There's No England Now...

[Meh Gerbil]

What happened to the idea that morality is taught in the home?
It appears that ridiculous misdirection has been abandoned.

[Mountain Man]

On what basis do you conclude this is a delusion and denial? You don't cite any evidence for this that I see. I don't see what's particularly unreasonable about the idea that lower stigma towards you would reduce rates of depression.

On the basis that after every social victory, homosexuals find themselves just as miserable as before. It's impossible to live in sin and be truly happy.

[Darth Executor]

Not because of immigration as we need to help genuine refugees.

You don't have to bring them to britain to help them.

[Darth Executor]

On what basis do you conclude this is a delusion and denial? You don't cite any evidence for this that I see. I don't see what's particularly unreasonable about the idea that lower stigma towards you would reduce rates of depression.

There's no evidence typical gay issues are caused by stigma in the first place. We've all been through this dicussion before, many of the ills are higher in more "tolerant" countries. Gays are mental, which causes all sorts of issues, and progressives blame those issues on Christians. That's the scam.

[Terraceth]

On the basis that after every social victory, homosexuals find themselves just as miserable as before.

Can you provide evidence that they currently are "just as miserable" as they were compared to, say, two decades ago, i.e. prior to those various social victories?

[Starlight]

So it's a completely subjective evaluation that is open to interpretation by the researcher. It sounds like the "cantril scale" can be used to arrive at any conclusion you want.

? Why do you always say things that are the opposite of true?

Here's the part of my post you studiously avoided:

Your points are silly, so I ignored them. You can pick any oppressed group - e.g. blacks or native americans - and find that they have worse outcomes in scientifically measurable ways on some metrics. e.g. more violence, or more domestic abuse, or more substance abuse, or higher prison rates, that sort of thing. But to infer from those results ideas like that they shouldn't marry, or that systematic institutional prejudice against them hasn't heavily contributed to that result, is just silly. Insofar as they do have worse outcomes on some metrics is cause for additional love and kindness and support to be directed toward them. But we know that on other metrics, such people can do just fine, and they can live thriving lives.

Like I said, homosexuals have deluded themselves into thinking that they would finally be happy if only everybody else would change. That's known as denial.

What you are doing is known as victim-blaming. You're in denial insofar as you try to avoid the responsibility for the result of your own attitudes and actions, because it is the stigma and prejudice perpetuated by evil people like you that causes what suffering these people do experience.

And since when did court testimony trump scientific studies?

Um, dude, this is the world's biggest scientific institutions testifying to the courts about the scientific studies that have been done.

Here's another post of mine that you apparently ignored:

I should probably put you on ignore in general to be honest. Most minority groups have poor outcomes by some metrics, and this is directly related to the levels of social prejudice and stigma they experience. Instead of engaging in victim-blaming, why don't you more constructively stop oppressing them and stop stigmatizing them, and thus stop causing the poor outcomes you're complaining about?

[Starlight]

There's no evidence typical gay issues are caused by stigma in the first place.

It's the primary view in the scientific community, as the American Medical Association and the American Psychological Association and the American Anthropological Association testified to the US Supreme Court. Because that is what all the evidence points to. Obviously proving causality rather than mere correlation is one of the harder parts of science, but there are indeed extensive reasons and many studies suggesting the link between the stigma and suffering is causal.

We've all been through this dicussion before, many of the ills are higher in more "tolerant" countries.

Here's a quite good international study on these issues. They surveyed 115,000 gay men from across most of the world's countries. While it was an online survey, their questions seem quite good and extensive. Here are the questions they asked to measure the amount of 'tolerance' the gay men perceived their society to have:
Gay stigma.jpg
Those answers can then be translated to a single scale ranging from 0 (most homophobic society possible) to 100 (most tolerant society possible). They find that Iceland, Norway, Denmark, Sweden, Israel, Canada, New Zealand, etc are currently the most tolerant societies (scoring 70-85), while Egypt, Nigeria, Ethiopia, Uzbekistan, and Uganda were at the bottom (scoring 15-20).

They then used on of the standard life-satisfaction questionnaires that asked 5 standard questions...

Question: “How would you describe your life?”
5 items: “So far I have got the important things I want in life.”, “The conditions of my life are excellent.”, “I am
satisfied with my life.”, “If I could live my life over, I would change almost nothing”, “In most ways, my life is close
to my ideal.”
Options: 7-point scale from “Strongly disagree” to “Strongly agree”.

