible says that God is going to renew the Earth and make it into a paradise and then the heavenly city will come down to Earth and God will dwell with us. That means we will be living on Earth, along with everything that entails: trees, houses, animals, birds, dolphins, schnauzers, horses, monkeys, chimps, etc.
Basically it will be what the Earth would have been if Adam and Eve had never sinned in the first place.
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