Pascal's Wager: What Have I Lost?

[37818]

. . . even that God exists.

What has to be shown to exist is not God. But rather, what is God, is God. A principal part of the concept of God is that He is omnipresent.

The Apostle Paul,
. . . For in Him we live, and move, and have our being; . . .

[Tassman]

What has to be shown to exist is not God. But rather, what is God, is God. A principal part of the concept of God is that He is omnipresent.

The Apostle Paul,
. . . For in Him we live, and move, and have our being; . . .

How do you know that God is "omnipresent"?

[37818]

How do you know that God is "omnipresent"?

God is omnipresent or is not God. Your idea of God is lame.

[JimL]

What has to be shown to exist is not God. But rather, what is God, is God. A principal part of the concept of God is that He is omnipresent.

The Apostle Paul,
. . . For in Him we live, and move, and have our being; . . .

Seems Paul was a pantheist.

[37818]

Seems Paul was a pantheist.

Not by any means. God is omnipresent. That truth does not require pantheism to be true.

[Sparko]

Certainly! Just as soon as you show me substantive evidence that God directly created humans or even that God exists. When you do this I will point you in the direction of the available documents and artefacts that show beyond reasonable doubt that George Washington existed.

You made the claim. back it up.

In fact, you have done NOTHING to personally test your beliefs. You just believe what you have read and take it as truth. You worship at the altar of science, yet you don't even bother to check out for yourself the evidence. You have never repeated an experiment, nor can you even do the math or chemistry. You just believe. You are a fundy.

[JimL]

Not by any means. God is omnipresent. That truth does not require pantheism to be true.

Well it may be that the universe is omnipresent, and if you take Pauls words literally, it is the universe that we live in, the universe that we move in, and the universe that we have our being in. Thats pantheism! Perhaps Paul was ad-mixing the philosophy of the times with his religious beliefs.

[37818]

Well it may be that the universe is omnipresent, and if you take Pauls words literally, it is the universe that we live in, the universe that we move in, and the universe that we have our being in. Thats pantheism! Perhaps Paul was ad-mixing the philosophy of the times with his religious beliefs.

No again. The Universe is comprised of many things. If the universe is defined as everything that exists, it would have that which is omnipresent as only a part of it. Not all of it.

[37818]

There is not a shred of substantive evidence that God directly created humans or even that God exists. OTOH there is considerable evidence supporting Evolution and Common Descent, namely that all living organisms on Earth are descended from a common ancestor. This is beyond reasonable doubt.

Well, you reject the evidence that God did anything.

[Sparko]

Christianity is not pantheistic. It is panentheistic.

[JonathanL]

Christianity is not pantheistic. It is panentheistic.

JimL: theres only a two letter difference between pantheistic and panentheistic, so they're basically the same thing.

[Tassman]

Well, you reject the evidence that God did anything.

There is no "evidence that god did anything", or that such an entity exists.

[Sparko]

JimL: theres only a two letter difference between pantheistic and panentheistic, so they're basically the same thing.

exactly. Just like there is a one letter difference between theist and atheist so that makes JimL a religious nut.

[JimL]

No again. The Universe is comprised of many things. If the universe is defined as everything that exists, it would have that which is omnipresent as only a part of it. Not all of it.

Well actually that doesn't make a lick of sense, if all things are nothing more than parts of one and the same thing, all comprised of the same fundamental substance, then that it is omnipresent is just descriptive of the whole. For instance, fundamentally, all things are comprised of energy/matter, and energy/matter, in so far as the universe is infinite, is omnipresent.
You describe the christian god the same way, three gods in one, comprised of many attributes. Attributes are descriptive of the whole, even if the whole can be conceived of as being made of parts.

[Sparko]

Well actually that doesn't make a lick of sense, if all things are nothing more than parts of one and the same thing, all comprised of the same fundamental substance, then that it is omnipresent is just descriptive of the whole. For instance, fundamentally, all things are comprised of energy/matter, and energy/matter, in so far as the universe is infinite, is omnipresent.
You describe the christian god the same way, three gods in one, comprised of many attributes. Attributes are descriptive of the whole, even if the whole can be conceived of as being made of parts.

God exists everywhere in the universe, and everywhere outside of the universe. He is not the universe. He existed before the universe was created, and he created it.

Panenthesim.jpg