And then they graphed the social tolerance (yellow line) on top of life satisfaction (blue / purple / red):
gay satisfaction.jpg

It doesn't take a genius to spot the correlation in that chart! In countries where the amount of social tolerance is higher (yellow line is higher), gay people are happier and more satisfied with their lives (more blue, less red),. Same with the other parts of the world (see the linked PDF) though their sample sizes aren't as good for many non-European countries.

Gays are mental, which causes all sorts of issues, and progressives blame those issues on Christians.

You're mental.

[One Bad Pig]

I'm impressed, in spite of myself, that seer can get 9 pages of discussion out of an obviously click-bait title.

The Jerk better be taking notes.

[Starlight]

There's a difference between what you claim here and what the article describes as "promotion of LGBT+ matters for all schools from nursery throughout all phases of state education". That's going kind of beyond just letting people know something exists to actively promoting it and starting from the age of 2 (in what way does any of this concern a 2 year old?).

I find "promote" to be a trigger-word for conservatives on these issues. All it tends to mean in liberal or educational usage is 'mentioning' or 'including in the curriculum' or 'teaching facts about'. Whereas conservatives seem to have a (mis)conception of education that is heavily biased towards the idea of indoctrinating kids with moral values, and to them the word 'promote' triggers the thought of trying to indoctrinate kids to like LGBT people or (even worse!) to become LGBT.

So there's no difference between what I was stating and what the article was suggesting, but conservatives perceive a difference because they read their own ideas into the word 'promote'.

[Jedidiah]

I'm impressed, in spite of myself, that seer can get 9 pages of discussion out of an obviously click-bait title.

The Jerk better be taking notes.

Is he even around any more?

[Darth Executor]

It's the primary view in the scientific community, as the American Medical Association and the American Psychological Association and the American Anthropological Association testified to the US Supreme Court. Because that is what all the evidence points to. Obviously proving causality rather than mere correlation is one of the harder parts of science, but there are indeed extensive reasons and many studies suggesting the link between the stigma and suffering is causal.

Psychology isn't science, it's a corrupt field overrun by liberal nutjobs who exist only to propagandize progressive garbage.

*retarded garbage*

You are missing the point, which is that many liberal countries have HIGHER gay suicide rates (among other things) that supposedly bigted countries like the US. It's because they're nuts and liberals enabling their mental illness likely excarbeates the despair many of them feel.

[KingsGambit]

I'm impressed, in spite of myself, that seer can get 9 pages of discussion out of an obviously click-bait title.

The Jerk better be taking notes.

A provocative title is the surest way to rack up the posts.

[Starlight]

You are missing the point, which is that many liberal countries have HIGHER gay suicide rates (among other things) that supposedly bigted countries like the US.

Eh? Various studies have found that increased social tolerance lowers the suicide risk for gay people. Dunno where you're getting your nonsense from. Do you just make up crazy stuff for the fun of it?

[One Bad Pig]

Is he even around any more?

I see him lurking now and again.

[Mountain Man]

? Why do you always say things that are the opposite of true?

Your points are silly, so I ignored them. You can pick any oppressed group - e.g. blacks or native americans - and find that they have worse outcomes in scientifically measurable ways on some metrics. e.g. more violence, or more domestic abuse, or more substance abuse, or higher prison rates, that sort of thing. But to infer from those results ideas like that they shouldn't marry, or that systematic institutional prejudice against them hasn't heavily contributed to that result, is just silly. Insofar as they do have worse outcomes on some metrics is cause for additional love and kindness and support to be directed toward them. But we know that on other metrics, such people can do just fine, and they can live thriving lives.

What you are doing is known as victim-blaming. You're in denial insofar as you try to avoid the responsibility for the result of your own attitudes and actions, because it is the stigma and prejudice perpetuated by evil people like you that causes what suffering these people do experience.

Um, dude, this is the world's biggest scientific institutions testifying to the courts about the scientific studies that have been done.

I should probably put you on ignore in general to be honest. Most minority groups have poor outcomes by some metrics, and this is directly related to the levels of social prejudice and stigma they experience. Instead of engaging in victim-blaming, why don't you more constructively stop oppressing them and stop stigmatizing them, and thus stop causing the poor outcomes you're complaining about?

Why did you even bother writing this? You didn't answer a single one of my arguments.